Originally Posted by
Trevor the lover
What about we all go balls to the wall, and then come in through initial and pitch - sort out separation on downwind???!!!!!!!!
That's essentially what they do at EGLL - it's the civvy version of an I&P. You get cleared to a close in holding fix (Lambourne, Biggin, Ockham & Bovingdon) with out any speed control - first in best dressed. They are about 15-25 nm from EGLL and would be the equivalent of the initial point. Approach then pulls you of the hold and hands you over to Director nicely spaced for the arrival sequence. That's the equivalent of the pitch.
As LeadSled and wasbones have already pointed out - sequencing arrivals a long way out doesn't work (too many variables). Sequencing close in does - EGLL is proof of the pudding. I'll add my voice to others: It's our ATC system that is broken. My most recent example would be arriving into Brisbane and when 15 minutes from the fix told to lose 5 minutes. Despite what some controllers might think, that's impossible - up in the high FL300s we would stall before losing the required amount of speed. We said unable. So rather than giving us vectors, we were put in a hold. We did two laps of the pattern. On BNE APP we were the only aircraft on frequency. At 6 miles final, there was one aircraft getting airborne and one taxiing aircraft approaching the holding point. We held 15 minutes for that!