DERRY/LONDONDERRY
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: UK
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As a person who has no interest in CODA except that that it operates a service from my local airport (LPL), I think that Derry airport needs to remain open and viable, Ryanair have used and abused many airports all they are interested in are profit and subsidies, maybe the way forward is for another carrier to move the airport forward with local services to mainland UK and perhaps Dublin and Cork.
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Derry
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No airline is going to move from either Belfast airport to LDY (like Ryanair now seem to have done in the opposite direction) but one might conceivably open additional routes in LDY.
In fact given the number of airlines operating out of the two Belfast airports there is a fair chance that any new operator at LDY might already have operations in Belfast but I don't expect the other two airports to be happy about it. I am sure they would love to see LDY close even if it is only handling 3-400K pax p.a. They certainly don't want to see LDY expanding.
Therefore I wouldn't rule out a legal challenge against whatever is planned for LDY. The £6M subsidy to United Airlines might rule BFS out as a challenger (cause they'd have a brass neck) but that still leaves BHD. In fact maybe BHD are relaxed about the United Airlines subsidy since they can't operate transatlantic routes but they'll not be so relaxed about domestic routes.
It might be worthwhile reminding them that any displaced LDY passengers from a successful legal challenge have to drive past BFS first to get to BHD and furthermore might not be in a mood to reward the airport that took the challenge. Maybe best just to leave well alone!
Here's hoping!
In fact given the number of airlines operating out of the two Belfast airports there is a fair chance that any new operator at LDY might already have operations in Belfast but I don't expect the other two airports to be happy about it. I am sure they would love to see LDY close even if it is only handling 3-400K pax p.a. They certainly don't want to see LDY expanding.
Therefore I wouldn't rule out a legal challenge against whatever is planned for LDY. The £6M subsidy to United Airlines might rule BFS out as a challenger (cause they'd have a brass neck) but that still leaves BHD. In fact maybe BHD are relaxed about the United Airlines subsidy since they can't operate transatlantic routes but they'll not be so relaxed about domestic routes.
It might be worthwhile reminding them that any displaced LDY passengers from a successful legal challenge have to drive past BFS first to get to BHD and furthermore might not be in a mood to reward the airport that took the challenge. Maybe best just to leave well alone!
Here's hoping!
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Ballymena
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What a complete waste of our-(tax payers) money. How much on the runway extension? Now this.At what point is someone in authority going to admit Ldy is never going to be viable due to lack of population. But then if you want to get reelected or you are involved in a vanity project, then you are never going to admit the truth. The money would be better spent on our health service. And the money for United is wrong as well. You know this could open a can of worms from the other airports and why not.
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: N.Ireland
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What we need is an aviation strategy for NI, but unlikely to get that from the folks on the hill
Certainly would like to see LDY doing well, but begs the question that has been asked before....do we need three airports for a population of 1.8 million?
Certainly would like to see LDY doing well, but begs the question that has been asked before....do we need three airports for a population of 1.8 million?
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Derry
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It is neither a waste of money nor a vanity project. Two airports in Belfast is a vanity project!
This is a vital economic tool that will eventually come good. Those that are calling for its closure are like those who supported the railway lines being mothballed 50 years ago.
The subsidy of £2 million per year from the rate payers of Derry City Council is less than the cost of street sweeping. Now that is a total waste of money I object to - if only people would dispose of their litter/cigarettes properly.
The A5 will cost £980M, the A6, £850M. It would take a thousand years of closing CODA to pay for that. And that doesn't even include the roads from Derry to Coleraine or Letterkenny.
As for the health service, the NI NHS would spend £2 million in a morning.
It is unfortunate that it is currently loss making and I fear that the new package will not work because it doesn't address the underlying issue: the airport doesn't work because the economy doesn't work because Stormont won't give the city a fair number of university places nor decentralised jobs nor inward investment because Stormont doesn't want the city to succeed because it doesn't want it competing with Belfast.
