Kenya Airways expansion plans - 60/70 expat captains required .
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Kenya Airways expansion plans - 60/70 expat captains required .
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You failed to link properly.
KQ to triple fleet size in ten years
(currently KQ has 31 planes)
Have the unions approved foreign captains? Rumors are all previous attempts to bring in expats have been shot down by unions. I don't think *Experienced* captains would really eat any local jobs. Management will be most happy to replace expensive expat captains with lower wage locals as soon as they have gathered enough experience..
Unions should be worried if management starts bringing in low-hour "hour-builder" FO's.
KQ to triple fleet size in ten years
Two Dreamliners are expected to come in 2013 and five more in 2014. By 2015, KQ aims to have a fleet of 68 planes. The airline will bring in 60 -70 expatriate pilots to captain its planes over the next two years as there is a shortage of experienced captains in the country.
Have the unions approved foreign captains? Rumors are all previous attempts to bring in expats have been shot down by unions. I don't think *Experienced* captains would really eat any local jobs. Management will be most happy to replace expensive expat captains with lower wage locals as soon as they have gathered enough experience..
Unions should be worried if management starts bringing in low-hour "hour-builder" FO's.
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Sorry , still a novice with computers !
quote :-
Have the unions approved foreign captains? Rumors are all previous attempts to bring in expats have been shot down by unions. I don't think *Experienced* captains would really eat any local jobs. Management will be most happy to replace expensive expat captains with lower wage locals as soon as they have gathered enough experience..
Yes , the unions have never approved expats , the rumours correct about the shooting down . This has hampered growth already . I suspect that some agreement has been hammered out if this is to happen . Not sure what all the fuss is about really , any expat contract is controlled by work permits / visas anyway , and conditions can be restricted to preclude education allowances etc , kept to purely salary and accomodation ( not the 'permanent ' type ) , and the last time they did offer 1 year contracts for 73 skippers the salary itself was laughable , and certainly not more than a local skipper anyway !
So , good luck with finding 70 expats , especially if you want to keep your safety record going , not many airlines are having much luck at the moment even with far-superior T&Cs to KQs likely offerings , if this article is to be believed .
The sad thing is that hiring expats on a short - term basis is normally a requisite for any airline that needs to expand over a short period and while its new local crew gain experience . Perhaps there is more to this stubbornness than meets the eye ?
quote :-
Have the unions approved foreign captains? Rumors are all previous attempts to bring in expats have been shot down by unions. I don't think *Experienced* captains would really eat any local jobs. Management will be most happy to replace expensive expat captains with lower wage locals as soon as they have gathered enough experience..
Yes , the unions have never approved expats , the rumours correct about the shooting down . This has hampered growth already . I suspect that some agreement has been hammered out if this is to happen . Not sure what all the fuss is about really , any expat contract is controlled by work permits / visas anyway , and conditions can be restricted to preclude education allowances etc , kept to purely salary and accomodation ( not the 'permanent ' type ) , and the last time they did offer 1 year contracts for 73 skippers the salary itself was laughable , and certainly not more than a local skipper anyway !
So , good luck with finding 70 expats , especially if you want to keep your safety record going , not many airlines are having much luck at the moment even with far-superior T&Cs to KQs likely offerings , if this article is to be believed .
The sad thing is that hiring expats on a short - term basis is normally a requisite for any airline that needs to expand over a short period and while its new local crew gain experience . Perhaps there is more to this stubbornness than meets the eye ?
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Why bring in qualified expats when you can get local captains? Sure, they plant one in the mangrove swamps now and then, but apart from that they are frigging awesome.
Go local, you KNOW it makes sense.
Go local, you KNOW it makes sense.
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Bellview,sorry,FirstNation takes off
After a gruelling process that lasted more than a year, Nigeria`s FirstNation Airlines received its AOC last week. Today, one of its three locally registered A320-200s was in acdtion at Lagos MMIA, though I cant say if it was revenue service. The CEO and founder of defunct Bellview is also CEO/founder of FirstNation
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In my opinion Kenya Airways would benefit greatly if they could employ Expat captains. Its a good airline but safety record speaks for it self. I prefer SAA if I have a choice because I think training standards are higher and promotion is thorough. Korean air Singapore airlines many Chinese airlines have a min Expat policy and no doubt safety has improved. Go KQ
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Well, I wonder where they will find 70 embraer captains/ expats willing to take short term contracts, this is a relatively new aircraft and there are still kenyans they can train....me thinks it's a long term plan by TN to slowly weaken the union....
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It is interesting to read that they are planning on expat captains, once again.
I got in a running online battle with some guy: I talked to local KQ pilots who told me that expats would be required in the future. The online guy told me that I was wrong: no one told me that, expats would not be needed, because KQ would NEVER hire expats ever again.
If they plan to expand a lot, they will need expats, at least short term.
I got in a running online battle with some guy: I talked to local KQ pilots who told me that expats would be required in the future. The online guy told me that I was wrong: no one told me that, expats would not be needed, because KQ would NEVER hire expats ever again.
If they plan to expand a lot, they will need expats, at least short term.
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Methinks your 'internet buddy' confuses the difference between the Kenya Pilots Union ( whatever it calls itself ) and KQ management . I know for a fact that the CEO would like to have some expat crew , but the one-eyed shoulder-chipped pilot force would happily bring the whole lot down rather than feel insecure .
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Aviation is a global occupation. I sincerely hope no Kenyan pilots fly else where in the world if they don't allow others to fly in their airlines back home. That would be rather hypocritical.
