SR22 down near Bruges, (BE) - BRS saved the day
An SR22 piloted by a Pprune member, enroute from Germany to the UK approaching COSTA VOR (Belgium) at FL100, got in trouble ("lost the propellor" ??), headed inland (most likely for Ostend EBOS), but ended up pulling the BRS when approaching the city of Bruges. Both pilot and airplane (more or less) look in pretty good shape after the event.
https://www.hln.be/brugge/john-72-ma...aind~a5d47a8c/ (in dutch - main article behind paywall, but we all can see that he avoided schools and hospitals) https://www.hln.be/damme/sportvliegt...hute~a1635e49/ I presume the pilot one day will share some firsthand insights. Second BRS "landing" near Bruges in a year (or two) |
Well, there’s a distinct lack of propellor on the plane after the landing, as seen on the linked picture.
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Originally Posted by DIBO
(Post 11331941)
Both pilot and airplane (more or less) look in pretty good shape after the event.
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Originally Posted by DaveReidUK
(Post 11332173)
Are there any know instances of a Cirrus being restored to airworthiness after a BRS descent ?
Q. How much damage will be done to my plane if I land it with a parachute? A. In all likelihood the aircraft will suffer some significant damage. The terrain where you land will affect this greatly. Though the extent of damage has varied from plane to plane, most GA aircraft that have come down under a BRS deployment have eventually (or will soon) fly again. https://brsaerospace.com/questions/ |
Firsthand account here on Flyer forums: https://forums.flyer.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=122521
Originally Posted by hans brinker
(Post 11332193)
...most GA aircraft that have come down under a BRS deployment have eventually (or will soon) fly again.
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Originally Posted by hans brinker
(Post 11332193)
I haven’t seen any, but from the BRS website:
Q. How much damage will be done to my plane if I land it with a parachute? A. In all likelihood the aircraft will suffer some significant damage. The terrain where you land will affect this greatly. Though the extent of damage has varied from plane to plane, most GA aircraft that have come down under a BRS deployment have eventually (or will soon) fly again. https://brsaerospace.com/questions/
Originally Posted by Jhieminga
(Post 11332199)
Firsthand account here on Flyer forums: https://forums.flyer.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=122521
“Originally Posted by Hans Brinker ...most GA aircraft that have come down under a BRS deployment have eventually (or will soon) fly again.” On a Cirrus you're sacrificing the undercarriage as that is what cushions the impact and the straps are pulled through some bits of composite structure. I'm sure it could be repaired to fly again but the question is whether that's economically viable. |
Originally Posted by DIBO
(Post 11331941)
An SR22 piloted by a Pprune member, enroute from Germany to the UK approaching COSTA VOR (Belgium) at FL100, got in trouble ("lost the propellor" ??), headed inland (most likely for Ostend EBOS), but ended up pulling the BRS when approaching the city of Bruges. Both pilot and airplane (more or less) look in pretty good shape after the event.
https://www.hln.be/brugge/john-72-ma...aind~a5d47a8c/ (in dutch - main article behind paywall, but we all can see that he avoided schools and hospitals) https://www.hln.be/damme/sportvliegt...hute~a1635e49/ I presume the pilot one day will share some firsthand insights. Second BRS "landing" near Bruges in a year (or two) I called Mayday, descended from 10000 feet to 3000, found a field and pulled CAPS. The system and the training worked exactly as advertised and I am entirely unhurt. |
Glad you made it unhurt.
Has the propeller been removed recently? |
Originally Posted by Less Hair
(Post 11332248)
Glad you made it unhurt.
Has the propeller been removed recently? |
'Glad you're okay Jonzarno! A credit to the BRS system. When you hear, will you come back, and tell us why the prop departed? Broken crankshaft perhaps?
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They flew to Bruges! I wonder if this will make it into Private Eye? :)
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Yes, I will post the investigation results when they come out but it will be some time. They also first have to find the prop!
