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Originally Posted by runway30
(Post 10373633)
I have to say that I am absolutely astonished that the Cardiff Manager has admitted to being flown by the pilot. I’d like to know the circumstances of that flight. However in the same context as Sala, why would the team manager know any more info regarding the legal admin details and qualifications of a chartered aircraft than his players? I think it highly likely he’d go to a associate/company with experience of ‘charters’ to arrange a suitable flight, and assume he was being provided with a safe/legal/expeditious/cost effective trip. We’ve seen in the thread from a customer of what may be similar flights, that that assumption is an easy step to take. |
The exact wording used by Mr Warnock in his conference which isn't quite as definitive as reported by French media:
'.......Warnock made exactly the same journey as Sala when he returned from watching the striker play for Nantes. “I’d been on a couple of planes like that, but I think the ones I went on might have had two engines,” he said. “But I do think I had that pilot [Ibbotson], who I thought was a fabulous pilot. I just can’t comprehend it.....” |
Human factor
Not sure what to make of this. There’s a big play on weather around the islands at the time of flight. He asked for a decent from 5000 to 2000. Now correct me if I’m wrong. Not being as experienced as some of you guys. Surely a bad decision to start. But a route of that length would have been in the upper levels? So would have been clear of most icing on route. Also. There was no mayday made. This indicates something more than icing to me. Not to get a call out? Sorry if I’m sounding dim on this. I’m sure a correction will come shortly. Also was he adequately rated for the flight? responses welcom. |
and when you go missing, no-one will have a clue where you are. I do agree though, that that is a privilege of private flying. Once the flight is in any way compensated, the passenger should be entitled to suitable tracking, as they have purchased a transportation service, with expectations of public assistance, should it be needed. The public emergency services (whom we pay by taxes) should be able to accomplish their role with reasonable efficiency, meaning more rescue than search. If you've kept your location private even to emergency services, you have surrendered efficient (or even any) rescue. A pilot has no right to put a passenger in that situation. |
Originally Posted by Pilot DAR
(Post 10373706)
I choose to always have someone (a responsible person, by the legal definition) know where I am, even in my plane. The difference is that I choose who knows where I am, not everyone knows where I am. When I select altitude on the Transponder, and having told my family, everyone who needs to know where I am, does. I don't like the idea that random computer users could track my private whereabouts.
I do agree though, that that is a privilege of private flying. Once the flight is in any way compensated, the passenger should be entitled to suitable tracking, as they have purchased a transportation service, with expectations of public assistance, should it be needed. The public emergency services (whom we pay by taxes) should be able to accomplish their role with reasonable efficiency, meaning more rescue than search. If you've kept your location private even to emergency services, you have surrendered efficient (or even any) rescue. A pilot has no right to put a passenger in that situation. But, how do you square that away with maintaning Electronic Conspicuity at all times to avoid risk of collision? When I go sailing solo - yes, of course I give a loved one a rough ETA - "If I'm not alongside and texting you by 2200 hrs then put the balloon up" but flying - I think we need to inhabit the space we fly in for all to see - electronically - as far as we can with at least Mode S, and ADS-B, etc, etc. Why wouldn't we? Apart from cost - which I know is bloody expensive, but what price...? How do you justify this Electronic Silence - unless you're thouroughly back country? Not having a go - genuinely interested. |
I do wonder on what basis the Cardiff City Manager can assess DI as a fabulous pilot.
What utter dribble some people speak. |
Originally Posted by MPN11
(Post 10373738)
I do wonder on what basis the Cardiff City Manager can assess DI as a fabulous pilot.
What utter dribble some people speak. |
Originally Posted by brentford77
(Post 10373684)
Correct me if I am wrong, but complex does not immediately in itself require a type rating? I fly an N Registered E400 which is a very similar aircraft in terms of capabilities, performance etc to a non turbine PA46...and there is no type rating required on mine. I have also on two occasions used flight sharing sites and accepted passengers when I was flying longer international legs and was more than happy to have some company en route. (Dons tin hat...) I do not have any commercial qualifications, nor do I aspire to. Simply a PPL & IR.
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Originally Posted by MPN11
(Post 10373738)
I do wonder on what basis the Cardiff City Manager can assess DI as a fabulous pilot.
What utter dribble some people speak. But seriously is this not the problem. The passenger just sees the outcome (land at destination) and has not idea how ‘good’ the operation was that got them there. |
Originally Posted by ChickenHouse
(Post 10373692)
I think now is a moment to stop speculating, keep quiet and leave some time to the investigators. The public surfaced facts are already enough to hold breath. |
I do wonder on what basis the Cardiff City Manager can assess DI as a fabulous pilot. What utter dribble some people speak. However, there is always the chance he may have confused his pilots........ |
Originally Posted by Daysleeper
(Post 10373746)
bit like me trying to assess a footballer and nearly as much dribble. But seriously is this not the problem. The passenger just sees the outcome (land at destination) and has not idea how ‘good’ the operation was that got them there. I would be reluctant to even consider a day VFR x-Channel hop in a SEP. We did once half-consider something from JER-UK ... and decided the risk was simply too great. BA, A-319, JER-LGW, even if it means the Red-Eye at 0705 before a longggg TATL ex-LHR later in the morning. |
Originally Posted by Daysleeper
(Post 10373746)
bit like me trying to assess a footballer and nearly as much dribble. But seriously is this not the problem. The passenger just sees the outcome (land at destination) and has not idea how ‘good’ the operation was that got them there. |
Trislander01 and/or jsypilot , would either of you care to comment on the kind of flights to and around the CI I've mentioned upthread?
