1Time Pilot Losses
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Eject! Eject! Eject!
Word of advice to the pilots at 1Time... Take your skills somewhere else. The world aviation market is opening wide open to guys of your calibre. No need to work for a bunch of wannabees who couldn't tell the difference between their a** and a hole in the ground! To potential 1Time pilots (if there is still such a thing out there)... DFWI (dont f*** with it). Eject! Eject! Eject!
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It seems that the managment strategy and structure at 1time is not what it should be. Surely the Director Flight Ops are responsible for crew issues, recruitment, etc. as well as for maintaining the overall operational standard. In a previous thread, 1time was discussed for hauling pilots onto the red carpet for refusing to fly unserviceable aircraft or outside FDP. Surely the DFO should put a stop to that kind of reckless behaviour. Staff problems start at the top and work there way down. The sad part is, that all very succesfull companies and airlines have 1 thing in common - good staff relationships and sound HR management (which should be headed up by experienced specialists). You need to offer professional pilots or other professionally qualified personal a competitive remunaration package (Well thought out salary scales, annual incerases, longivety rewards, perks as per seniority and qualifications etc) , good long term career prospects and a stable working environment that manages fatique and stress (Stable and well planned rosters, quality time off). If not they will leave as soon as the market allows. Aren't one of the directors a pilot as well?.Surely if he does not understand these principles, he has either forgotten where he came from or are too busy servicing other agendas to care about a bunch of silly pilots.
Good luck to the oaks remaining. I believe the oaks leaving don't care much about training bonds, they just want to get out. Maybe the resigned Chief Pilot can shed some light on the subject. Have heard of the rated pilots that came from Sunair (red) and Millionair have left anyway (I knew most of them). Don't know how are they going to fight the opposition when they have a huge fight going on within, especially with their front line staff holding the biggest operating expense in their grubby little paws !
Good luck to the oaks remaining. I believe the oaks leaving don't care much about training bonds, they just want to get out. Maybe the resigned Chief Pilot can shed some light on the subject. Have heard of the rated pilots that came from Sunair (red) and Millionair have left anyway (I knew most of them). Don't know how are they going to fight the opposition when they have a huge fight going on within, especially with their front line staff holding the biggest operating expense in their grubby little paws !
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1 Time Pilot losses
I know few guys flying for 1time, believe or not, they actauly getting a bonus this year they said, but the for the guys who resigned this year, like the chief pilot will not get a bonus, thats so wrong! Isn't a bonus based on your performance during the year, or like 1 time during the last 2 years doing over 950 hrs a year???. Guys must get the Sunday times this sunday, 1 time looking for captains. Poor First officers, 1 time dont even look their own guys, parently they are all too young. The poor guys also dont get weekends, I know, I've tried a couple of times to invite my friends for a braai, but the cant come around cause they flying, their weekends are on Mondays and Tuesdays. All the best for the 1 time pilots, and the future captains that will join them sortly.
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Crew Management
It seems that the managment strategy and structure at 1time is not what it should be. Surely the Director Flight Ops are responsible for crew issues, recruitment, etc. as well as for maintaining the overall operational standard. In a previous thread, 1time was discussed for hauling pilots onto the red carpet for refusing to fly unserviceable aircraft or outside FDP. Surely the DFO should put a stop to that kind of reckless behaviour. Staff problems start at the top and work there way down.
d around the way they seem to be. It seems wrong that the bean counters are able to do what they are accused of if the crew management supports the crew. I would love to see this resolved, I know some of the first guys used to really enjoy it there. It seemed like a good place to be with some good prospects.Be a pity for the upstairs guys to be able to ruin it.
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To Mr O & Co.
I'd say 1Time is clearly in financial poo-poo. Selling shares and listing on the JSE are definite signs of cash flow problems. It's no secret that they've had a rather "limited" bank balance from day one. And now that there's new pressure from another player in the market, I'm sure 1Time's management are starting to feel the strain
.
1Time got off to a very good start mainly because the crew were all fresh and motivated
, the first chief pilot was extremely dynamic, the market was ready for a change and they had access to cheap aircraft and type rated crew.
