Cardiff City Footballer Feared Missing after aircraft disappeared near Channel Island

[DaveReidUK]

Originally Posted by freshgasflow

The Air Accidents Investigation Branch (AAIB) said in a report that toxicology tests found a high saturation level of carbon monoxide in Sala's blood.

Higher than the level generally considered to be potentially fatal, in fact.

Given the layout of the Malibu, it's likely that the pilot was similarly affected to at least some extent.

[Pilot DAR]

CO exposure could certainly affect pilot performance and judgement. A long time ago I was the passenger in a C150 which was later found to have a faulty muffler. I have no recollection of the pilot landing the plane, I recall riding in the right seat, and then waking up lying in the grass under the wing after we landed. The pilot said I had turned very red, and began to loose consciousness, so he landed back. Darned luck thing he did, as he was being affected too, just not as fast as I was. The certification requirement for the Piper Malibu would require that the CO concentration in the cabin air not exceed 50 PPM in flight.

[atakacs]

Wow this is a major development. I guess they will have to dig out the aircraft next...

[Water pilot]

Alarms are not expensive at all, they should be required equipment. In my state (Washington) all bedrooms are required to have both smoke and CO alarms and many companies make combination alarms. They are available in AC, DC, or battery powered, some with 20 year batteries. Unfortunately I have not found any DC alarms that would announce "Carbon Monoxide alert" in English, yet another high pitched beep that you have to figure out is not as useful as I would like, but better than nothing.

[S-Works]

Interestingly I suspect this digs an even deeper hole for the “Aircraft Manager”.............

[Camargue]

a spot on a card. in the dark? that will work well! so whilst the findings dont exonerate the legality of the flight, loss of capacity does go some WAY explain the crash

[MPN11]

Originally Posted by Camargue

a spot on a card. in the dark? that will work well! so whilst the findings dont exonerate the legality of the flight, loss of capacity does go some WAY explain the crash

Perfect storm, I would say. Under-qualified pilot affected by CO = doomed.

I will leave it to wiser heads to comment on the possible cause (maintenance?), and the frequency of such occurrences.

[runway30]

If the illegal act wasn’t the cause of death then that gets him off the hook

[cats_five]

Originally Posted by Water pilot

Alarms are not expensive at all, they should be required equipment. In my state (Washington) all bedrooms are required to have both smoke and CO alarms and many companies make combination alarms. They are available in AC, DC, or battery powered, some with 20 year batteries. Unfortunately I have not found any DC alarms that would announce "Carbon Monoxide alert" in English, yet another high pitched beep that you have to figure out is not as useful as I would like, but better than nothing.

In the UK, it's easy to buy a domestic battery-powered CO detector. I'm guessing those would work just fine in a cockpit.

[pzu]

Recently on Discovery? Here in UK

Ironically - Discovery ran this a couple of nights back

https://www.adn.com/aviation/article...sh/2016/03/16/

PZU - Out of Africa (Retired)

[BFM]

Originally Posted by Jonzarno

Another point is that CO poisoning is much less likely if the engine is being run lean of peak as that allows complete combustion of the fuel so that CO is not produced.

Please do not believe this, as it is NOT true. All internal combustion engines produce carbon monoxide. Indeed, all naked flames wil produce small amounts - it's an inescapable fact of combustion. The problem with carbon monoxide is that when breathed in it avidly attaches to haemoglobin as it appears just like oxygen to the haem moeity. Unfortunately, unlike oxygen which floats off readily, once attached the carbon monoxide is very difficult to remove, typically taking 4 hours in air to dissociate. Thus small concentrations in air gradually accumulate to much higher concentrations in the bloodstream. Once the carbon monoxide is there it prevents oxygen now being transported round the body and this will lead to headaches, nausea, vomiting, fitting and death.

I repeat. All internal combustion produces carbon monoxide which is lethal. Please do not suggest anything different.

[funfly]

Did the footballer not text something indicating that all seemed not well? if so could this have been the result of a partially incapacitated pilot?

[skyrangerpro]

A shocking development. And one that would have remained unknown had one of the victims not been recovered.

[MPN11]

Originally Posted by runway30

If the illegal act wasn’t the cause of death then that gets him off the hook

An interesting alternative perspective. Inappropriate qualifications disregarded, due to tech malfunction? The Lawyers will enjoy playing that game.

[Auxtank]

Very nearly 100 pages of this thread and no-one saw that coming.

Goes to show; speculation is futile.

Go on the known facts for cause.

[Auxtank]

Originally Posted by atakacs

what other explanation do you have for that high carbon dioxide?

Three words; "In flight event".
I meant I wanted him to cite evidence that the aircraft wasn't maintained properly - as he stated.

Manifolds have blown in flight - leaking CO in to cockpit - not as a result of lack of maintenance, other events have occurred - in flight - to precipitate CO emissions in cockpit, etc.

It's a fool-hardy comment that feeds the bloody media that are watching this thread looking for any tit-bits to report. It's irresponsible, dis-respectful and downright un-professional.

Like I said earlier - let's go on the facts.
Advice, seemingly somewhat wasted on this thread.

[Chronus]

Icing was considered earlier in this thread. Now that CO poisoning has emerged, it follows that a failure in the alternate air supply may have been involved. There was an AD in Feb 2009 on the alternate air control linkage. I cannot conceive any other circumstance other than alt air selection which in such a short period of time may have led to cabin air contamination so as to prevent action such as actuating the cabin dump, switch and pull the cabin pressurisation control out, turn on vent fan and turn off cabin air recirculation fan.

[air pig]

Originally Posted by MPN11

Perfect storm, I would say. Under-qualified pilot affected by CO = doomed.

CO pooisioning may affect even the best quailifed pilot as its effects are insidious in onset.

[Edward Teach]

Originally Posted by Auxtank

Very nearly 100 pages of this thread and no-one saw that coming.

Goes to show; speculation is futile.

Go on the known facts for cause.

Not on this forum, but a friend of mine actually did suggest pilot incapacitation, very early on. He is very experienced on this type (and the jetprop version) and said it should have been capable of that flight, so something just didn't add up for him. Turns out he might have been right!!

ET

[WHBM]

Originally Posted by Chronus

… so as to prevent action such as actuating the cabin dump, switch and pull the cabin pressurisation control out, turn on vent fan and turn off cabin air recirculation fan.

Do you think that a pilot with this amount of experience on type would be able to recognise the CO contamination and then perform all these as memory items ?