Unimpressed by pilots
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Just like I'm unimpressed by financial advisors, insurance salesmen, second-hand car dealers, lawyers, doctors, bankers, IT entrepeneurs, builders, plumbers, electricians, politicians, Bob, JZ, Thabo, need I say more !! 
Join Date: May 2003
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Hi!
I've had a LOT of people very interested in my profession, and wanting to hear all about it. It probably IS less of a big deal now, because there are TONS more pilots now than there used to be, and people are flying more and more as PAX, so it seems more routine.
Pay goes up and down as everything does. In the US, about 50% of the General Practioners (MDs) want to quit within the next 5 years, because the pay is not worth the aggravation.
I was a teacher, with a Master's Degree (University 4-year, plus two more), and I started at $28,000/year. MAX pay after God knows how many years, and a Doctorate degree plus TONS of additional classes and training, was about $65,000.
I just saw and ad for an A-320 Captain and FO. The Captain's pay is $12-$15K (USD)/month, plus all expenses paid. Sure, some pilots don't get paid that much, but they CAN get paid a lot.
If you think the job is crap today, then quit, and those of us that want to do it will have a better chance at a better job!
cliff
KGRB
I've had a LOT of people very interested in my profession, and wanting to hear all about it. It probably IS less of a big deal now, because there are TONS more pilots now than there used to be, and people are flying more and more as PAX, so it seems more routine.
Pay goes up and down as everything does. In the US, about 50% of the General Practioners (MDs) want to quit within the next 5 years, because the pay is not worth the aggravation.
I was a teacher, with a Master's Degree (University 4-year, plus two more), and I started at $28,000/year. MAX pay after God knows how many years, and a Doctorate degree plus TONS of additional classes and training, was about $65,000.
I just saw and ad for an A-320 Captain and FO. The Captain's pay is $12-$15K (USD)/month, plus all expenses paid. Sure, some pilots don't get paid that much, but they CAN get paid a lot.
If you think the job is crap today, then quit, and those of us that want to do it will have a better chance at a better job!
cliff
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I started this thread not to determine if we were paid well or lived well, rather to find out if the average joe public was still impressed with our profession. From my recent experience it seems we are just a group of glorified cab drivers. Don't misunderstand I love flying and seeing a fantastic sunrise/sunset over the great African continent (nothing better)
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NIJASEA
Joe Public seems alsways to have been impressed with me as a pilot.
This arrogance of statement is made because I have always had my uniform on as though I were on military parade.
My shirt is always tucked in.
My tie is always a windsor knot.
My uniform is always clean.
It is always pressed.
My shoes shine.
I do not wear dongles aaround my neck or sunglasses.
I wear a cap.
My flighyt bag is a Jeppesen without stupid stickers to show I have been to LaLa Lufthansa land.
I never eat in public in uniform-or drink.
I never drive my car with epaulletes on.
I keep my body in shape and nebver look like a slob.
If passengers are at a lose, I stop to try to help them and I smile at people, even after 69 sectors.
In short sir, on the ground, I try to be a credit to a parade ground.
In the air, I try to be a credit to my profession.
Joe Public seems alsways to have been impressed with me as a pilot.
This arrogance of statement is made because I have always had my uniform on as though I were on military parade.
My shirt is always tucked in.
My tie is always a windsor knot.
My uniform is always clean.
It is always pressed.
My shoes shine.
I do not wear dongles aaround my neck or sunglasses.
I wear a cap.
My flighyt bag is a Jeppesen without stupid stickers to show I have been to LaLa Lufthansa land.
I never eat in public in uniform-or drink.
I never drive my car with epaulletes on.
I keep my body in shape and nebver look like a slob.
If passengers are at a lose, I stop to try to help them and I smile at people, even after 69 sectors.
In short sir, on the ground, I try to be a credit to a parade ground.
In the air, I try to be a credit to my profession.
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I can't believe I've just waisted 10 minutes of my life reading how pilots feel dejected by people who are no longer "..impressed" by what they do...!
The 'ol... "How do you know a pilot is at your party..." joke comes to mind..
let go guys - no one cares!
P
The 'ol... "How do you know a pilot is at your party..." joke comes to mind..
let go guys - no one cares!
P
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^^^ Best comment so far SRT!
Disrespect for authority is pretty much a standard feature of the way the world works these days, but that's not really what worries me.
What bothers me is the disrespect for our profession in our own industry. And I don't mean the 'you must kiss the ground I walk on' type of 'respect', but the true respect for what we actually do - respect from the managers and 'businessmen' who employ us to be the final judges of safety on the line, to protect the passengers who pay their salaries as well as our own. Management sometimes seem to view us as 'the enemy', overpaid fools who sit up front doing nothing but read the paper, suck resources and complain about T's & C's.