Being the front line to the public, cabin crew are instrumental in convincing passengers to come back a second time. Cockpit crew have a great influence on operating costs, eg fuel burns, brake usage, etc. Both the cockpit and cabin crew put a major effort into getting the airline going - as did everybody else that was involved - and were prepared to go the extra mile for the company, by working long hours, getting little time off, etc. However, as time rolled on and management got a little more comfortable with their environment, a very clear disregard for those who drive their operation forward became apparent.
How can you treat people who have such a huge influence on your airline so badly Mr O and Co? Maybe worrying too much about your own personal wealth and not the welfare of those that you employ? Or maybe you just forgot about them in the mad dash to those wonderful pub lunches!
There has long been an attitude of "shake a tree and more will drop out" when it comes to crew retention at 1Time. Well, those days have gone
- the guys and girls are voting with their feet and 1Time is struggling to get experienced people to replace them. Mr O you are not dealing with a bunch of 19 year call center staff, who are only filling a gap year with your company - you are dealing with adult, professional people who have made aviation their career! You can not expect them to put up with your bad attitude and poor working conditions and expect loyalty from them.
Don't think that the bonus (only a few years late!) will convince your crew to stay. They'll happily take the money, but still keep looking for a better job. It's too late to convince your "old" crew that you actually do mean well, Mr O (after all, leopards never change their spots!), but it might be an idea to start treating them humanely and some of the "new" guys might be prepared to stay on and make things work for you. Start off by changing your mentality and that of your managers from "dealing with a bunch of bus drivers" to "these are professional people that we need to motivate and get the best from". Professional respect might be a good concept to embrace!
Oh yes! Nearly forgot - serviceable aircraft, proper training, competant / qualified managers, decent crew meals, stable rosters, a weekend off now and then, the promised 75 hours a month, the promised profit share / bonus, market related salary increases, decent rebate policy, realistic leave policy and correct crewing levels might help as well.
Mr O, I have no doubt that if 1Time goes under, you and your cronies upstairs will land on your feet and probably pop up again somewhere. It's for the sake of your crew - my mates - that I hope you keep the company going and turn it into the successful airline it once was that everyone wanted to work for.
.1Time got off to a very good start mainly because the crew were all fresh and motivated
, the first chief pilot was extremely dynamic, the market was ready for a change and they had access to cheap aircraft and type rated crew.Being the front line to the public, cabin crew are instrumental in convincing passengers to come back a second time. Cockpit crew have a great influence on operating costs, eg fuel burns, brake usage, etc. Both the cockpit and cabin crew put a major effort into getting the airline going - as did everybody else that was involved - and were prepared to go the extra mile for the company, by working long hours, getting little time off, etc. However, as time rolled on and management got a little more comfortable with their environment, a very clear disregard for those who drive their operation forward became apparent.
How can you treat people who have such a huge influence on your airline so badly Mr O and Co? Maybe worrying too much about your own personal wealth and not the welfare of those that you employ? Or maybe you just forgot about them in the mad dash to those wonderful pub lunches!
There has long been an attitude of "shake a tree and more will drop out" when it comes to crew retention at 1Time. Well, those days have gone
- the guys and girls are voting with their feet and 1Time is struggling to get experienced people to replace them. Mr O you are not dealing with a bunch of 19 year call center staff, who are only filling a gap year with your company - you are dealing with adult, professional people who have made aviation their career! You can not expect them to put up with your bad attitude and poor working conditions and expect loyalty from them.Don't think that the bonus (only a few years late!) will convince your crew to stay. They'll happily take the money, but still keep looking for a better job. It's too late to convince your "old" crew that you actually do mean well, Mr O (after all, leopards never change their spots!), but it might be an idea to start treating them humanely and some of the "new" guys might be prepared to stay on and make things work for you. Start off by changing your mentality and that of your managers from "dealing with a bunch of bus drivers" to "these are professional people that we need to motivate and get the best from". Professional respect might be a good concept to embrace!
Oh yes! Nearly forgot - serviceable aircraft, proper training, competant / qualified managers, decent crew meals, stable rosters, a weekend off now and then, the promised 75 hours a month, the promised profit share / bonus, market related salary increases, decent rebate policy, realistic leave policy and correct crewing levels might help as well.
Mr O, I have no doubt that if 1Time goes under, you and your cronies upstairs will land on your feet and probably pop up again somewhere. It's for the sake of your crew - my mates - that I hope you keep the company going and turn it into the successful airline it once was that everyone wanted to work for.
