Originally Posted by
infrequentflyer789
Could pick some big holes in that (not least the "stall avoidance" description) but overall it sounds about right.
It neatly dovetails with some of Dennis Tajer's words that struck me in the 60 minutes video ( youtube.com/watch?v=QytfYyHmxtc about 16:30):
...a very strong signal to us that somewhere in there the philosophy had been tainted, poisoned...
and also the certification change covered in Seattle Times from DERs reporting to FAA to ARs reporting to Boeing management who then (after filtering - I've never known a manager who doesn't) report to FAA.
The whole
system failed from regulator downwards - and yes, probably pilots/training as well as you have previously stated. Your comment on stab trim runaway not being trained as it wasn't "statistically significant" also strikes me as relevant here, not because that is a bad thing per se, but because from an engineering point of view Boeing drastically (and entirely predictably) changed the probability of stab trim runaway from NG to Max and the
system (i.e. Boeing, FAA, operators etc.) did not propagate that information down to those who were basing training programs on a completely different event probability. Boeing, and indeed the industry as a whole, has a lot more work to do to fix this than just a bandaid on MCAS (or indeed a steel box round a battery - which issue shows that this is a continuing systemic problem not a one off).
I agree, the interview with Dennis Tajer (APA union) was the most interesting part of that video. There are text excerpts available:
https://www.9news.com.au/national/60...6-a0c47ddfe293
American Airlines veteran pilot Dennis Tajer told Hayes, “I called our safety experts and said, ‘Where is this in a book?" And they said, ‘It's not’.”
Tajer said the admission from Boeing felt like “betrayal”.
“This is an unforgiving profession that counts very heavily on the pilot's knowledge, background, and training, and there are lives depending on that.”
I can visualise a process something like this. A meeting between a manager, an engineer, and a pilot:
Manager: So if this new system fails, the pilots can handle it?
Engineer: Yes, there are procedures for that.
Manager: Pilots are trained to handle runaway trim?
Pilot: Er, yes. But it doesn't happen very often.
Manager: So, I don't see any problem...
Safety and training people: Not invited to meeting...