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Old 17th Mar 2017, 23:15   #1 (permalink)

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LEVEL: New Low Cost long haul from IAG Group

IAG is making Norwegian shake hard with this big announcement today
First base BCN, more european bases to come. Vueling will be the natural feeder, while Norwegian is strugling to make a crappy deal with its own competitor Ryanair to feed its B787 fleet.
flylevel.com
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Old 18th Mar 2017, 00:19   #2 (permalink)
 
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FO s Norwegian long haul earn doble than a new FO in Level. They add two levels to the salary table, so new joiners entry in level 11 and their salary in the best of the case will be 3000 Euros flying long haul. While nobody touch BA.
That's IBERIA today a big sh...
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Old 18th Mar 2017, 00:21   #3 (permalink)
 
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Last Assestment of IBE they don't requested flying hours so you can imagine cadets crossing the Atlantic and landing in the main airports of USA.

My God!
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Old 18th Mar 2017, 00:40   #4 (permalink)

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Well Iberia pilots get 2 "pagas extras" per year and have far more social benefits than Norwegian slaves hired by OSM Moreover,iberia pilots transfering onto long haul fleet must have a full ATPL licence, so you wont see any cadets at all on the widebody fleet.
Anyway, I understand that Iberia pilots and cabin crew will launch this new airline for 12 months, but then there will be a proper AOC and proper staff and crews.
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Old 18th Mar 2017, 00:42   #5 (permalink)
 
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So, Level is a brand operated by Iberia. Will they have an AOC in the near future and recruit their own flight crews?
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Old 18th Mar 2017, 00:50   #6 (permalink)
 
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so the race to the bottom continues.......

question is, who's gonna go under first?
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Old 18th Mar 2017, 01:33   #7 (permalink)
 
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Why am I so reminded of what we used to apply to Ryan/Easy (back in 2002) "same different colour" . . . . kinda sums it up really. . . . . . .
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Old 18th Mar 2017, 03:49   #8 (permalink)
 
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The funny thing is that both RYR and EZY have become a sort of "legacy LCC's" offering pretty decent conditions (pay, rosters, training ) in comparison to what is now offered currently by new LCC's... oh, the irony!
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Old 18th Mar 2017, 08:10   #9 (permalink)
 
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If Iberia crews are flying these jets, will that be on Iberia contracts? Has anyone heard of what the terms and conditions for Level will be? Will they just be using agencies? I've no doubt the conditions will be market leading...
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Old 18th Mar 2017, 08:36   #10 (permalink)
 
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Originally Posted by seasexsun View Post
Well Iberia pilots get 2 "pagas extras" per year and have far more social benefits than Norwegian slaves hired by OSM Moreover,iberia pilots transfering onto long haul fleet must have a full ATPL licence, so you wont see any cadets at all on the widebody fleet.
Anyway, I understand that Iberia pilots and cabin crew will launch this new airline for 12 months, but then there will be a proper AOC and proper staff and crews.
The social benefits you get in IBE are after 3 years joining the company. And for getting the salary that had a normal FO before the new salary table was approved the new joiners have to stay 8 years in the company. The low cost company budget LEVEL for pilots and cabin crew is very low, so I doubt than a stablish FO flying long haul in IBE going to fly RH seat in Level keeping his salary. Probably they going to be offered LH seat BUT with less salary... you will see
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Old 18th Mar 2017, 08:43   #11 (permalink)
 
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If Iberia crews are flying these jets, will that be on Iberia contracts? Has anyone heard of what the terms and conditions for Level will be? Will they just be using agencies? I've no doubt the conditions will be market leading...
T & C are crab. They are recruiting directly through Iberia no agencies. And they are not requesting experience practically in the last Assestment. You join the company in Level 11 of salary 2500 to 3000 Euros for the first 3 years
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Old 18th Mar 2017, 11:11   #12 (permalink)
 
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Yep in fact they shy away from people with experience and too much life experience, they even look bad upon a guy with a degree if he is " too old "

They want fresh out of school 18 year olds with as fewer hours as posible.


They will put those in the a320s and will start moving senior guys to this one.
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Old 18th Mar 2017, 13:31   #13 (permalink)
 
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Just to tie in with samca's comment we have been told (elsewhere in IAG) that the flights will operated by mainline Iberia crews for at least the first year (i.e. internal recruitment of some form ) . No idea on how the T&Cs look.
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Old 18th Mar 2017, 14:02   #14 (permalink)
 
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I think we do have some idea, Wiggy ;-)
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Old 18th Mar 2017, 14:30   #15 (permalink)
 
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Ain't that the truth.......................I suspect the slide will continue
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Old 18th Mar 2017, 17:54   #16 (permalink)
 
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T & C are crab. They are recruiting directly through Iberia no agencies. And they are not requesting experience practically in the last Assestment. You join the company in Level 11 of salary 2500 to 3000 Euros for the first 3 years
Wow - that is terrible. For 3 years too? I am surprised the Iberia pilots would agree to this slap to the face if true... Makes NAI sound generous.
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Old 18th Mar 2017, 19:25   #17 (permalink)
 
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IB recent recruitment process is not for LEVEL or the A330. They are hiring for their short-haul fleet based in MAD. Transition onto the A330 (LEVEL or not) is done by seniority (a lot of people in front of the new joiners) and full ATPL required.

IB crews will be flying LEVEL A330s (possibly even under IB colors initially, as website says operated by IB), under IB terms and conditions with a few exceptions (FTLs is one of them, currently IB long haul pilots have a limit of 85h a month).

IB new joiners join on level 11, which is one of the worst in this industry (no better level if more experience, so same level for cadets or 10 year experience FO). It was agreed not far ago that promotion onto the A330 would mean transitioning to level 9, which is a quite better.

This might only be temporary. I would think future expansion will mean LEVEL crews under LEVEL contracts, possibly a lot worse than IB contracts (possibly similar to IB Express). However, that expansion is still unknown and unclear, as many Spanish people think this is only a temporary operation to kick Norwegian out of BCN. Iberia have done this in the past a few times with long haul operations from BCN (temporary ones) and Clickair, which was created to compete against Vueling, and then they both merged and are now part of the IAG group.
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Old 18th Mar 2017, 19:49   #18 (permalink)
 
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Originally Posted by Iver View Post
Wow - that is terrible. For 3 years too? I am surprised the Iberia pilots would agree to this slap to the face if true... Makes NAI sound generous.
IBE is not what it is was and never it will be
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Old 18th Mar 2017, 22:47   #19 (permalink)

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Iberia have a low scale salary for new joiners, but still, people who join are many to come from Ryanair, easyJet and Norwegian. Anyway, as it is already officially said by Willie Walsh and by the Iberia CEO, "LEVEL" will eventually be a proper airline and Iberia is just launching it for 12 months. Funny to read people her saying that terms and conditions will be crap, actually nobody knows yet. The expansion plan is to quicly get 30 aircraft and open more bases in Spain and Europe, such as Paris. I guess then the new "frenchblue airlines" will not be very happy to hear that. Same for Norwegian who is just opening a new b787 base in Paris.
IAG a very profitable group, all its airlines make huge benefits, Qatar has invested a lot of money in IAG, the battle will be interesting.
20 years ago nobody believed in Ryanair and easyjet. This industry is now repeating the revolution with low cost long haul.
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Old 18th Mar 2017, 23:14   #20 (permalink)
 
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Not agree with you, I don't know any single pilot of Ryanair who want to join in Iberia, at least from the last 3 years...
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