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Midair Collision Near Waddesdon

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Midair Collision Near Waddesdon

Old 17th Nov 2017, 23:27
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Sadly there are occasions when both aircraft are in each others blind spots and there is no chance to see and avoid. In busy uncontrolled airspace the holes in the swiss cheese will eventually line up and a rare unavoidable accident will happen.
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Old 17th Nov 2017, 23:57
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Originally Posted by bobstay
It's always busy near WCO and I know I've been guilty in the past of paying too much attention to pointing passengers at the Rothschild palace and not enough to a sharp lookout.

Hoping against the odds for a positive outcome.
Well done, you e made it into the Daily Mail.

Is it possible the registration confirmation also came from here with a stock photo?
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Old 18th Nov 2017, 06:32
  #43 (permalink)  
 
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Whenever a tragedy such as this occurs there is criticism of the press.

People lose their lives in accidents every day and these are reported with pictures.

Motorway crashes spring to mind.

Increasingly social media often break stories first.

There appears to be a certain group that feel some sort of censorship should be imposed limiting what can be written or broadcast.

I see on another site the usual culprits are out attacking press reports.

Last edited by Mike Flynn; 18th Nov 2017 at 13:17.
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Old 18th Nov 2017, 10:04
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Well, if more time were spent by the press on checking accuracy rather than spouting total bolleaux just to be first to break the story and fill some column inches, the criticism would be less well founded.
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Old 18th Nov 2017, 13:01
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Originally Posted by Tay Cough
Well, if more time were spent by the press on checking accuracy rather than spouting total bolleaux just to be first to break the story and fill some column inches, the criticism would be less well founded.
In which case nothing would be reported until the AAIB report and inquests.

Breaking news is exactly what it says on the tin.

The two aircraft were quickly identified by social media and aerial pictures.

Everyone has access to sites such as Planefinder Flightradar24 and can post screen grabs.

Last edited by Mike Flynn; 18th Nov 2017 at 13:37.
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Old 18th Nov 2017, 14:56
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Out of interest, what area is defined as the local training area for Booker?
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Old 18th Nov 2017, 20:24
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Out of interest, what area is defined as the local training area for Booker?
When I learned there 'some time back' we'd work out west towards Westcott, sometimes as far north as Daventry, sometimes southwest over towards Didcot.

See Booker aircraft around WCO frequently so no real reason to suspect it's changed very much.
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Old 18th Nov 2017, 21:08
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What's tragic is the money being spent at £4000 a pop to replace perfectly good communications radios that improves safety not one jot, instead of the authorities mandating collision awareness equipment in all aircraft.
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Old 19th Nov 2017, 00:12
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Isn't the tower closed at Wycomb due to a controller shortage. Was going to go there last week but there was a notam about an ATC closure. Went to Blackbushe instead.
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Old 19th Nov 2017, 07:57
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Originally Posted by JammedStab
Isn't the tower closed at Wycomb due to a controller shortage. Was going to go there last week but there was a notam about an ATC closure. Went to Blackbushe instead.
Yes it is. It has no bearing on this accident though.
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Old 20th Nov 2017, 08:19
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Mid air collisions

Its many years since I last flew within the Wycombe Airpark area but has always stayed in my memory that the area in those days seemed very much overcrowded with a mass of a/c flying hap hazard in various directions and poor ATC although appreciate may have no bearing on the present tragic event. Nevertheless I made a mental note to avoid flying any where near Wycombe airfield when possible.
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Old 20th Nov 2017, 10:30
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RIP, those poor souls. There but for the grace of God go I.

We are all aware, the first and most import rule of airmanship, is lookout. With this in mind, how are we supposed to fly accurately, for flight test purposes/standards and keep a good lookout? You cant do both to the extent required. Something has to be sacificed. VfR on instruments? These days I get that impression.

Flying training now days seems to be orientated around airline type flying. We are and have been getting away from the basics for sometime. I would rather a student or pilot maintain a better lookout than accuracy in uncontrolled airspace, especially. I have flown with pilots who insist on covering the windscreen with newspaper ASAP after airborne. Some of them, very experienced Captains. How's that for airmanship?

My post does not point the finger at anyone in this case or others. There will always be collisions.

I am not qualified to comment on Helicopters but suffice to add, the visiblity is much greater from a Helicopter.

I am a little surprised to see Accidents and Close calls situated in the Non Airline Forums. Does this mean, "airline" personal aren't exposed to, or interested in the results of human faillings? I do wonder.

Last edited by Dan_Brown; 20th Nov 2017 at 14:02.
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Old 20th Nov 2017, 11:38
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pasir wrote:
...the area in those days seemed very much overcrowded with a mass of a/c flying hap hazard in various directions and poor ATC although appreciate may have no bearing on the present tragic event.
Particularly as Booker ATC only provides an Aerodrome Control Service, what exactly is your justification for that slur?

2 s
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Old 20th Nov 2017, 15:24
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IIRC, both Farnborough North LARS and London Information were unavailable on the day concerned (the Farnborough North LARS still is unavailable as of today).
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Old 20th Nov 2017, 16:56
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Particularly as Booker ATC only provides an Aerodrome Control Service, what exactly is your justification for that slur?
Seconded. I was a student at Booker and the quality of all staff including ATC, some of whom were ex LHR, was beyond reproach. It was a very busy airfield however IMHO, it prepared you well for encountering busy circuits at other airfields.


Mr Pasir, If you found it haphazard then you didn't prepare sufficiently well before arriving.
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Old 20th Nov 2017, 17:06
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Originally Posted by B Fraser
Seconded. I was a student at Booker and the quality of all staff including ATC, some of whom were ex LHR, was beyond reproach. It was a very busy airfield however IMHO, it prepared you well for encountering busy circuits at other airfields.


Mr Pasir, If you found it haphazard then you didn't prepare sufficiently well before arriving.
Thirded. The Daily Telegraph also needs reminding that this collision occurred 13 miles outside Wycombe ATC's area of jurisdiction, and that it has no relevance whatsoever. My wife is a DT subscriber. Given half the chance I would cancel it and reduce our expensive trashy recycling.
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Old 20th Nov 2017, 17:27
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Originally Posted by rsuggitt
IIRC, both Farnborough North LARS and London Information were unavailable on the day concerned (the Farnborough North LARS still is unavailable as of today).
Is this due to a controller shortage as well?
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Old 20th Nov 2017, 17:43
  #58 (permalink)  

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Originally Posted by rsuggitt
IIRC, both Farnborough North LARS and London Information were unavailable on the day concerned (the Farnborough North LARS still is unavailable as of today).
I think you might find that the non-availablity of both those agencies occurred after 1700Z.

In any case, neither agency could have provided anything more than a Basic Service. The accident occurred outside the area of responsibility of Farnborough North and London Info cannot give a Traffic Service at any time.

It must be said that the gap in the LARS coverage in the south Midlands seems to get ever larger.

Having checked the NOTAMs for my flights tomorrow I note that it's got larger still because the recently introduced service offered by EMA is not available due to staff shortages! Cranfield airfield is closed due to staff shortages... similarly, Coventry now has no radar service (or any other) either!
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Old 20th Nov 2017, 18:44
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I doubt air traffic services would have prevented this one in a million accident.

Pure fluke just like a driver having a heart attack as you approach his vehicle.
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Old 20th Nov 2017, 20:57
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Originally Posted by Jay Sata
I doubt air traffic services would have prevented this one in a million accident.

Pure fluke just like a driver having a heart attack as you approach his vehicle.
I donít know what the stats are but I reckon itís much more likely than one in a million!
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