Originally Posted by
ProPax
Towards what? EIS with whom? There are no orders for 175-E2.
They have no
firm orders but that's different from
no orders. Just a few days ago Embraer management forecasts that the 175-E2 will account for 1/3 or all E2s sold.
Obviously Boeing is very comfortable with the 175-E2s sales pipeline to green light the production start this week.
Well, if you look at it like this, it is a bad year... for now. However, in 2018 alone A220 got the same number of orders as the entire E2 program since 2011.
You're comparing a program that's in production vs. one that has yet to EIS. The E2 has roughly the same number of orders as the CSeries did at the same stage of the program (excluding "fake" CSeries orders which we knew would never get delivered but remained in the books, like the ones from Republic).
How did you figure that? How did A220 lost $900 mil?
From Airbus and Bombardier financial statements. Bombardier alone took a $600mm hit just to finally close out the Airbus transaction.
And it wasn't E2 that made 440mln. The entire Embraer company made that, and that includes parts, services, military sales, etc., etc.
Closely read what I wrote again. Only the
commercial division made profit last year (~ $440mm). You know, the division Boeing purchased.
Yes, there is. Airbus moved quickly and acquired the C-Series Ltd. as soon as they had a chance, while Boeing first rejected Bombardier's offer to cooperate on C-series, and was then caught napping when the aircraft market "suddenly" shifted from under them.
Revisionist history there. Don't forget that Bombardier
tried to sell the CSeries to Boeing first.
Ask yourself: if the CSeries was worth more than $0, why did Bombardier agreed to sell it to Airbus for $0?
On similar lines: in Canada, Bombardier's directors and executives have a legal fiduciary duty to protect shareholder value. So again, if the CSeries was worth more than $0, why did Bombardier shareholders not sue the directors for selling the program for $0?
The obvious truth is that the CSeries worth was negative. Both Airbus and Bombardier knew that even post acquisition they'd have to pump in another billion or two to make the program viable.
Embraer's commercial division, on the other hand, was and is a profitable ongoing business.