Everyone up there has started from somewhere!
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Everyone up there has started from somewhere!
Hello to all!
I completed my JAR FATPL early summer but it doens't look like I'll be getting a job any time soon and I hate being a engineer designing aircraft when I have the ability to fly them! So I've decided with my next wage (Feb) to jet off to Africa for a month or soo to find a 'safe flying job' but I dont know where in Africa shall I start knocking on doors asking for a flying job? Is there any kind of paper work needs doing?
Airlaw exam?
Converting Licence?
Is young age a issue?
Work permit?
Can I log hours from a African reg A/C towards my JAR licence?
Whats the pay like?
Whats the chance's of getting a twin prob job?
Basically I need people to help me with there experience's
!! I know I'm asking for a lot but its better than sitting at home calling up companies and getting the no thanks and refreshing my e-mail inbox! Everyone thats up there has started from somewhere... And I've decided that somewhere is going to be Africa for me 
I completed my JAR FATPL early summer but it doens't look like I'll be getting a job any time soon and I hate being a engineer designing aircraft when I have the ability to fly them! So I've decided with my next wage (Feb) to jet off to Africa for a month or soo to find a 'safe flying job' but I dont know where in Africa shall I start knocking on doors asking for a flying job? Is there any kind of paper work needs doing?
Airlaw exam?
Converting Licence?
Is young age a issue?
Work permit?
Can I log hours from a African reg A/C towards my JAR licence?
Whats the pay like?
Whats the chance's of getting a twin prob job?
Basically I need people to help me with there experience's
!! I know I'm asking for a lot but its better than sitting at home calling up companies and getting the no thanks and refreshing my e-mail inbox! Everyone thats up there has started from somewhere... And I've decided that somewhere is going to be Africa for me
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I love this...I cant get a job for a Legacy airline in Europe as I have Zero Experience so ohh well i`ll just go down to Africa and start flying for an Airline there.
Hello McFly...........what makes you think Airlines in Africa dont require hours on type or previous Airline experience or Type Rating of some kind ????
Infact its actually harder for you to get a job as an Expatriate as laws about Visa and immigration might ask..But what expertise does this expatriate bring to our country that we dont already have or can train our own people for...well in your case zero you dont bring any experience or expertise as you have never flown commercially before so immigration laws will say no thanks...any Expatriate who comes must bring 500 hours on type minimum otherwise we have our own cadets thanks...not gonna train you as a cadet so you can piss of home in six months at our expense.
Maybe try Cargo in Asia as I hear Cargo is not very desirable either and they fly at night so those types of Airlines probably dont require any experience or type ratings either.
Good luck in your quest....
Hello McFly...........what makes you think Airlines in Africa dont require hours on type or previous Airline experience or Type Rating of some kind ????
Infact its actually harder for you to get a job as an Expatriate as laws about Visa and immigration might ask..But what expertise does this expatriate bring to our country that we dont already have or can train our own people for...well in your case zero you dont bring any experience or expertise as you have never flown commercially before so immigration laws will say no thanks...any Expatriate who comes must bring 500 hours on type minimum otherwise we have our own cadets thanks...not gonna train you as a cadet so you can piss of home in six months at our expense.
Maybe try Cargo in Asia as I hear Cargo is not very desirable either and they fly at night so those types of Airlines probably dont require any experience or type ratings either.
Good luck in your quest....
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Well I didn't mention airline or bush flying! All I said is a safe flying job! Dont need to go off one dude! Chill your beans! But to make my post clear I'm looking for bush type flying to build up my experience!
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I think you need to start practicing the following sentence..."Do you want fries with that ?"
How would your AIRLINE specific training be enhanced or bettered or made more marketable to any Airline after 500 hours so called "Bush Flying" in Africa ???
A fATPL which you made a big point of telling people you now hold is gained for the purpose of flying Airliners. Your Airline trained why now go and try and ruin that good training with some crop dusting kamikaze style rubbish.
I dont see how any of that would improve your job prospects even if someone was stupid enough to give you a job in Africa..and even if you do get a job offer in Africa dont send them your bank details and upfront type rating money will you Sonny until your triple sure its for real.
How would your AIRLINE specific training be enhanced or bettered or made more marketable to any Airline after 500 hours so called "Bush Flying" in Africa ???
A fATPL which you made a big point of telling people you now hold is gained for the purpose of flying Airliners. Your Airline trained why now go and try and ruin that good training with some crop dusting kamikaze style rubbish.
I dont see how any of that would improve your job prospects even if someone was stupid enough to give you a job in Africa..and even if you do get a job offer in Africa dont send them your bank details and upfront type rating money will you Sonny until your triple sure its for real.
