Cardiff City Footballer Feared Missing after aircraft disappeared near Channel Island

[WHBM]

Originally Posted by Chronus

Which means Nantes FC short of 15m.

Well, if he player was still on their books, he will still be covered by their life insurance which they must have for key personnel ... unless it's like our corporate insurance, which specifically stipulates (I looked) that it includes "Travel by scheduled airline service, and by multi-engined charter aircraft".

I wonder how many Malibu (or Pilatus) pax have that condition.

[Geriaviator]

Yes, insurance is the key point to stress here. As I posted earlier our business insurance excluded aviation except as passenger on multi-engined aircraft operated on an AOC. Current rates for personal life assurance are about £12 extra (over and above normal premium) per £100000 life cover per month. So a typical PPL holder OR PASSENGER with £300,000 mortgage will pay about £36 extra per month or go without insurance cover.

I wonder how many Wingly etc. passengers realise their families could be left penniless and homeless should their flight end in disaster? I think the CAA which tolerates these illegal charters under the guise of cost sharing should at least point out the financial risks. In my 26 years of flying I knew of two such fatals, and in those days any form of payment was illegal except for licensed commercial operations.

[skyrangerpro]

some more reporting on the legal situation today:

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/...tract-15941596

[Chronus]

Whatever the legal outcome may be, the most outstanding and critical aspect of this will remain as to how it came to pass that 17million euros worth was trusted to be placed in the hands of an unknown quantity. Was it just incompetence, ignorance, favors owed or know somebody who knows somebody who is, dare I say the name, a Jimmy will fix it I guess it will all be revealed when the whole mess ends up in the courts, sooner or later.

[Mike Flynn]

Once again the club has implied that David Henderson was running a charter operation.

Cardiff want to ascertain the exact tie-up between football agent Willie McKay and Nantes, plus his involvement on arranging the doomed flight for Sala.

McKay says he contacted David Henderson to arrange the flight - an experienced pilot who, McKay says, had flown him and many of his players throughout Europe on countless occasions. However, McKay insists he was not involved in selecting either the plane or the pilot.

It's unchartered territory, but Cardiff want the following three questions answered:

1. Who has liability for Sala being on a flight with a pilot who held a private pilot's licence which does not permit carrying passengers for reward?
2. What was the condition of the plane?
3. Why was it flying at night across the largest section of the English Channel?

Henderson has avoided the press but he may well find avoiding CAA prosecutors will not be so easy.

It will be interesting to see where and when the Gamston based Malibu was flown in the months leading up to this tragedy.


https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/...tract-15941596

[The Old Fat One]

Interesting what you chose to highlight from the article Mike.

I go with this...

Meanwhile, high-profile London QC Michael Mansfield has also been brought on board by the Sala family to look after theirs and Emiliano's interests.

MM is a total legal eagle monster.

All involved with this tragedy can look forward to their arses being well and truly exposed in a court of law. And that includes the CAA.

[SimonS]

Originally Posted by The Old Fat One

MM is a total legal eagle monster.

All involved with this tragedy can look forward to their arses being well and truly exposed in a court of law. And that includes the CAA.

Indeed.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-wales-47749265

[MPN11]

Originally Posted by SimonS

Indeed.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-wales-47749265

All one can say is, "You read it here first, on PPRuNe".

Of course, Media interest will fade quickly, given some 'other things' going on, but at least it's nice to see some of the 'facts' going into the open. Slightly tidier reporting would be nice, rather than random paragraphs, but that's just my pedantry.

[vanHorck]

To me the fact that the pilot was in breach of his license (commercial, night) is no longer the issue, it will be undoubtedly listed as a breach contributing to the crash, possibly following the "aviate" issue of spatial disorientation and/or icing. What is more important is that this high profile case is an opportunity for the CAA to clamp down on grey charters and bring us back to what the law intended. Commercial is commercial, private is private, and introducing the FAA "common purpose" would be a good start.

[Dan Winterland]

Our industry has always had this line that it would take one famous person to be killed in an aircraft accident for it to come to the fore

Dave Edwards
The Air Charter Association

Now that this has occurred, we can expect something to be done. Whatever defence the grey charter operators offer, I suspect it will not withstand the onslaught of a private action headed by one of the UK's foremost QCs.

[Chronus]

Originally Posted by Dan Winterland

Now that this has occurred, we can expect something to be done. Whatever defence the grey charter operators offer, I suspect it will not withstand the onslaught of a private action headed by one of the UK's foremost QCs.

"" GREY CHARTER OPERATOR" It is this falsity that has given rise and a common acceptance that similar to many branded goods traded under this term that such services as aircraft charters are not fakes, not illegal but cheaper than the branded goods or services. I do not consider this term acceptable to describe and convey the correct sense of what it really it is. In my view the whole thing is an illegal operation and everyone who has been involved in it should face prosecution. The law needs to be strengthened to deter all those so involved, starting with the owner of the aircraft, ending with the pilot and all those in between who have been part of the whole chain. That will put an end to it once and for all.

[Mike Flynn]

Agreed Chronus.

I imagine he will be targeting the club,agent and David Henderson.

