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Old 27th Dec 2012, 22:29
  #121 (permalink)  
Squawk7777
 
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Grrr

The problem for me with the clear issues that Air France have is not cultural to the country at all, but is cultural to the airline. Everything I read to do with the fatal accidents which Air france have had indicate that they can not accept any responsibility, they always try to place the blame elsewhere i.e. with Airbus, or continental.
You mean like LH's crosswind landing in HAM, that the BFU later blamed on Airbus' manual?

Although I am sure that a lot has been done within the company behind closed doors to address the problems, I struggle with the fact that these are major safety issues and the problems need to be dealt with transparently. Pilots need to be able to look at Air France as an example and be able to say this is what they have done to deal with the situation. Korean air can hold its head up high and say this is what we did to create a safe airline. From what I can see at the moment Air France can not.
Define major safety issues. Luck (or the lack of) plays quite a role. If AF's accidents were cut in black and white then I would agree with you. Looking at the discussions of e.g. AF447 and the resulting changes in stall recovery procedures by many airlines and regulatory authorities it seems that the answer is not as clear cut as you would like.

Since you mention transparency: How transparent are AF's competitors? Where are those reports? What about Swiss(air)? Exempt from your statistic? Two flights I can think of with no survivors were flown by senior/training captains.

Think you nailed it. . lived 12 years in France, loved it, but I could still be frustrated by some aspects of the French mentality. I can certainly offer "being French" as a casual factor in a fairly high number of French accidents. . .. . . but, as you say, we are not allowed to say that in this blinkered/politically correct world we habitate.
Please, tell us more! Worked for AF? Seen their pilots work a flight while you were sitting on their jumpseat? Do you have copies of their SOPs? Sat in their CP's office while he disciplined some pilots? What can you offer besides a hint that you are an expert in la vie d'Air France?

Since you mentioned aspects of French mentality... What about the drinking mentality of a large island N of France? Ever considered alcohol (or the lack of) being a problem with British society? Finger pointing is easy, I could just say that many British aviators have a problem with alcohol. Fair, classy, just? Of course not. Be careful how and where you point your finger at.

B738Driver is the one that nailed it. Once again his quote:

Airbus and Boeing did not design their procedures based on societal cultures, and these are adopted by operators around the world.
Also some airlines have a great variety of origins amongst their ranks. SOP's are designed to make it work without consideration of their crews' culture.

Corporate culture is important, societal culture is not. Be careful, this is a dangerous territory! Let's remain politically correct.

Last edited by Squawk7777; 27th Dec 2012 at 22:58.
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