Could someone tell me a standard-ish take-off brief and the PNF calls for a B757 take-off, please? It's for an instructional video demonstrating an engine fire before V1.
Relatively new to the type and commercial flying too.
Haven't got time to pen a takeoff brief that I'd use but the PNF calls during takeoff in my company are:-
PF: "Set 1.2" (the engine EPR setting).
PNF (advancing the thrust levers): "Stabilised" (when the engines have spooled up and are stable).
PF: "EPR" (while pressing the EPR button on the glareshield - this advances the thrust levers to takeoff setting).
PF/PNF both start stopwatches.
PNF (monitoring instruments and adjusting thrust levers if needed): "Thrust set".
PNF: "80 knots".
PF: "Check" (verifying their ASI is agreeing).
Then, for a normal takeoff...
PNF: "V1".
PNF: "Rotate".
PNF: "Positive climb".
PF: "Gear up".
In the case of an engine fire prior to V1...
PNF: "80 knots".
PF: "Check" (verifying their ASI is agreeing).
PNF (noticing the malfunction): "ENGINE FIRE".
In my company only the captain can usually call "STOP" or "CONTINUE". In this scenario, with the fire warning happening before V1, the call would be "STOP" and, if s/he wasn't already PF for the takeoff, s/he would announce "STOP" and conduct the stop by closing both thrust levers, disengaging the autothrottle, monitoring the autobrakes and applying maximum manual braking if the autobrakes aren't functioning/are not fitted/etc., deploying full speedbrake and full reverse thrust. PNF monitors these actions and calls out any omissions then calls "60 knots", "<Callsign> stopping." to ATC and reminds PF of the wind direction so they can position the burning engine downwind to limit the risk of fire being blown towards the fuselage. When stopped the PF sets the parking brake and gives the PA "Attention cabin crew, on station.", PNF verifies that the parking brake is set, everyone takes a breather then el capitano directs the actions to take from then on...
I'm only really interested in the section of the take-off brief that relates to emergencies on the runway. The brief I would use would be "I'll stop for anything up to 80kt, between 80kt and V1 I'll only stop for a fire, a config warning or an engine failure. After V1 I'll continue the take-off'" Would that do?
For the emergencies part of the brief I would spout out (as an FO and PF) something like (again, this is the verbatim version, rarely used/appropriate for every single departure!)...
"As for problems along the way, if we have any significant malfunctions during push, start, taxi or on the runway up to 80 knots, you'll bring the aircraft to a halt and apply the park brake. I'll check the parking brake's set, speak to ATC and stand by with the QRH. For the takeoff itself, between 80 knots and V1, we'll only stop for an engine failure confirmed by two parameters, one of which should be on the EICAS screen, any fire warning, a predictive windshear warning (if fitted!), an obstructed runway or in the event that the aircraft is incapable of flight (the catch-all!). In the event of a STOP call, I'll monitor your stopping actions, call out any omissions, call 60 knots during the deceleration and put a stopping call in to ATC. I'll remind you of the wind direction if there's any indication of fire. Once stopped, I'll verify the parking brake is set, liaise with ATC and stand by with the QRH.
After V1, we'll continue the takeoff. You'll call "rotate", remind me that full go-around thrust is available if required and call "positive climb". I'll call "gear up" and then you'll cancel any alarms. There'll be no further actions until 400' AAL..."
After that I'd run through what my actions would be when airborne but it sounds like you don't plan on getting that far!
My brief usually consists of the following key points:
"Standard right hand seat departure on r'way xx at xxx (airport)." Standard day would be "Flaps 15, packs + bleeds on, no anti ice, dry performance figures."
If 752 then some captains like you to state that you will use a rotation rate of 2.5 degrees/sec up to 15degrees-the 753 is slower rotation.
Brief the departure/sid in terms of initial turns,stop/min heights, max speeds etc. Possible risks of low level alt cap at low stop heights, if speed intervene will be needed due to tight turns etc. Talk this through while confirming that you are both looking at the same plate and they are both valid. Discuss any constraints regarding departure in the fmc. There are often "hard" height restrictions in the database that aren't always needed, and can be removed.
Discuss how you have set the nav aids up, e.g having the VORs set for radials used in the SID, or if no SID the first en route airway? ILS freq set in case you need to return to runway straight away?
Talk through and confirm what you have set on the MCP - stop height, heading to fly etc.
What is MSA near the airport and to top of climb?