I was running over this, comparing other professions to our own - for example, a relative, working for a multi-national company, is constantly reminded (not in words, but by their actions) by his company that he is an asset to them. Pilots, on the other hand, are not viewed as 'solutions' (or money-generators), but as 'problems'. This despite the obvious result at the end of our days work, namely several hundred (depending) safe and happy passengers, and a smoothly running, intact aircraft. A lot more respect is often due to the cabin crew and engineers too. Management, on the other hand, can happily blunder around making some pretty dismal choices (pathetic fuel hedging, cutting funds for necessary functions, shortsighted and chaotic decisions etc) yet still award themselves a nice big bonus! If we did our job as badly, SA roads would have a lot more 737/A319 sized potholes in them.
Disrespect for authority is pretty much a standard feature of the way the world works these days, but that's not really what worries me.
What bothers me is the disrespect for our profession in our own industry. And I don't mean the 'you must kiss the ground I walk on' type of 'respect', but the true respect for what we actually do - respect from the managers and 'businessmen' who employ us to be the final judges of safety on the line, to protect the passengers who pay their salaries as well as our own. Management sometimes seem to view us as 'the enemy', overpaid fools who sit up front doing nothing but read the paper, suck resources and complain about T's & C's.
I was running over this, comparing other professions to our own - for example, a relative, working for a multi-national company, is constantly reminded (not in words, but by their actions) by his company that he is an asset to them. Pilots, on the other hand, are not viewed as 'solutions' (or money-generators), but as 'problems'. This despite the obvious result at the end of our days work, namely several hundred (depending) safe and happy passengers, and a smoothly running, intact aircraft. A lot more respect is often due to the cabin crew and engineers too. Management, on the other hand, can happily blunder around making some pretty dismal choices (pathetic fuel hedging, cutting funds for necessary functions, shortsighted and chaotic decisions etc) yet still award themselves a nice big bonus! If we did our job as badly, SA roads would have a lot more 737/A319 sized potholes in them.
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Glorified Cab driver?Hell no!
@Nijasea
I do not see myself as a glorified cab driver please.that is quite degrading.I am proud of my profession.
I believe you have had only one career,being a 'glorified cab driver.Having worked in different sectors,the only difference between we and the others is that we fly.otherwise,the politics is all the same.the **** we go through is all the same even worse in other professions.if you think the guy on the other seat doesn't like you or is an arrogant dumb,you get the same orientation doing an office job.
Daily I meet people who apart from being intrigued by what I do,are also impressed.
Working in Nigeria, very few places pay like what we get.try the civil service,or banking where u are turned into a beggar as a marketer.
I do not see myself as a glorified cab driver please.that is quite degrading.I am proud of my profession.
I believe you have had only one career,being a 'glorified cab driver.Having worked in different sectors,the only difference between we and the others is that we fly.otherwise,the politics is all the same.the **** we go through is all the same even worse in other professions.if you think the guy on the other seat doesn't like you or is an arrogant dumb,you get the same orientation doing an office job.
Daily I meet people who apart from being intrigued by what I do,are also impressed.
Working in Nigeria, very few places pay like what we get.try the civil service,or banking where u are turned into a beggar as a marketer.
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I really hope that there are no pilots out there doing it for the image. Flying is a passion , why care about the image .unfortunately for for those of us still living our childhood dream ( who are fortunate to have one) the only way we can get our kicks is to fly for an airline, the frustrations of which are great, we are managed by the non passionate and they thrive on the fact that we live for what we do.
Sometimes we forget about our love for aviation , but take it away and see how we will wither , its our sole , our blood and life we are living the dream we had as children.
To all who consider the IMAGE and have doubts I say stay away you will be unhappy .To the truly passionate welcome to the best time of your life.
Sometimes we forget about our love for aviation , but take it away and see how we will wither , its our sole , our blood and life we are living the dream we had as children.
To all who consider the IMAGE and have doubts I say stay away you will be unhappy .To the truly passionate welcome to the best time of your life.
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The Image!!!
Well said, porra. The arrogance that shines out from some of these posts, is SCARY. What about brain/heart/neuro-surgeons, nuclear and other scientists, astronomers and many, many other HIGHLY educated professions. These people are in it because they LOVE their work and want to make a contribution to society. Unlike what some arrogant pilots are almost suggesting, these people don't walk around with a large sign around their neck which reads: "HEY EVERYBODY. I'M A SURGEON/SCIENTIST/ASTRONOMER. THEREFORE YOU OWE ME BIG TIME. IF NOTHING ELSE, YOU OWE ME RESPECT." In the same vein, as an elderly American astronaut and moonwalker was saying in a TV interview recently: He also discovered that he couldn't walk around for the rest of his life displaying a sign reading: "I WALKED ON THE MOON. YOU OWE ME!!!" He had to literally come back down to earth and get on with his life to the best of his ability. Pilots should be pilots because they love the job and want to be the best they can at the job and because they want to contribute in some small way to society - and certainly not because it makes non-pilots look up to them in awe. What a DANGEROUS attitude. If you became a pilot because you thought it would entitle you automatically to respect, you'd be better off for the whole profession by getting out fast. There are MUCH better reasons for becoming a pilot. Hopefully the more arrogant posters on this thread will soon discover these reasons.
BEEDEE.
BEEDEE.
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Basically pilots fall into two categories....