Apart from damages there will be substantial costs.

[PDR1]

Originally Posted by Chronus

The law needs to be strengthened to deter all those so involved, starting with the owner of the aircraft, ending with the pilot and all those in between who have been part of the whole chain. That will put an end to it once and for all.

The law doesn't need to be strengthened; it just needs to be enforced. The law we have is sufficient, but to date its policing is pretty minimal. I'm expecting that to change, but given the huge increase in CAA responsibilities that will come after Brexit anyway it may be a struggle to fund the required enforcers.

PDR

[Chronus]

Originally Posted by PDR1

The law doesn't need to be strengthened; it just needs to be enforced. The law we have is sufficient, but to date its policing is pretty minimal. I'm expecting that to change, but given the huge increase in CAA responsibilities that will come after Brexit anyway it may be a struggle to fund the required enforcers.

PDR

Perhaps not, but as you correctly express it, enforcement is needed. Does that involve more boots on the ground. I would have thought not. Not in these days of computers and high tech stuff. Even HMRC have now had their way and imposed the so called Making Tax Digital (MTD) to tackle tax dodging and tax fraud, all to the cost of the small business community. So why not take a leaf out of the taxman`s book and do something similar with the PPL log book. Mandate monthly electronic filing of it and if it shows a trend of flying more than working, say as a plumber, then pay the bloke a visit and check his bank account. In addition there could be a record of where they have been, whether it was night or day and weather conditions at the relevant times. No cost to the regulator, plenty of it to the likely candidate. It might redress the balance with the mountain of paperwork that a legitimate charter operator has to maintain to make a half decent living out of the job.

[Pittsextra]

What authority does the CAA have to check bank accounts and which bank account?

[Maoraigh1]

"Mandate monthly electronic filing of it and if it shows a trend of flying more than working, say as a plumber, then pay the bloke a visit and check his bank account. In addition there could be a record of where they have been, whether it was night or day and weather conditions at the relevant times. No cost to the regulator, plenty of it to the likely candidate"
Cost to EVERY PPL! Cost to the pilot of an Evans VP2, a Turbulent, or a Fournier.
Airport records should already be sufficient for detecting the likely aircraft types.
Caveat emptor would be better.

[Chronus]

Originally Posted by Maoraigh1

"Mandate monthly electronic filing of it and if it shows a trend of flying more than working, say as a plumber, then pay the bloke a visit and check his bank account. In addition there could be a record of where they have been, whether it was night or day and weather conditions at the relevant times. No cost to the regulator, plenty of it to the likely candidate"
Cost to EVERY PPL! Cost to the pilot of an Evans VP2, a Turbulent, or a Fournier.
Airport records should already be sufficient for detecting the likely aircraft types.
Caveat emptor would be better.

Do forgive me Maoriagh, but how would you propose the public be made aware of what is in the package. Sort of the equivalent of ATOL, ABTA,endorsement for the PPL holder, or perhaps some kind of a tattoo on his/her forehead saying IR, IMC, Night and approved by CAA for cost sharing only, to be used only for common purpose.

[Chronus]

Originally Posted by Pittsextra

What authority does the CAA have to check bank accounts and which bank account?

Let`s look at it from this angle. If a PPL can clock up 100hrs pa, at an hourly cost of say £250 for something like a PA46 ( and that is erring on the low side) that`s £25kpa If on the other hand he is clocking up 900hrs pa that is £225kpa. In the first one that is serious money for a plumber to spend on a hobby. In the second that`s nigh well impossible, unless of course he is seriously rich and has some kind of eccentricity for working as a plumber.
So my reference to banks and bank accounts was merely intended for the regulators to be given authority to access suspects finances to consider and verify the purpose of their flying activities.
With the current stink over financing of terrorism in this country, see last Sunday`s Times, HMRC is getting a hammering for not sharing info with the security services and in consequence it is likely some changes in legislation over the current confidentiality rules being changed. Now if the CAA was to be given a spoonful of that sort of medicine, what would that do to the prospects of any likely lads who would like to exercise the privileges of their PPL s for other than just a bit of fun on a sunny weekend .

[Pittsextra]

I see the general point but an argument that simply links hours flown to income is far too crude because it overlooks other relationships that allow poorer individuals to fly way beyond that model.

However even if we accept the basics of your proposition i would never open up my financials in the way you suggest it is totally unacceptable anyway and that is before you expand the argument to the ability of the CAA to manage that data well or the qualifications of the people working at that organisation to be trusted to have visibility of such information.

Then it over looks the lottery winners, children with a large trust fund, bank robbers, drug dealers, people trafficers or those good at gambling. Some of those activities might be distasteful but that isnt the business of aviation.

Yet how would it catch those flying conmercially?? Your logbook shows 900hrs you show bank account A with appropriate income from what? You could tell CAA enforcement it was from drug dealing and what are they going to do? whilst bank account B is all the money you get paid by clients for flying them around.

as has been said there is already adequate rules they just need the authority to enforce them.

[ShyTorque]

As already stated by others, the legislation is already in place but seldom enforced. Drivers tend to speed on roads where there are no speed cameras.