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Don't forget, if you aren't a EU citizen, you won get a job i any European company. Kenya airways in the short term must hire foreign pilots to train locals,but they must be replaced by a citizen of any African nation,just like it happens in Europe and most parts of the world.
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oompilot ur such a hypocrite, i know for a fact that expats are a no no in SA, you guys in SA don't let anyone other than South Africans near ur aircraft let alone flying ur aircrafts, you cannot be talking like that for Kenya or Kenyan Pilots, wot about all those afrikans flying all over the world undercutting others pay wise for jobs, u guys r unbelievable.
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Expat Pilots would be a bad influence in Kenyan aviation. I bet that an expat pilot would do a high speed, idle thrust, fuel saving decent and maintain 250 kts. to 10 miles. Everyone knows that you should be fully configured at 30 miles, lie about your position to ATC in non-radar environments because you are "The Pride of Africa" and deserve priority, and make long-winded and self-important radio transmissions proceeded by "Break, break" even though ATC is clearly about to or have just issued instructions to another aircraft. An expat pilot would also incorrectly identify themselves as a "heavy" aircraft in the terminal environment because ICAO phraseology and standards don't apply to KQ...
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I've been on one of those 30nm fully configured approaches with The Pride Of Africa. The only thing I can add is that we were, at a guess, at about 1000ft aswell!. It was rather puzzling!
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My two cents worth...
Whereas KQ may, and is willing to hire expatriate captains, they have a mountain to climb to get it done.
Firstly, the KCAA demands a conversion of any foreign ATPL licence to a kenyan one to operate Kenyan registered aircraft. This involves I believe that one sits one ATPL conversion exam, and does a flight test. Previously one required only to sit an airlaw exam, but under the KCARS I believe this has changed. Be prepared to part with about US$ 3,000 under the table to pass this exam. The process to convert your licence should take about 3 months, give or take.
Secondly, KQ or Kenyan pilots do not control Kenya's immigration laws regarding work permits. The Kenyan law is clear that a foreigner may only obtain a work permit, if in employment, for a one year renewable period. During that one year period, the employer must take steps to TRAIN at least one kenyan citizen to an equivalent level. The cost of an annual work permit is about US$ 2,000 to be borne by the employer, plus considerable payments under the table to concerned immigration officials.
Thirdly, the unemployment levels of Kenyan youth is so high, that the employment of foreigners will be a particularly highly emotional and highly unpopular political move for the concerned politicians who will have to endorse such a policy change. The last time such a move was considered, KALPA successfully lobbied the politicians and easily won.
Finally, KQ can hardly be described as a young airline.It has been operating largely for at least the past 20 years with a fleet of about 20 to 25 aircraft, mix of narrow and wide body aircraft, and has been operating even sophisticated Boeing 777-200 for the past 8 years. The average FO in KQ has passed through the Boeing 737, 767 and 777 before qualifying for command. They then get a chance to have a first command on the Embrear 170/190 series. It seems to me that whereas they may not be enough FO's ready to fill the left hand seats, the few they have are quite experienced and have a solid foundation to command.
There are also several captains in Kenya rated on modern (and not so modern) jet aircraft flying for regional operators who are well experienced, and may also require a short time in the right seat before they can transition to captains.
Whereas KQ may, and is willing to hire expatriate captains, they have a mountain to climb to get it done.
Firstly, the KCAA demands a conversion of any foreign ATPL licence to a kenyan one to operate Kenyan registered aircraft. This involves I believe that one sits one ATPL conversion exam, and does a flight test. Previously one required only to sit an airlaw exam, but under the KCARS I believe this has changed. Be prepared to part with about US$ 3,000 under the table to pass this exam. The process to convert your licence should take about 3 months, give or take.
Secondly, KQ or Kenyan pilots do not control Kenya's immigration laws regarding work permits. The Kenyan law is clear that a foreigner may only obtain a work permit, if in employment, for a one year renewable period. During that one year period, the employer must take steps to TRAIN at least one kenyan citizen to an equivalent level. The cost of an annual work permit is about US$ 2,000 to be borne by the employer, plus considerable payments under the table to concerned immigration officials.
Thirdly, the unemployment levels of Kenyan youth is so high, that the employment of foreigners will be a particularly highly emotional and highly unpopular political move for the concerned politicians who will have to endorse such a policy change. The last time such a move was considered, KALPA successfully lobbied the politicians and easily won.
Finally, KQ can hardly be described as a young airline.It has been operating largely for at least the past 20 years with a fleet of about 20 to 25 aircraft, mix of narrow and wide body aircraft, and has been operating even sophisticated Boeing 777-200 for the past 8 years. The average FO in KQ has passed through the Boeing 737, 767 and 777 before qualifying for command. They then get a chance to have a first command on the Embrear 170/190 series. It seems to me that whereas they may not be enough FO's ready to fill the left hand seats, the few they have are quite experienced and have a solid foundation to command.
There are also several captains in Kenya rated on modern (and not so modern) jet aircraft flying for regional operators who are well experienced, and may also require a short time in the right seat before they can transition to captains.
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pretty skewed and mis informed comments on this thread, but i guess thats how it is always with fellas who have an axe to grind with an entity they dont like or feel bitter about.
Stay focused on the thread guyz mud slinging and random facts dont help anybody.
Stay focused on the thread guyz mud slinging and random facts dont help anybody.
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Well, to swing back on track, are the expatriates coming to fly with mainstream KQ or is the new launch airline going to absorb them, ??...right now more planes than pilots and will get worse...