Category one is the pilot discussed at the dinner table... over paid...airborne taxi driver... surrounded by hot pussy... job done by auto-pilot.. blah blah blah... usually described thus by hoplessly unqualified pratt selling life insurance, cars... or himself.
Cat 2... the guy up front in the cockpit when useless pratt described above is passenger on a/c caught in major thunderstorm activity close to destination airport with an alternate also looking dodgy and having landed safely in a blustery x-wind on a slick runway gets applauded by sweating and sh*tting himself pratt who realises that he's safely back on earth thanks to the.... "over paid...airborne taxi driver... surrounded by hot
... job done by auto-pilot.. Blah Blah Blah "
regards... Mungop
Category one is the pilot discussed at the dinner table... over paid...airborne taxi driver... surrounded by hot pussy... job done by auto-pilot.. blah blah blah... usually described thus by hoplessly unqualified pratt selling life insurance, cars... or himself.
Cat 2... the guy up front in the cockpit when useless pratt described above is passenger on a/c caught in major thunderstorm activity close to destination airport with an alternate also looking dodgy and having landed safely in a blustery x-wind on a slick runway gets applauded by sweating and sh*tting himself pratt who realises that he's safely back on earth thanks to the.... "over paid...airborne taxi driver... surrounded by hot
... job done by auto-pilot.. Blah Blah Blah " regards... Mungop
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Shrike how you managed to turn this thread into a wallow of self pity and oh the idiotic fools in management, get a life, it is jerk-offs like yourself who dont know , all the way pissing like a girl but NEVER actually do the very simple job of flying the plane and the other stressfull activities like emptying the content of the catering box, not doing your paperwork correctly, you all think you are superstars because your mommy said so, FLYING IS NOT DIFFICULT!!!!!we are not crossing the Atlantic in pistons, with a navigator and flight engineer doing the actual work.... go study for your MBA or go do something like IT where people really make a lot of money, or dont you have enough grey matter? possibly not even enough for management, if what came out of your piehole made sense they might have listened....alternatively, Like the Hammer said, try to look and act like a professional, be courteous and helpfull, or shut the up, do you want to know the reason nobody respects pilots, they are arrogant, lazy, whining little primadonna bitches, and a disgrace to the profession
, all the way pissing like a girl but NEVER actually do the very simple job of flying the plane and the other stressfull activities like emptying the content of the catering box, not doing your paperwork correctly, you all think you are superstars because your mommy said so, FLYING IS NOT DIFFICULT!!!!!we are not crossing the Atlantic in pistons, with a navigator and flight engineer doing the actual work.... go study for your MBA or go do something like IT where people really make a lot of money, or dont you have enough grey matter? possibly not even enough for management, if what came out of your piehole made sense they might have listened....alternatively, Like the Hammer said, try to look and act like a professional, be courteous and helpfull, or shut the up, do you want to know the reason nobody respects pilots, they are arrogant, lazy, whining little primadonna bitches, and a disgrace to the profession
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I'm trying to work out whether Kronos is a frustrated ppl wannabe or JVJ under a different pseudonym? What he/she does comes across as is a very mixed up puppy with some huge issues - maybe a visit to a happy farm might be in order Kronos? In the meantime I'll do some more wallowing with Shrike while enjoying my fat pay-cheque and wallet - anyone to join?
Maxrated -The respect and appeal of being a pilot got chucked out the window the day that the first airline crew allowed themselves to be bullied into removing their shoes and belt in full public view by some imbecilic, semi-literate, pimpled adolescent security person, in the name of safety.
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I'm with Kronos on this one. Flying is not difficult, the family labrador can almost do it. As technology has improved the duties of the crew have been curtailed and the responsibility has been taken by the machine. Why? Because it does a better and safer job. Everything thats left is instructed through the POH and the MOP, just do what you are told. I mean seriously, what decisions to you get to make? Coffee of tea? Chicken or beef?
Flying a DC6 across the Atlantic with 4 twitchy engines all running lean of peak required skill, judgement and understanding and was worthy of respect. Watching a B738 fly you to Cape Town while you make sordid remarks about the hostie is easy, boring and unimpressive. You might think you are cool but thats about the extent of it.
Pilots are overrated, over respected and deserve no more pay that a man that drives an interlink truck to Cape Town.
Pilots are not glorified bus drivers, they are just bus drivers.
Flying a DC6 across the Atlantic with 4 twitchy engines all running lean of peak required skill, judgement and understanding and was worthy of respect. Watching a B738 fly you to Cape Town while you make sordid remarks about the hostie is easy, boring and unimpressive. You might think you are cool but thats about the extent of it.
Pilots are overrated, over respected and deserve no more pay that a man that drives an interlink truck to Cape Town.
Pilots are not glorified bus drivers, they are just bus drivers.
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Pirate, you miss my point - "skills etc" are not limited to pilots - no matter what your profession, one needs skills to perform - the more you have the better you are at your chosen career - the better you are, the more you get paid etc etc
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Originally Posted by KRONOS
Shrike how you managed to turn this thread into a wallow of self pity and oh the idiotic fools in management...etc etc etc lots of ranting from Kronos
Edit to add: I had to go and read my original post again, just to check - where am I pitying myself?