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I have been following this for quite some time and it is really getting juicy. I would argue the point of 1time being in financial poo-poo. The stock exchange has strict entry regulations and 1time's financials will be subject to close scrutiny. Believe me, when we listed there were a lot of due diligence audits. The recent investor also would not throw good money if they do not believe in 1time's future. What is happening here i suspect is 1time recapitalizing itself to fund future (or even past) growth. I am not convinced that they will expand aggressively but suspect that possibly they will upgrade the fleet or consolidate the operations in general. We were astonished by their growth and my chums at 1time acknowledge that there are some growing pains but that is just part of the territory. Ok, so mr O seems to be a bit tight (maybe he has SSS) but that is what a business needs in a competitive environment with volatile business drivers like fuel. When Mr O worked for us he was highly respected and the guys were very emotive when he left. Why does the happy guys at 1time not air their opinions - that includes you Mr F.
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Speedometer
I have been following this for quite some time and it is really getting juicy. I would argue the point of 1time being in financial poo-poo. The stock exchange has strict entry regulations and 1time's financials will be subject to close scrutiny. Believe me, when we listed there were a lot of due diligence audits. The recent investor also would not throw good money if they do not believe in 1time's future. What is happening here i suspect is 1time recapitalizing itself to fund future (or even past) growth. I am not convinced that they will expand aggressively but suspect that possibly they will upgrade the fleet or consolidate the operations in general. We were astonished by their growth and my chums at 1time acknowledge that there are some growing pains but that is just part of the territory. Ok, so mr O seems to be a bit tight (maybe he has SSS) but that is what a business needs in a competitive environment with volatile business drivers like fuel. When Mr O worked for us he was highly respected and the guys were very emotive when he left. Why does the happy guys at 1time not air their opinions - that includes you Mr F.
I have been following this for quite some time and it is really getting juicy. I would argue the point of 1time being in financial poo-poo. The stock exchange has strict entry regulations and 1time's financials will be subject to close scrutiny. Believe me, when we listed there were a lot of due diligence audits. The recent investor also would not throw good money if they do not believe in 1time's future. What is happening here i suspect is 1time recapitalizing itself to fund future (or even past) growth. I am not convinced that they will expand aggressively but suspect that possibly they will upgrade the fleet or consolidate the operations in general. We were astonished by their growth and my chums at 1time acknowledge that there are some growing pains but that is just part of the territory. Ok, so mr O seems to be a bit tight (maybe he has SSS) but that is what a business needs in a competitive environment with volatile business drivers like fuel. When Mr O worked for us he was highly respected and the guys were very emotive when he left. Why does the happy guys at 1time not air their opinions - that includes you Mr F.
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I would like to believe all that has been written in the last couple of posts- there are some good folk at 1T and it be a pity to see any of them out of work, although I’m sure that they would be sorted out pretty quickly.
Having worked for a brilliant airline ( Sun Air – the original one) and seen it go bust- even with money in the bank, I’ve come to realise that this business is a fickle one. Fundamentally the problem 1T has is its capacity for growth- look at what’s just happened- they had to flog 15% of the company and agree to lease the buyers aircraft just to get a bit of growth going. So what kind of deal is going to be done for the next aircraft?
The facts don’t lie, you cant operate on a shoe string- sad but true.
Having worked for a brilliant airline ( Sun Air – the original one) and seen it go bust- even with money in the bank, I’ve come to realise that this business is a fickle one. Fundamentally the problem 1T has is its capacity for growth- look at what’s just happened- they had to flog 15% of the company and agree to lease the buyers aircraft just to get a bit of growth going. So what kind of deal is going to be done for the next aircraft?
The facts don’t lie, you cant operate on a shoe string- sad but true.
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A listing on the JSE does not necessarily generate cash for the company. Current shareholders sell their shares to the public and they are the ones that receive the proceeds. Only if there is a rights issue (i.e. additional shares issued) incorporated in the listing will the company accrue the proceeds. I do not recall that it was mentioned but it is a possibility
.