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In terms of getting airline work in Africa (or South Africa specifically), there are few airlines which allow you to get a job on a work permit and even then you must have 1500 hours logged and a SA CPL. Many airlines such as SAA or Comair require you to be a citizen of the country and have an SA passport. I think 1 time allow you to work on a permit but you must have a SA CPL and 1500 hours, which can be gained via doing charter work etc. which is possible to get but you still need to convert.
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Man you have a big chance they are gonna be hard on you with such a topic....
All your questions and I mean, really all your questions are already covered in the maybe 10 previous topics. Take the time to search and read the topics about Namibia, Botswana etc.
And then if you still have questions go for it.
Good reading and good luck for your job hunting
All your questions and I mean, really all your questions are already covered in the maybe 10 previous topics. Take the time to search and read the topics about Namibia, Botswana etc.
And then if you still have questions go for it.
Good reading and good luck for your job hunting
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It lookes like the B737-Dude has still the oppinion that the Continent Africa is still sitting in dark wholes and produces only dark people who just wait for a enlightend freshman to give them the glow.
I agree that everyone has started somewhere. There are alot of gifted people in the World, they would love to fly as well, if they could afford it. I am sure they all wait for a German Dude.....
Earn the wings was a old saying. It is easy to go out and shop a Licence it is much harder to compete and find a job. There are more Flying Schools out then needed, maybe they told that you go into a growing field? Wake up.
I agree that everyone has started somewhere. There are alot of gifted people in the World, they would love to fly as well, if they could afford it. I am sure they all wait for a German Dude.....
Earn the wings was a old saying. It is easy to go out and shop a Licence it is much harder to compete and find a job. There are more Flying Schools out then needed, maybe they told that you go into a growing field? Wake up.
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Give the guy a break guys. His concerns are genuine and there is no need for all the negativity towards his comments, no matter how naive they may seem.
B737Dude do as one of the other poster said and use the search function.
The only other bit of advice I can give you is don't waste your money flying from europe to africa without a job or at least an interview for a job lined up.
keep at it the first job is always the hardest to find
B737Dude do as one of the other poster said and use the search function.
The only other bit of advice I can give you is don't waste your money flying from europe to africa without a job or at least an interview for a job lined up.
keep at it the first job is always the hardest to find
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So let me summarize: - Don't go to Africa, you won't find a job. - It's not a ****hole where you can gain experience, you need some experience to work there. - If you have trained to fly jets, don't waste your time flying bush. - P2F is baaaad. The conclusion is to sit in your couch and wait for the holy virgin to appear in front of you with a job, everything else is useless. Seriously guys, take a valium and at least offer an alternative apart from how bad is the world to the wanabes.
Está servira para distraerle.
There are, in a manner of informal speaking, fifty six countries in Africa.
Details on these pages have been posted dealing with South Africa, Botswana, Congo, Nigeria, Kenya, Tanzania, Seychelles and perhaps one or two other odd places. There's plenty of scope for further research and reporting outside of Africa in aircraft design and engineering. You say that you have the ability to fly aircraft but I fear that in Africa, as in so many other continents, there is little or no opportunity for such brilliance to shine.
The answers to your questions however are probably more or less as follows.
You'll have to write one.
Very tedious and time consuming though probably possible if you have a work permit or offer.
No but it's easier of you're old.
Not readily available unless you have a job offer which you might not get without a work permit.
Yes but not necessarily as P1.
Dreadful.
Almost non existent at your level.
These depressing impressions are probably valid for the whole of the dark continent both north and south of the Sahara. I believe that the slave market in Timbuktu is still alive and well. A well written and photographed expose of the trade would perhaps be easier to accomplish and certainly more rewarding. Good luck.
Details on these pages have been posted dealing with South Africa, Botswana, Congo, Nigeria, Kenya, Tanzania, Seychelles and perhaps one or two other odd places. There's plenty of scope for further research and reporting outside of Africa in aircraft design and engineering. You say that you have the ability to fly aircraft but I fear that in Africa, as in so many other continents, there is little or no opportunity for such brilliance to shine.
The answers to your questions however are probably more or less as follows.
You'll have to write one.
Very tedious and time consuming though probably possible if you have a work permit or offer.
No but it's easier of you're old.
Not readily available unless you have a job offer which you might not get without a work permit.
Yes but not necessarily as P1.
Dreadful.
Almost non existent at your level.
These depressing impressions are probably valid for the whole of the dark continent both north and south of the Sahara. I believe that the slave market in Timbuktu is still alive and well. A well written and photographed expose of the trade would perhaps be easier to accomplish and certainly more rewarding. Good luck.