I'm still wondering which regulatory/certification boxes my VFR-day flights as a passenger fit into (or don't). One, joining a UK-Guernsey flight at a specifically arranged stopover in France on an N-registered SEP, no common purpose, some sort of payment arranged by third party; the other, a Guernsey-France flight that was unmistakably a 'taxi' run, G-registered SEP, paid for in the same manner as the other flight by the same third party (my client). Is one of these 'greyer' than the other, and if so, why? Can you confirm/deny that either or both of these flights with passengers paying something would be common practice in the CI and what the thinking there, if any, is about safety/risk/compliance issues? Is it an example of hoping that longstanding custom establishes a legal precedent? |
runway30 wrote:
The PA46 310P is on the EASA list as requiring a specific type rating. Class rating SEP (land) for PA-46-310P (Malibu), PA-46-350P (Malibu Mirage), and PA-46R-350T (Malibu Matrix). Difference levels for the PA-46R-350T (Malibu Matrix) have not been evaluated. Differences training which is not further specified, was established by the JAA between the Piper PA-46-310P (Malibu)/PA-46-350P (Malibu Mirage) and the PA-46-500TP (Malibu Meridian) aircraft. |
Originally Posted by BEagle
(Post 10373763)
runway30 wrote:
That is incorrect - from the 23 Jan 2019 edition of the EASA type rating and licence endorsement list flight crew: So for anyone who hasn't flown a PA-46-310P before, the only requirement is for 'variant familiarisation' - which doesn't even need to be with an instructor. |
IF Dibbo descended into what he thought would be warmer air ( we know he was cleared down from 5000 ft) - We know he disappeared from radar at 2300 ft _ how do we know he didnt continue on track for many miles ( perhaps hitting the water at low level and a shallow angle with no horizon for a VFR pilot to follow / see) and the aircraft is MUCH nearer the mainland coast ?
Given its very odd that we have no radar traces - I thought CI radar could " see" us on SVR clearances " not above 1500 ft "............. |
Originally Posted by red9
(Post 10373793)
IF Dibbo descended into what he thought would be warmer air ( we know he was cleared down from 5000 ft) - We know he disappeared from radar at 2300 ft _ how do we know he didnt continue on track for many miles ( perhaps hitting the water at low level and a shallow angle with no horizon for a VFR pilot to follow / see) and the aircraft is MUCH nearer the mainland coast ?
Given its very odd that we have no radar traces - I thought CI radar could " see" us on SVR clearances " not above 1500 ft "............. ATC never said he went below radar coverage. They said they lost him off radar which is different. May be wrong, but I think radar coverage goes lower than 2,300 off Alderney. Certainly the Aurigny flights to Alderney don't come off secondary radar, if they did they would not be tracked on say FR24. . Can't speak for primary radar. This would imply he went down pretty close to the loss of radar contact. edited to say, thinking about this further, Alderney is visible from North of Jersey, therefore around Alderney radar coverage must be at or nearly at sea level |
Someone highlighted that there have been 228 Malibu accidents as a statistic, now statistics are there to be used or abused for whatever purpose.
If the flight had taken place in a King Air you would all be saying " The King Air is a very capable aircraft well suited to this kind of trip " but if you look at the accident statistics of the King Air it shows 410 King Air accidents in the same database as the 228 Malibu accidents are listed in. |
Quote from the Cardiff City Manager saying he wished the footballer hadn’t travelled to Nantes. “I do keep thinking back, I said to him ‘why don’t you come up to Newcastle and watch us play tomorrow and have a look?’ “You’re now asking yourself should I have made him come up, because it’s after the event, but he wanted to go back and see his teammates, and family, and get his belongings for the following week so that’s what happened. “I just thanked him and off we went, you know.” A Premiership football club isn’t a corner shop. They have a duty of care to their employees. If they drove him from the airport to the training ground in a company car they should have checked the licence of the driver and given him a set of rules related to the use of the car. So how is aviation any different, how can you just absolve yourself of any responsibility? I know the club position is that they aren’t responsible because the player made his own arrangements. However all the parties involved had contractural relationships with each other. I have also read the argument that passengers don’t have enough knowledge to know when they are at risk. Well these are multi million pound organisations, so if you don’t have enough knowledge to know what a licensed air carrier is or don’t want to buy in that expertise, then send your employees by scheduled flight. |
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