Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Flight Deck Forums > Tech Log
Reload this Page >

Global ADSB Tracking about to go live

Wikiposts
Search
Tech Log The very best in practical technical discussion on the web

Global ADSB Tracking about to go live

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 18th Apr 2017, 15:16
  #41 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The Winchester
Posts: 6,549
Received 5 Likes on 5 Posts
Yes they did! It was assumed that the data would be decoded only by land stations, and therefore only over and LOS from land. I engaged in a discussion with someone who said it would be useless in Northern Canada since there would be too many ground stations needed!
OK I see what you mean, I'm not sure who you were discussing it with but the concept of ADS-B via satellite has been around and progressing for a few years, anyone who said it wasn't possible was missinformed. This 4 year old pdf might be of interest.

https://www.faa.gov/about/office_org...cember2013.pdf

I think Malaysian and their service providers are claiming this is groundbraking because they are saying they are the first airline to tap in to it to have full time, real time data, with, it seems possibly an alerting function at head office, rather than ADS-B to satellite being a radical new concept...
wiggy is online now  
Old 18th Apr 2017, 15:46
  #42 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: CYUL
Posts: 880
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Our aircrafts have been tracked around the world in real time for as long as I can remember through Data link via VHF and satellite.

Last edited by Jet Jockey A4; 20th Apr 2017 at 12:28.
Jet Jockey A4 is offline  
Old 19th Apr 2017, 00:05
  #43 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: PA
Age: 59
Posts: 30
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
The 'system' concept is not new, but implementation is. Enough sats had to be put in place to make the coverage work, and even now, I dont believe the 88 have been launched.
Inmarsat has been marketing like crazy to get this service going.
A few things, the sat coverage, but the expense is what has really kept this from much wider usage, the airlines just dont want to pay for the service.
The position data sent thru the Ku band IFE systems has become much more popular, provides much more data, and is already costed in.

If there was ADSB-IN, then the aircraft could be a relay network in themselves....I think FR 24 is working on that.
underfire is offline  
Old 2nd May 2017, 16:16
  #44 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: North Railway Station
Posts: 7
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Attention, there are a lot of "will" in the article regarding the online tracking, with a resolution of 1 minute, of Malaysian planes. The text just says the country will be the first to implement such a revolutionary system, not that it has already tested it. The Aireon group of satellites it not yet operational. It will be in 2018.

KUALA LUMPUR and LONDON, April 18 2017 – SITAONAIR, Aireon and FlightAware today announced that Malaysia Airlines will be the first SITAONAIR airline customer to benefit from a revolutionary flight-tracking partnership. Under the agreement, all Malaysia Airlines aircraft will have access to minute-by-minute, 100% global, flight-tracking data, delivered by SITAONAIR’s AIRCOM® FlightTracker. ...
The Aireon service will be operational in 2018, shortly after the completion of the Iridium NEXT satellite constellation.

Source: https://flightaware.com/news/article...t-tracking/278

We have to wait and see.
We still do not know if such a tracking facility really works.

Even if Malaysia, which has a maximum of a few dozens planes in the air at a given time, will get the online position on the map for all their aircrafts, question still remain if the Aireon can be scaled up and became of real use for all the few thousands planes flying in the world at each moment.
ozon is offline  
Old 2nd May 2017, 16:44
  #45 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: North Railway Station
Posts: 7
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
"Iridium is currently developing, and is expected to launch during 2017 and 2018, Iridium NEXT, a second-generation worldwide network of telecommunications satellites, consisting of 66 satellites"
Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iridiu..._constellation

Aireon is based on Iridium NEXT.
See: https://aireon.com/services/global-a...-surveillance/
ozon is offline  
Old 3rd May 2017, 08:47
  #46 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: North Railway Station
Posts: 7
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I am afraid there will be a lot of false alarms that will render the new tracking system impractical. I mean a few times a week the Aireon’s technology, based on the Iridium NEXT constellation of satellites, will trigger alarms for airliners that have just disappeared in the middle of the ocean when in reality nothing serious happened. Expensive rescue mission will be initiated just to be canceled after a few hours.
ozon is offline  
Old 3rd May 2017, 16:54
  #47 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Reading, UK
Posts: 15,816
Received 199 Likes on 92 Posts
Do you have any evidence (at all) to actually back up that assertion?

If so, would you like to share it?
DaveReidUK is online now  
Old 4th May 2017, 01:40
  #48 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: North Railway Station
Posts: 7
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
This is about an incident when a false plane was artificially created and the presence of such a phantom negatively impacted, for 30 minutes, real flights.

"FAA Cautions about Transponder and ADS-B Testing
by Gordon Gilbert
February 27, 2017, 9:43 AM

Incidents of improper ground testing of transponder and ADS-B OUT equipment have resulted in false position information, including simulated altitude, being transmitted from the test aircraft and received by aircraft in flight. As a result of these reports, the FAA has issued a Safety Alert For Operators to advise them of the problem and recommend solutions.

According to the FAA, in at least one instance, an ADS-B OUT system ground test created a false airborne target that generated a TCAS resolution advisory (RA) to an airliner on approach. “Pilot reaction to this RA required unnecessary maneuvering in congested airspace and initiated ATC re-sequencing actions that affected multiple aircraft and negatively impacted operations in the area for about 30 minutes.”

The FAA advises repair stations and maintenance personnel performing transponder and ADS-B systems testing to evaluate the adequacy of their methods and adhere to proper test procedures, including antenna shielding, to prevent propagation of test signals that could affect ATC operations or airborne aircraft. Theagency also recommends that maintenance personnel be aware of any local requirements to alert ATC of impending testing and review guidance contained in relevant advisory circulars."


FAA Cautions about Transponder and ADS-B Testing | Aerospace News: Aviation International News

I have not found yet an example of rescue mission triggered by a plane that apparently disappeared in the middle of the ocean. I am still searching for such an incident.

Anyway, ADS-B is vulnerable to low cost jammers:
see: https://www.researchgate.net/publica...ible_solutions
ozon is offline  

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.