Draft AC 61-16 v1.0 - Spin avoidance and stall recovery training

[djpil]

Originally Posted by Stickshift3000

The take off and landing distance charts certainly are included in the PPL exam work book (link to work book below). Cessna may not use these charts but certainly some other manufacturers do (e.g. Piper).

https://www.casa.gov.au/sites/defaul...e-workbook.pdf

They don't actually. The CASA "P" charts include the effect of different runway surfaces and runway slope. Piper PA-28 charts look somewhat the same as those in the CASA workbook but they are only for a level, paved runway.

So, when a student goes off to a grass runway (perhaps with a bit of slope) to do the short field takeoff and landing for the PPL flight test - and as part of the test demonstrated determination of the distance required - where did that student get the takeoff and landing distances for a PA-28 on a grass runway? What will the Flight Examiner say about it, especially once Part 91 comes into effect?

The PA-28 manual states "Effects of conditions not considered on the charts must be evaluated by the pilot, such as the effect of
soft or grass runway surface on takeoff and landing performance,"

At least the tables in the Cessna manual state to increase the distance by 15% of the ground roll figure for takeoff on grass. For landing increase the distance by 45% of the ground roll figure. They're effectively just using the same information as the UK CAA in their https://publicapps.caa.co.uk/modalap...detail&id=1913

There is a big disconnect between pilot theory training, what CASA thinks and real aircraft operation.