[QUOTE=Olympia 463;10030370]Am I missing something? What kind of radar surveillance is needed for a bunch of up round and down operations? Which ATC gliders wandered far enough away from mummy to be of any interest to anyone else? ....... Yep looks like you did, the thread has moved on to speculation regarding the sudden stopping of AEF flying in Grob 115 Tutors announced late last Friday 19 Jan 2018 They do not require a radar service either though the receipt of one is recommended. I have occasionally encountered and joined ATC gliders in thermal and wave many tens of miles from the nearest ATC launch site. Mummy was nowhere to be seen.