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Geeez guys, give the dude a break. There are jobs in Africa and there will be in the near future for expats and even for low time expats.
I'd be very curious where you guys with your "I'm-gon'-tell-ya-the-big-brightness-'bout-Africa-but-stay-home-'cos-noone-here-needs-your-little-white-ass-and-European-smartness" and where that frustration shining through your words come from?
And Dude, try searching for Botswana, Namibia and Tanzania, all the information is already here. And maybe you'll not going to feed the bunch of trolls.
Respect
I'd be very curious where you guys with your "I'm-gon'-tell-ya-the-big-brightness-'bout-Africa-but-stay-home-'cos-noone-here-needs-your-little-white-ass-and-European-smartness" and where that frustration shining through your words come from?
And Dude, try searching for Botswana, Namibia and Tanzania, all the information is already here. And maybe you'll not going to feed the bunch of trolls.
Respect
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Sorry did not mean to offend, I personally always liked your pulp fiction style of narration. And true poison dwarves sounds better.
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Happy New Year to the whole North-West Middle-earth and all creatures!
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Happy New Year to the whole North-West Middle-earth and all creatures!
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On a more serious note :
Africa accounts for less than 5% of the worlds active aircraft.
Most of the jobs are reserved for the locals.
There are more jobs for new pilots flying night parcels in the USA, add to that the short haul commuter lines and charter operators and you have a much better chance staying at home.
If bush flying is your choice there are more jobs in Canada than the whole of Africa.
Cheer up, the world economy will improve and the airlines will be hiring new pilots again but this will take a while.
Africa accounts for less than 5% of the worlds active aircraft.
Most of the jobs are reserved for the locals.
There are more jobs for new pilots flying night parcels in the USA, add to that the short haul commuter lines and charter operators and you have a much better chance staying at home.
If bush flying is your choice there are more jobs in Canada than the whole of Africa.
Cheer up, the world economy will improve and the airlines will be hiring new pilots again but this will take a while.
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B737Dude:
Had you been enjoying a bit much of that Christmas-time 'giggle juice' when you hatched up this plot to 'jet off to Africa'?
You are starting off looking at this whole thing through 'EU blinkers' where your JAR licence and your EU passport allow you to hop borders and take up other jobs... within the EU!! It is a completely different story outside the EU where you will have to obtain local licences or at least local validations for your licence before you can dream of flying one of their aeroplanes, then you will need a work permit before you can take up a job there. NOT like within the EU!! And the levels of bureaucracy there will be a hurdle that you've never dreamt of...
Then, reading the above posts, you will find many of the 'natives' to be a rather hostile and unpleasant lot...
Also, your European flying school's training will NOT have prepared you in any way for the demanding world of bush flying. (I have done African bush flying and I have taught at at a European commercial flying school, so I know...) Just jumping in as you are without some good sound coaching could be a good way of ensuring that you return to Germany in a box.
You need to put in a lot of research before 'jetting off' as you are planning or else you will be returning with your tail between your legs and your wallet a lot lighter. Make good use of "t'inter-web", don't just put up a post and expect to be fed answers... they are all out there on "t'inter-web" to be found by you if you look. But then, if you have just completed a JAR fATPL now you probably haven't been too hot on your research so far...
HOWEVER if you do manage to pull something off and you do get a proper bush flying job with some proper coaching, you will eventually come away from it with a very much enriched life: you will have seen impressive countryside, you would have learnt to think 'on your wings' in a way that no European flying school was ever going to prepare you for, you will have learnt to fly an aeroplane to its limits much better than your flying school taught you, you will have learnt that European 'poverty' is a joke and in reality a level of wealth only dreamt of by many in the world. After a spell of that type of flying you will become a much better pilot, in thinking and handling skills, than you would have been with only your JAR fATPL.
But, as with any flying tasks, the preparation is everything. Don't be put of with what a lot of the 'sour-pusses' above have said, but also don't dash in blindly with those 'EU blinkers' stopping you from seeing things clearly before you jump in. A bit of research, old boy!! And if it all works you should return home with the blinkers gone and very wide open eyes!!!
Had you been enjoying a bit much of that Christmas-time 'giggle juice' when you hatched up this plot to 'jet off to Africa'?
You are starting off looking at this whole thing through 'EU blinkers' where your JAR licence and your EU passport allow you to hop borders and take up other jobs... within the EU!! It is a completely different story outside the EU where you will have to obtain local licences or at least local validations for your licence before you can dream of flying one of their aeroplanes, then you will need a work permit before you can take up a job there. NOT like within the EU!! And the levels of bureaucracy there will be a hurdle that you've never dreamt of...
Then, reading the above posts, you will find many of the 'natives' to be a rather hostile and unpleasant lot...
