Get rid of the kleptomaniacs??

That would be called Genocide where I come from..:E

...and you don't have enough bullets.

With A plethora of causative factors revolving around Lack of political will from regional governments and lack of skilled competent human resources or it's proper deployment.

An initial two prong solution to start with:

• Regional integration by aligning civil aviation policies to achieve common objectives.

• Secondly, harmonize ALL regulations within the AFI region.

Pros , cons or Practical Alternatives anyone ?

Regional integration and regulatory harmonization have so far proved elusive concepts in an African context. Successful implementation of such a design plan would require a centralised governing authority such as could sometimes be said to be found in Europe. It seems unlikely that any one country in the sub continent would be prepared to abrogate its authority to another. This hypothesis is illustrated by the OAU (Organization of African Unity) which has, by its lack of political consistency, frequently demonstrated that its individual governments have not yet developed the maturity to act in concert or even from time to time without corruption. Nonetheless it could be recommended that a twenty or thirty year consultative plan could be put to the OAU in the first instance as a white paper. But the problem remains as to who would construct such an authoritative report and to that question there are, as yet, no answers.

Cavorting Cheetah,

Great words! Looks like you're beginning to provide the answer to the "African question".
Not meaning to split hairs but the OAU ceased to exist in 2002 when it was replaced by the African Union (AU). A close look at OAU timeline events shows they passed on a chance to focus on regional integration in favor of maintaining economic links with former colonial masters far back in 1963. The cold war also led to the decimation of the real brains and leaders in the group; K.Nkrumah, P. Lumumba, J.Kenyatta, etc.
However, it's evident that things have gone south. It's the only continent where the number and percentage of populace leaving below the poverty line has increased in the past 25 years. Time for a change in strategy? Back to the strategy that should have been adopted at the Addis Ababa inauguration in1963.....

As CC has mentioned in reference to the AU, any initiative like that remains just a talk shop and an excuse for junketeering and siphoning up expenses. Nothing will come of it due to the tribal suspicions and power hungry fools that plague Africa.

If you think they were doing anything but taking care of tribal and ideological business once in power you may need to spend more time in Africa.



Things are going to get worse before they get better, IMO. The short sighted venality of African leaders will affect pretty much the entire continent until the tribal mindset is dropped. A weak opposition does not make for good democratic principles and the checks and balances that come with them, but that is sadly something not well understood in Africa. The will to get it right is just not there, SA being a prime example. Violent protests about service delivery leading to beatings and protestors being shot by police, yet the same old bunch of corrupt and inept clowns is voted in again by those same protestors.

The confluence and conflicts of international political and economic interest has a strong bearing on the current state of affairs.
Africa has made more progress politically than economically. More democracy but less economic freedom. From the records, 1970-1980 was the best decade economically for the continent. Sadly, serious, steady decline fueled by widespread corruption set in thereafter.
No excuse for the inept, greedy, illiterate, African helmsmen but isn't Corruption is a two way street! Takes two to successfully, tango. Help is too far away when the object is too loot. Is it mainly because the Kleptomaniacs running the continent have been lured by their conniving foreign allies to mount up huge surreptitious national debts only for the cash to end up in some "secure" banks in the G8 and OECD countries? Just like the much publicized aid ( or more correct the 'bait') to Africa.
No doubt, The African leadership has been tragically myopic, but you'd expect some sort of moral high ground from " developed societies". Or are we to expect that there is no morality where money is involved

Oh, i do beg your pardon, i was looking for the "Is aviation in Africa really unsafe" thread, but i seem to have walked into the "Africa Politics Hamster wheel". Does this mean Jet Blast has started its world domination plan already?
So sorry, i'll get my coat and be off then.....

Safety is the victim of African politics. There is a clear connection so it is unsurprising that politics have come into this.

Sounds like you do not understand Africa :rolleyes:

To summarise the situation :-
Flying with a reputable 1st world carrier in Africa is just as safe as anywhere else because crews have learned how to work around the infrastructure problems.

Lower down the food chain we have an abysmal safety record due to cowboy operators and bad practices. This should not be allowed to happen but is widespread due to a lack of regulation and enforcement.

The lack of regulation is a political issue which shows little chance of being improved due to cultural issues and rampant corruption.

We know what is wrong, we know why it is wrong, but what can we do about it ?

Ancient Geek,

The best synopsis of the scenario!I've come across so far:D
And my major interest is to find a real practical answer to your closing question.
I believe Africans have the responsibility and the capacity to dig themselves out of this hole; before the sandstorm of global competitiveness of nations buries them.
Once again, great post.