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Well, I'm one of the happy guys at 1time. Been there for close on 2 years and am finding it just as fun as I did when I joined. I'm amazed with some of the previous posts that some of our pilots have so many negative comments to make about the airline without finding a single positive thing to say... Very suspicious... I'm thankful to fly nice aircraft, with fun people. Yes the roster can be a little frustrating at times, but I've been in another airline, and, quite frankly, I don't see much difference in the end result. We all want weekends off, and we all want to be able to go to exactly those parties we want to go to and that is final. Didn't work like that at my last ailine, and hasn't happened here at 1Time either. Maybe I'm just more realistic in my expectation.
My logbook says I did 842 hours in the last 12 months - not too bad at all really...
When I arrived 2 years ago, 1Time handed out a bonus that I wasn't entitled to. This time round, I did get one. Yay! And a raise. Yay!
Sure, it's not a perfect airline, but I'm just as happy 2 years on as when I arrived. I just choose to come to work happy, it's easier for me.
Sure, I'm not flying Full EFIS cockpits around, but I've done that too. If you are bored with a DC9, pushing 'Enter' on an 800 is going to have you bored in 6 months - tops.
Choose to be happy guys...
My logbook says I did 842 hours in the last 12 months - not too bad at all really...
When I arrived 2 years ago, 1Time handed out a bonus that I wasn't entitled to. This time round, I did get one. Yay! And a raise. Yay!
Sure, it's not a perfect airline, but I'm just as happy 2 years on as when I arrived. I just choose to come to work happy, it's easier for me.
Sure, I'm not flying Full EFIS cockpits around, but I've done that too. If you are bored with a DC9, pushing 'Enter' on an 800 is going to have you bored in 6 months - tops.
Choose to be happy guys...
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jeanjaquesburnell .....
you must be the south african reincarnation of a certain famous american aviator who broke the sound barrier all that time ago -
I fear only he would have relished the thought of tackling thunderstorms without an adequate weather radar ,uncoupled monitored approaches to coastal destinations ( ie HAND FLOWN TO MININA) IN A 40 YEAR OLD DC9!- often twice in a day !!!!
One shudders to think what the fare paying passenger would think if they really knew what their consumer rand was buying them to east london!!
since you have a full 2 years service guess you were'nt part of the original clan and hence all those empty promises clearly didnt't fall on ypur ears.
Get a life ! Open those ears and eyes and start thinking like an AIRLINE pilot !
People like you are so much a part of the problem you self righteous w ker !
I fear only he would have relished the thought of tackling thunderstorms without an adequate weather radar
,uncoupled monitored approaches to coastal destinations ( ie HAND FLOWN TO MININA) IN A 40 YEAR OLD DC9!- often twice in a day !!!! One shudders to think what the fare paying passenger would think if they really knew what their consumer rand was buying them to east london!!
since you have a full 2 years service guess you were'nt part of the original clan and hence all those empty promises clearly didnt't fall on ypur ears.
Get a life ! Open those ears and eyes and start thinking like an AIRLINE pilot !
People like you are so much a part of the problem you self righteous w ker !
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Boypilot relax, not all pilots get to fly full EFIS equipped aircraft, and land with their bum in the butter! At least our friend at 1Time is making the best of his situation, instead of moaning and complaining like so many others do.
Admittedly modern aircraft are safer, but that's why the older generation aircraft don't fly down to CAT 111 minima.
Admittedly modern aircraft are safer, but that's why the older generation aircraft don't fly down to CAT 111 minima.
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Boypilot:
Can you imagine that, a pilot having to handfly an aircraft down to minima, wow, what will they think of next? Isn't that what pilots do? FLY aeroplanes? Thats why we do all that training/sim time etc. It is not so we can manipulate the autopilot, it so we can actually do what we are supposed to and that is fly the aeroplane in adverse weather, IMC etc.
Real pilots fly aeroplanes with their hands, they aren't glorified computer programmers. Having flown a successful fully coupled approach is about as exciting and fullfilling as successfully picking up a prostitute; anyone can do it, no matter what their skill level
I bet you are one of those guys who sits around the braai at parties and goes, 'yea babe, you should have seen it, I had to program the autopilot to do an approach into PE today....TWICE...phew, tough day at work hey, pass me another Peroni"
Another thing, as far as I understand the 1time a/c are all built in the 80's, not in the 60's...I haven't noticed any Comets or 707's sitting on the apron painted red lately...
Off to go FLY now, later guys...