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Very glad to hear you are safe and well :ok:
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Never flown with BRS, and no idea what I would have done. If you don't mind: Did you consider an off-airport landing, or where you pretty sure from the start you were going to pull the chute? Thanks for coming on here and responding to the other questions!
edit: just read your account on the above link. Sounds like you made the right choice. |
Originally Posted by hans brinker
(Post 11332549)
Never flown with BRS, and no idea what I would have done. If you don't mind: Did you consider an off-airport landing, or where you pretty sure from the start you were going to pull the chute? Thanks for coming on here and responding to the other questions!
edit: just read your account on the above link. Sounds like you made the right choice. As a side note: the field I landed in looked quite flat from the air. After the aircraft came down and I got out, it became very clear that it was anything but and also had a wire fence I hadn't seen. If I had tried to land on it, I would definitely have ended up inverted with about 250 litres of Avgas for company. |
Originally Posted by DIBO
(Post 11331941)
Second BRS "landing" near Bruges in a year (or two)
@Jonzarno good to see it was another landing you walked away from :ok: |
Thanks Jonzarno for sharing this experience, and glad for you came out unhurt. I read your full account on the FLYER Forum, you mention a few times training on simulator, and also this sentence:
if I hadn't had CAPS AND THE TRAINING on how and when to use it: I might well not have been able to write this. If you have the time , could you tell us what you learn in the sim that helped you ? . Most aeroclubs do not have ( easy) access to simulators . |
Originally Posted by ATC Watcher
(Post 11332756)
Thanks Jonzarno for sharing this experience, and glad for you came out unhurt. I read your full account on the FLYER Forum, you mention a few times training on simulator, and also this sentence:
It is the training how to use it part that I am worried about : In 2 of the Flying clubs, I belong we have Ultra lights with BRS and . when there is no wind, I regularly fly one of them for fun. . Training on the BRS consisted in both clubs, in reding a small 4-5 pages leaflet and then signing a form that you had read and understood it. Most of the text referred to the dangers of its pyrotechnics, but not really on how to use it in an emergency. If you have the time , could you tell us what you learn in the sim that helped you ? . Most aeroclubs do not have ( easy) access to simulators . I was "lucky" in the sense that my incident happened at 10,000 ft so I had lots of time ti "wind my watch" and decide how best to implement the procedure. The decision that it was going to be a CAPS pull was obvious and instant, but the actual emergency lasted almost somewhere between 5 and 10 minutes as I glided down looking for a safe place to pull. I hope this helps but happy to talk it through if that would be useful. |
Thank you , perhaps one day you could make a PowerPoint based on your experience, which is rather exceptional, on the do and don'ts of pully a Ballistic parachute.
Of course having the emergency at FL100 helps a lot . For me . also as a glider pilot, I had always the idea that I would use it after a collision rather than an engine ( of prop) failure . In fact in my both clubs which are joint gliders/ powered Aircraft clubs , many bar discussion on using of BRS or attempting a landing in a field in case of engine failure generally ends in a 50-50% division. Most of us glider pilots would prefer to attempt a field landing rather than to use the BRS. For ,me . having few thousand hours on gliders , I would indeed prefer to attempt an out of field landing , because this is what I have been trained to do, and knows the rules. and am in control until the end. .But the reality is you probably do not know until you are in that emergency.and what kind of terrain , or water, is below you when it happens. A final note on one of your remarks about obstacles you did not see. You pulled at 3000 ft . at this altitude you cannot see the features and the obstacles of a field ,, the critical ones ( Electric wires, fences, ground slope, state of the field , etc..) are only really visible below 1000 Ft. . Also, as you know, the surface wind ( direction-intensity) can be very different from wind at 3000 ft , and then the size of the field becomes important,, but also in pulling the BRS at 3000ft, how could you be sure to land in the field you wanted ? no wind at all that day ? Before your story , If I had ever to use the BRS I would have said I would wait until 1000ft to have more chances to make the area I wanted, . Any reason why you choose 3000 ? In any case, seen the outcome, it was a good decision too ! :) |
Most of us glider pilots would prefer to attempt a field landing rather than to use the BRS. If I had tried to land I would definitely have ended up inverted with 250 litres of avgas for company. |
Originally Posted by Jonzarno
(Post 11333371)
Gliders are designed to land in fields, tricycle gear aircraft aren’t. Also gliders by their nature don’t carry fuel.
If I had tried to land I would definitely have ended up inverted with 250 litres of avgas for company. BRS is a great idea in situations like the one you found yourself in! Well managed, too! |
Originally Posted by Jonzarno
(Post 11333371)
Gliders are designed to land in fields, tricycle gear aircraft aren’t. Also gliders by their nature don’t carry fuel.
If I had tried to land I would definitely have ended up inverted with 250 litres of avgas for company. Anyway good for you to have pulled out the BRS ! |
But with a high wing aircraft you’re less likely to get trapped if the aircraft inverts.