That needs resolved first.
This is a vital economic tool that will eventually come good. Those that are calling for its closure are like those who supported the railway lines being mothballed 50 years ago.
The subsidy of £2 million per year from the rate payers of Derry City Council is less than the cost of street sweeping. Now that is a total waste of money I object to - if only people would dispose of their litter/cigarettes properly.
The A5 will cost £980M, the A6, £850M. It would take a thousand years of closing CODA to pay for that. And that doesn't even include the roads from Derry to Coleraine or Letterkenny.
As for the health service, the NI NHS would spend £2 million in a morning.
It is unfortunate that it is currently loss making and I fear that the new package will not work because it doesn't address the underlying issue: the airport doesn't work because the economy doesn't work because Stormont won't give the city a fair number of university places nor decentralised jobs nor inward investment because Stormont doesn't want the city to succeed because it doesn't want it competing with Belfast.
That needs resolved first.
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Ireland
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No, but LDY is not the one to get rid of. Belfast doesn't need 2 airports.
Realistically BFS/BHD are so close together its basically the same geographical area, both have the same immediate market.
I'm still confused to this day on the failings of LDY. Do people from Derry not travel?
Realistically BFS/BHD are so close together its basically the same geographical area, both have the same immediate market.
I'm still confused to this day on the failings of LDY. Do people from Derry not travel?
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Derry
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The Stansted route was not a failure. It carried between 120,000 and 150,000 pax p.a. for 17 years. There'll be plenty of routes at the 2 Belfast airports carrying less.
I even doubt Ryanair were actually making a loss.
Just like Brexit, Ryanair may not leave. There are not precluded from tendering for the PSO. Do you think United Airlines threatening to pull out and the getting £9 million to stay went unnoticed?
I would expect huge public consternation were that to be the outcome but to be fair to Ryanair they feel truly ripped off by APD particularly since it charges twice as much for domestic flights as international flights. I'm with Ryanair on that one because the legislation could have been better worded and avoided this double charge had Westminster cared enough or even noticed.
I even doubt Ryanair were actually making a loss.
Just like Brexit, Ryanair may not leave. There are not precluded from tendering for the PSO. Do you think United Airlines threatening to pull out and the getting £9 million to stay went unnoticed?
I would expect huge public consternation were that to be the outcome but to be fair to Ryanair they feel truly ripped off by APD particularly since it charges twice as much for domestic flights as international flights. I'm with Ryanair on that one because the legislation could have been better worded and avoided this double charge had Westminster cared enough or even noticed.
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Southampton
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Amelia Earhart
In your post 3122 you state that the United subsidy is £6 million but in post 3127 you state that the same subsidy is £9 million!
That's a difference of £3 million, do you actually have the correct amount paid by Stormont as a subsidy to United Airlines for keeping them at BFS or are you guessing?
In your post 3122 you state that the United subsidy is £6 million but in post 3127 you state that the same subsidy is £9 million!
That's a difference of £3 million, do you actually have the correct amount paid by Stormont as a subsidy to United Airlines for keeping them at BFS or are you guessing?
Join Date: Dec 2009
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Amelia Earhart
In your post 3122 you state that the United subsidy is £6 million but in post 3127 you state that the same subsidy is £9 million!
That's a difference of £3 million, do you actually have the correct amount paid by Stormont as a subsidy to United Airlines for keeping them at BFS or are you guessing?
In your post 3122 you state that the United subsidy is £6 million but in post 3127 you state that the same subsidy is £9 million!
That's a difference of £3 million, do you actually have the correct amount paid by Stormont as a subsidy to United Airlines for keeping them at BFS or are you guessing?
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Derry
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Correct and thank you ILS25.
The reason I differentiated was that the £6M is public money whereas the £3M is private money so the owners of that money can do what they like with it.
The subsidies to CODA are all public so for comparison purposes the BFS figure is £6M.