Can you imagine that, a pilot having to handfly an aircraft down to minima, wow, what will they think of next? Isn't that what pilots do? FLY aeroplanes? Thats why we do all that training/sim time etc. It is not so we can manipulate the autopilot, it so we can actually do what we are supposed to and that is fly the aeroplane in adverse weather, IMC etc.
Real pilots fly aeroplanes with their hands, they aren't glorified computer programmers. Having flown a successful fully coupled approach is about as exciting and fullfilling as successfully picking up a prostitute; anyone can do it, no matter what their skill level
I bet you are one of those guys who sits around the braai at parties and goes, 'yea babe, you should have seen it, I had to program the autopilot to do an approach into PE today....TWICE...phew, tough day at work hey, pass me another Peroni"
Another thing, as far as I understand the 1time a/c are all built in the 80's, not in the 60's...I haven't noticed any Comets or 707's sitting on the apron painted red lately...
Off to go FLY now, later guys...
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Ease up there bp. That last post was a bit on the harsh side and misdirected. The original spread was about pilot resignations due to managements apathy toward their employees. Most pilots at 1time are not happy with the way they are being treated but if jj is happy with his working conditions then good luck to him. He is fully entitled to his opinion even if it isn't shared by many. I just hope that the smiling assassin, his two yapping sidekicks and the Director of flight ops do something to keep jj smiling but who we kidding....
I don't think this post was ever intended to turn into a personal attack on fellow pilots, especially those flying the diesels. Each and everyone of the pilots at 1time are gentlemen. Pity we can't say the same for the crowd upstairs. In fact they will probably devote more time to finding out who amongst their crew are bad mouthing them on this forum than they will trying to sort out the morale issues at 1time.
bp, get jjb to buy you a beer on your next nightstop, he can afford it now, but don't forget to sign the bill at least 8 hours before sign on. Shouldn't be a problem with the generous layover times afforded to the crew.
Forget not who control those very thirsty thrust levers at altitude.
P.S. Anyone figured out how long to keep the diesel at M0.8 to make up for the sandwich you just paid for yet?
I don't think this post was ever intended to turn into a personal attack on fellow pilots, especially those flying the diesels. Each and everyone of the pilots at 1time are gentlemen. Pity we can't say the same for the crowd upstairs. In fact they will probably devote more time to finding out who amongst their crew are bad mouthing them on this forum than they will trying to sort out the morale issues at 1time.
bp, get jjb to buy you a beer on your next nightstop, he can afford it now, but don't forget to sign the bill at least 8 hours before sign on. Shouldn't be a problem with the generous layover times afforded to the crew.
Forget not who control those very thirsty thrust levers at altitude.
P.S. Anyone figured out how long to keep the diesel at M0.8 to make up for the sandwich you just paid for yet?
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and besides, the type of pilot you are is not determined by how much aeroplane fly, rather by how you fly the aircraft you are serving on. I would much rather fly with chaps who are extremely proficient at ahnd flying than with a guy who has not actually manipulated the controls in months except for rotating and flaring...
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Well then you are now discounting the majority of airlines in the world as many state in their procedures that the autopilot is recommended to be engaged at 500' AGL after take off and disconnected at 500' on final approach. Its strange though as when sim recurrency is due that hands on skills are diminished and the old saying of the only time I was on the localiser is when I shot through it becomes more prevalent......
It seems though that automation since it does in fact do a better job is taking our basic skills away from us.....and has nothing to do with us as pilots, but generally procedures laid down by our operators!!!!!
This is way off topic............but anyway!!!
It seems though that automation since it does in fact do a better job is taking our basic skills away from us.....and has nothing to do with us as pilots, but generally procedures laid down by our operators!!!!!
This is way off topic............but anyway!!!
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Beechbum says:
"This is way off topic............but anyway!!!"
I agree 100% with Beechbum's above qoute, but then again that's what happen when you handfly an aircraft under difficult conditions......."you drift of the topic".
Handflying and aircraft should be another thread,this is about the"the Red company" looses there pilots to other operators.
"This is way off topic............but anyway!!!
"I agree 100% with Beechbum's above qoute, but then again that's what happen when you handfly an aircraft under difficult conditions......."you drift of the topic".
Handflying and aircraft should be another thread,this is about the"the Red company" looses there pilots to other operators.