Old 11th Feb 2015, 21:37
  #3194 (permalink)  
RetiredF4
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Germany
Age: 66
Posts: 782
Ok465
Thank you for your point of view, which is a valid one and it was not my suggestion to train the stuff like we did in UPT. I hated stalls and falls from the beginning and could not understand, how some could love that uncoordinated falling.

There are three effects influencing a successfull outcome, the procedural part, the type specific part and the physical part. While the first two can be trained in classrooms and present simulation systems, the physical exposure to the forces in a stall event from entry to successfull recovery can not be replicated in present sim, at least not that I know off. The german military uses one centrifugal gadget which is good for positive g loading, but afaik no good for the opposite.

My line of thinking concerning the failures in multiple accidents to break the stall by putting the SS or control column to the forward stop when necessary is, that the effects such an input would have during normal flying is preventing the crew to even think about it or to maintain that input long enough. There must be reason for that, and it is human not to deliberately go into unknown territory. Therfore as soon as some unloading is expierienced like it happened in AF447 case (see the Nz graph and compare it to the following pitch control input), it is followed immidiately by the opposite input to get rid of this unfamiliar unloading.

Exposure to such an maneuver in any suitable aircraft will aid in more tolerance to this physical effect and would provide some knowledge what to expect during such recovery. The real problem is, that this "Angst" already influences the early avoidance of stall entry in a negative way.

The sim for such training is just a box, a very clever one which can trick the senses in believing all kind of movement, but there is none where the g loads are generated in a usefull way. We all know that transport aircraft should be flown with minimal loadfactor changes, smooth and comfy for the passengers and that's the way aircrews are trained. But that does not help at all in approach to stall and stall recovery events, as the near past has shown.
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