Also, your European flying school's training will NOT have prepared you in any way for the demanding world of bush flying. (I have done African bush flying and I have taught at at a European commercial flying school, so I know...) Just jumping in as you are without some good sound coaching could be a good way of ensuring that you return to Germany in a box.
You need to put in a lot of research before 'jetting off' as you are planning or else you will be returning with your tail between your legs and your wallet a lot lighter. Make good use of "t'inter-web", don't just put up a post and expect to be fed answers... they are all out there on "t'inter-web" to be found by you if you look. But then, if you have just completed a JAR fATPL now you probably haven't been too hot on your research so far...
HOWEVER if you do manage to pull something off and you do get a proper bush flying job with some proper coaching, you will eventually come away from it with a very much enriched life: you will have seen impressive countryside, you would have learnt to think 'on your wings' in a way that no European flying school was ever going to prepare you for, you will have learnt to fly an aeroplane to its limits much better than your flying school taught you, you will have learnt that European 'poverty' is a joke and in reality a level of wealth only dreamt of by many in the world. After a spell of that type of flying you will become a much better pilot, in thinking and handling skills, than you would have been with only your JAR fATPL.
But, as with any flying tasks, the preparation is everything. Don't be put of with what a lot of the 'sour-pusses' above have said, but also don't dash in blindly with those 'EU blinkers' stopping you from seeing things clearly before you jump in. A bit of research, old boy!! And if it all works you should return home with the blinkers gone and very wide open eyes!!!
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So what? We were all that innocent at one time. Get bitten a few times, learn to deal with the used car salesmen and pimps in the aviation business and you become a wiser, more cynical person. It's a learning curve. At least he's not trying to screw up the market by paying for ratings or flying for free.
About the only way to do it is to roll up during hiring season in Maun (around now) or go make your face known in Namibia, Zambia, Malawi and Tanzania and keep trying for a slot. The details can be found by doing a search on here. Good luck.
About the only way to do it is to roll up during hiring season in Maun (around now) or go make your face known in Namibia, Zambia, Malawi and Tanzania and keep trying for a slot. The details can be found by doing a search on here. Good luck.
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Wow !
18 replies, and the positive and helpful ones add up to maybe 2 or 3 !
Another fine example of someone asking a few straight forward (granted - maybe slightly naive) questions, and getting absolutely slated and shot down by the self proclaimed experts from around the planet !
This guy is JUST starting out in his career and as he said, is only asking for advice and help from those with experience.
He is not asking to walk into any job or take anyone's precious job away !!
Instead he gets ridiculed and made to look an idiot !!!
Why don't some of you ever so experienced posters and aviation gods tell him and the rest of us exactly how you started out on your fantastic flying careers !?! Or maybe you already bore those "left handed gear monkeys" to death with your war stories !!!
No doubt you all did everything right from day 1 and gained your vast knowledge and experience through blood sweat and tears - never asking a naive question along the way !?! How quickly people forget !!!
This forum is here for people to ASK things, and not just to jump on every new post, tearing it apart !!!
B737Dude,
I wish you the best for your career and hope that you find a job soon !
As said before, try and search these forums for info on most of the countries.
You will see that everyone has had different experiences coming through bush flying or working in Africa, and what worked for one person, didn't necessarily work for another !
As you can clearly see on this forum, aviation is filled with people who try and find the worst in every situation. Just ignore them !!
Have a prosperous 2012 !
18 replies, and the positive and helpful ones add up to maybe 2 or 3 !
Another fine example of someone asking a few straight forward (granted - maybe slightly naive) questions, and getting absolutely slated and shot down by the self proclaimed experts from around the planet !
This guy is JUST starting out in his career and as he said, is only asking for advice and help from those with experience.
He is not asking to walk into any job or take anyone's precious job away !!
Instead he gets ridiculed and made to look an idiot !!!
Why don't some of you ever so experienced posters and aviation gods tell him and the rest of us exactly how you started out on your fantastic flying careers !?! Or maybe you already bore those "left handed gear monkeys" to death with your war stories !!!
No doubt you all did everything right from day 1 and gained your vast knowledge and experience through blood sweat and tears - never asking a naive question along the way !?! How quickly people forget !!!
This forum is here for people to ASK things, and not just to jump on every new post, tearing it apart !!!
B737Dude,
I wish you the best for your career and hope that you find a job soon !
As said before, try and search these forums for info on most of the countries.
You will see that everyone has had different experiences coming through bush flying or working in Africa, and what worked for one person, didn't necessarily work for another !
As you can clearly see on this forum, aviation is filled with people who try and find the worst in every situation. Just ignore them !!
Have a prosperous 2012 !