Responsibility : Yes
Capacity : No
Motivation : No
Resources : No

Ergo, it won't happen.

After 10 years of flying there, that is true. I don't think anyone will ever fully understand it. :hmm: I left because i felt my life span was getting shorter the longer i stayed. It was not my flying, or the planes i flew that worried me, but the total apathy i encountered from all levels of people there, from fueling and loading staff, to the various CAA's. They don't care, it wont happen to them.

I disagree. A lot of the crews we met were always amazed how well we coped with the basic facilities available, most of them could not wait to get back north of the med to the safety of "the 1st world" with working infrastructure, which was all they knew and understood. Had to once explain how to do an NDB approach, which is usually the only nav aids still working, to a visiting crew for a British Airline.

But you may be right, no idea how the dark continent works.

Quote:
[quoteResponsibility : Yes
Capacity : No
Motivation : No
Resources : No][/quote]



Is this plain pessimism or is it a foreboding fear that these Africans can actually pull it off?

You can take all your -isms and shove em where the sun dont shine - except for realism.

I wish they would sort themselves out, I do however know that that hope will turn into disappointment if I hold onto it, thus I just say : Show me - then I will believe.

Afro-pessimist? No.

Afro-realist.

They dont give a damn about the millions dying of starvation, conflict and preventable diseases. Why would they worry about the odd few dozen in air crashes ?. Uncle Bob knows what is best ..........

Fantastic! Now that we have some huffing and puffing..How about channeling this energy and vitriol into some thing constructive....And then it'll be worth the 2 cents.

It's a little like Israel isn't it in that matters might be improved by a shifting of the boundaries to those that existed in the past. If the administration of each area illustrated in the link were to revert then perhaps there might be more opportunity for the import of short term contracted expertise and a commensurate increase in efficiency and productivity.


http://www.fsmitha.com/m2-image/map02af.gif

This thread is certainly getting some feedback!! Reading through it all it seems we have two main areas of debate - those who are pessimistic/disparaging, and those who are idealistic and wanting suggestions for change.

Having lived in the area long enough, I reckon change is not going to happen overnight. And in the meantime, yes its pretty disheartening. As for trying to bring a centralised, cohesive aviation policy throughout the regoin - not a chance in the short-term. African countries are very territorial, African politicians are nervously power-hungry, and African bureacrats are out to get as much power/money/security as possible - so work together with another country, tribe, nationality - no way! Give up one's perceived power to a 'foreigner' - not a chance! Work together with someone else who's different - not likely! "Who are you to tell us what to do?" "We don't need foreigners advising us" "We are a sovereign nation and onbly we know what is best for our people" and so on....

Can it be changed. Yes but only in the very long term. Aviation is a western invention for rich tourists, businessmen and politicians. When you're fighting (sometimes literally) for food, water, education, land, power and money, who cares if a few people fall out of the sky occasionally. There are more important things afoot - besides planes are just like big buses, pack 'em in and off you go. Payload? Don't understand it. Safety? Well it flew like this last time so it'll be okay this time. Responsibility? Not my job. Dodgy, old or unsafe aircraft? Well we can't judge and international agencies like the UN use it so it must be okay. Procedures? Nah, don't worry about that, the boss says do it, so we do it.

Aviation in Africa needs stability and maturity before it can be safe. And that first means stability and maturity in the region generally, diplomatically and financially.

This is one of the areas with the worst safety record. If the UN insisted on safe operations and enforced decent standards in the operators to which they contract their work we would see an immediate improvement in the statistics.

The current UN policy of giving work to the lowest bidder actively encourages the worst practices.

Thanks guys,
I'm expecting to hear from the ICAO regional offices in Africa.
Considering that it is an arm of the UN, it will be quite interesting to know the kind of due diligence they carryout on their aviation contractors in the region.

I hope Cathaybrat was mistaken when he stated
'he had to explain how to carry out an NDB approach to a British Airline crew'.
I'll be really worried if he's implying that British trained crew:) are not trained to be able to handle a procedural NDB. Approach. Besides, it is all detailed out in the jepps chart.

The objective is to hear factors and solutions to the safety problem in the AFI region. As well as the most realistic first steps to addressing the problem. Currently a proposal for regional integration and harmonizing regs. Even the arch rivals and former colonialist have realized , it's best to team up into the EU and EASA.
India is more populous and more divers than the entire AFI region and yet operates a single policy and regulator.