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A big difference between gliders and airplanes is that you have much more think time in a glider that can be applied to field and landing spot selection. Spoilers come in very handy in touching down at the best possible spot.
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but is the Cirrus prone to get inverted ? https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....d9401c0fa.jpeg He died. This is what happened to me: https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....d3f2acd61.jpeg I was unhurt. |
Originally Posted by RatherBeFlying
(Post 11333522)
A big difference between gliders and airplanes is that you have much more think time in a glider that can be applied to field and landing spot selection. Spoilers come in very handy in touching down at the best possible spot.
@Jonzarno : Your 2 photos indeed show the difference. Very convincing . So pull the thing it will be . I rest my case . |
Jonzarno Your photograph shows what appears to oil residue around the cowling where the prop boss is meant to be, and that it was blowing back along the fuse.
It seems to me quite possible that it would have - or did - have an impact on forward visibility through the screen? I should think this a factor in the decision to operate the 'chute - after all if you can't see where you're going, or you suspect that's going to get a whole lot worse, then it certainly won't assist in a 'normal' field landing. Quite apart from that I wonder if you had a close look at the pointy end of the engine? Would be interested to know if you have any initial indication as to what let go. FP. |
Originally Posted by ATC Watcher
(Post 11333624)
So pull the thing it will be . I rest my case .
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....26ad8ea796.jpg |
Originally Posted by RatherBeFlying
(Post 11333522)
A big difference between gliders and airplanes is that you have much more think time in a glider that can be applied to field and landing spot selection. Spoilers come in very handy in touching down at the best possible spot.
Gliders are taildraggers. The main wheel is well in front of the center of gravity. Training: Glider pilots are drilled to do off field landings. Including spot full stall landing at min speed, slipping the plane (descending steeply without gaining speed), selecting fields (brown over green etc.), watching for the green islands indicative of power line masts, to name a few. Typical powered pilots are often lacking these skills.
Originally Posted by Jonzarno
(Post 11333544)
... unlikely to end well. This is what happened to a pilot who tried to stretch a glide rather than pull:
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....d9401c0fa.jpeg He died.... |
Originally Posted by First_Principal
(Post 11333663)
Jonzarno Your photograph shows what appears to oil residue around the cowling where the prop boss is meant to be, and that it was blowing back along the fuse.
It seems to me quite possible that it would have - or did - have an impact on forward visibility through the screen? I should think this a factor in the decision to operate the 'chute - after all if you can't see where you're going, or you suspect that's going to get a whole lot worse, then it certainly won't assist in a 'normal' field landing. Quite apart from that I wonder if you had a close look at the pointy end of the engine? Would be interested to know if you have any initial indication as to what let go. FP. 2. I have a picture but, for some reason, it won't upload, here is a link to it: https://share.icloud.com/photos/007Y...uknNn45mAemwcw |
Originally Posted by spornrad
(Post 11333811)
Training:
Glider pilots are drilled to do off field landings. Including spot full stall landing at min speed, slipping the plane (descending steeply without gaining speed), selecting fields (brown over green etc.), watching for the green islands indicative of power line masts, to name a few. Typical powered pilots are often lacking these skills. In my view that is the main point. If you are not trained and accustomed to always judging any ground you see in terms of ability to land on it or not, it is a huge missing puzzle piece. In my previous gliding club they had an engine failure at fairly low altitude on a refueling flight with their tow plane (no winch launches possible on their field, therefore towing is the only way). Full fuel load, not much time to check, low wing tricycle gear plane, Robin DR-300. They were able to find such a good landing spot that the engine could be swapped on the same field and the plane could be flown out of there after the swap was done (with proper authorization of course). If one doesn’t have that skillset and the option of a BRS, of course it is the best option to pull it. |
Jonzarno,
Well done, You were confronted with a serious emergency and you kept your cool, Devised a well thought out plan, under extreme duress and time constraints, and then executed it successfully. You should be proud of yourself. |
Originally Posted by spornrad
(Post 11333811)
If you don't know when not to pull the stick pulling the BSR is clearly the better option.
By pulling BRS you prevent getting into the situation where shortly before touchdown you notice an ugly obstacle which might force you into a deadly mistake. That said it is not an easy decision to accept knowingly significantly damaging your plane by pulling the chute (confirmed by not few instances of planes with BRS that nonetheless fatally crashed). High marks from me for decision making to the pilot in this case. |
Originally Posted by pants on fire...
(Post 11332339)
They flew to Bruges! I wonder if this will make it into Private Eye? :)
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