The reason I differentiated was that the £6M is public money whereas the £3M is private money so the owners of that money can do what they like with it.
The subsidies to CODA are all public so for comparison purposes the BFS figure is £6M.
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Derry
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It will not go to a public inquiry but it could go to a judicial review but that would be done in a matter of months so it shouldn't affect the timescale envisaged unless of course the judicial review ruled against......
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: belfast
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A public inquiry would cost more than the subsidy!
It will not go to a public inquiry but it could go to a judicial review but that would be done in a matter of months so it shouldn't affect the timescale envisaged unless of course the judicial review ruled against......
It will not go to a public inquiry but it could go to a judicial review but that would be done in a matter of months so it shouldn't affect the timescale envisaged unless of course the judicial review ruled against......
I would question as to when CoDA will ever become economical viable in the foreseeable future, as already stated we have too many airports for the size of NI/ROI for it to attract new airlines. If BFS or BHD were to close or reduce and it attracted some viable routes then possibly it could work. Its all very well blaming Ryan Air but they are a business and the airport is well aware of this when they offer them deals.
It is to my thinking very much a political decision that is costing the rate payers dearly. As a Strabane rate payer my rates have risen considerably and this is what will continue to cause the situation to be highlighted. For people in the region as far south as Newtownstewart paying increased rates for an airport that does not provide reasonable routing and is nearly as difficult to get to as any of the Belfast ones is a bitter pill to swallow.
I travel internationally to various locations at least twice a month and have not in 30 odd years managed to get more than half a dozen Derry flights that suited.
As I understand it not only is the airport economically a disaster but it seems that there are no separate accounts available to the public for some reason.
One of the intriguing things about CoDA is that it will not allow private aviation outside of the commercial opening hours which severely restricts the local club and helicopter charter company which has a negative impact on the average punter when the hear that you can't have your pleasure flight as the airport is closed on a sunny weekend afternoon, especially if they are one of the ripped off rate payers. .
It is to my thinking very much a political decision that is costing the rate payers dearly. As a Strabane rate payer my rates have risen considerably and this is what will continue to cause the situation to be highlighted. For people in the region as far south as Newtownstewart paying increased rates for an airport that does not provide reasonable routing and is nearly as difficult to get to as any of the Belfast ones is a bitter pill to swallow.
I travel internationally to various locations at least twice a month and have not in 30 odd years managed to get more than half a dozen Derry flights that suited.
As I understand it not only is the airport economically a disaster but it seems that there are no separate accounts available to the public for some reason.
One of the intriguing things about CoDA is that it will not allow private aviation outside of the commercial opening hours which severely restricts the local club and helicopter charter company which has a negative impact on the average punter when the hear that you can't have your pleasure flight as the airport is closed on a sunny weekend afternoon, especially if they are one of the ripped off rate payers. .
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: liverpool
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So with the hand out of 7.5 million from the NI executive and the annual 2.5 million from local ratepayers, that's a whopping 10 million in funding for one year for an airport that is potentially going to provide an average of 1 departure per day. But no, wait, extra funding for PSO routes is also in the pipeline. FFS shut it down. It's not value for money by a long stretch, will never turn a profit and will always remain a drain on public finances. I can't believe it's supporters have the cheek to slag off the United deal. Hey, let's move that flight to Derry. Ultra funding all round. KLM and SN could move too along with the funding Brian Ambrose needed to secure them at Sydenham.
DC_9. I recall your previous incarnation on here. That iteration was just as rational and balanced as the latest one. STILL in Liverpool. STILL aggrieved by the existence of LDY and BHD.
Join Date: Jan 2016
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Cuthere, where I live has no relevance. I am also far away from aggravated. I left the small mindedness of Northern Ireland a long time ago. I'm stating facts that LDY will never be a stand alone commercially viable operation. My comment about Sydenham was tongue in cheek, or can't you understand the meaning of irony. You have slagged of the United deal and have a moronic vendetta against BFS. Glass houses springs to mind.