Emergencies: "Any problems during the start/taxy either of us can highlight it, you (captain) will bring the a/c to a halt apply the parking brake, for my part I will speak to atc,work through the qrh at your request or if need be put the cabin crew on stations"
"On the runway we will stop for any significant malfunction up to 80kts. Between 80kts and V1 we will stop only for any fire indication, engine failure confirmed by 2 parameters-one of which will be on EICAS, blocked runway,predicitve windshear or anything else that you judge to affect the safety of the flight"
Our company have a couple of different procedures for problems after V1 depending on the airport/runway. Generally though it will be something like: "Any problems after V1 then we will take the a/c into the air, the only actions below 400ft aal are for you to call positive climb, i'll call gear up and silence any alarms etc. After 400aal i will ask you to confirm the failure and carry out any recall items for that failure, pls remind me that max con power is available. At 1000ft aal i will ask for centre command, once engaged i'll select VS +200ft." Some procedures allow you to clean up and accelerate straightahead, others require a turn (for terrain generally). If a turn is needed then maintain V2 in first turn, use 15deg bank then clean up. Brief which modes you will use on the MCP for all of this. Discuss the hold in case required and whether you will come back to airport or head somewhere else...in terms of wx, engineering etc.
This is all pretty generalised stuff as different airports require very different briefs. Lots of variables can be briefed such as bad wx, a/c unserviceabilities etc. On the other hand if you have flown with the same individual a lot in recent days, the brief can be dramatically shortened
I hope this helps, feel free to PM me if you require any more specific info.
Cheers
FF
Last edited by fozzyflyer : 10th October 2008 at 17:52. Reason: Took me so long to type i was too late!
I'll stop for anything up to 80kt, between 80kt and V1 I'll only stop for a fire, a config warning or an engine failure. After V1 I'll continue the take-off'"
I guess this is SOP for large airline ops. In bizjets, we usually don't have the same problem with stopping so we often brief that we'll stop for anything prior to V1. Also in bizjets, generally either pilot can call for the abort and not take the time to announce the malfunction, since most bizjets accelerate much more rapidly than an airliner. Realize of course that in my compnay ops, we're talking about an airplane that only weighs 46,500 pounds, has a V1 speed of 115-117 and a takeoff distance of less than 6,000 feet.
I guess this is SOP for large airline ops. In bizjets, we usually don't have the same problem with stopping so we often brief that we'll stop for anything prior to V1.
I'm quite surprised to hear that your SOPS do not include the 70 or 80kt "stop for anything." In my experience it is used quite often in both airline and corporate operations, but obviously by not all.
While I agree that the corporate jets are likely to accelerate at a greater rate, they are (probably) more often used on runways of shorter length. This being the case, and especially in the wet, I would rather initiate a "stop" immediately upon first sight or sound of any warning, rather than investigate while continuing to V1. The only harm it can do at such a relatively low speed is cause a bit of extra brake wear, and time to replace the energy dissipation.
Although I don't fly the B757, and further, as I do fly the Lockheed L1011, and further, so have all of my other crew members, a very simple and straight forward 'takeoff briefing'. All of these folks have previously flown for a well known flag carrier in the middle east, so....
'Standard calls on departure' is fully understood, because we are certainly all on the same page of music.
Others, of course, might disagree, however, we have been at this job, on the specific airplane for well over twenty years...and IF you don't know the drill by now, you are....rejected at the HR department entry door. Or before.
Full stop.
PS: You are not briefing for a moon takeoff/landing, so exercise the KISS principle.
Never really understood the "runway xx at xxxxxxx airport" I know you need to cross check the runway with the plate but if you/the other crewmember need reminding which airport you are at then you have a bigger problem that probably wont get fixed by a briefing.
Pedantic perhaps but i'm lucky to have excellent OEI perf at all weights and european temps so I'd rather focus on where we're going to go which is where the terrain isnt principle of KISS is most applicable for most departures at most airports
PS im bizjet and use an 80knt call dry or 70knts wet or short.
but if you/the other crewmember need reminding which airport you are at then you have a bigger problem that probably wont get fixed by a briefing.
Precisely. Some folks go on and on and on and on...to the complete detriment of the operation. IE: if you don't know the standard drill by now, exit the FD and get behind a desk....at reservations. Do I sound slightly...harsh? You bet. Either wake up and smell the coffee or find another job.
I'm quite surprised to hear that your SOPS do not include the 70 or 80kt "stop for anything." In my experience it is used quite often in both airline and corporate operations, but obviously by not all.
While I agree that the corporate jets are likely to accelerate at a greater rate, they are (probably) more often used on runways of shorter length. This being the case, and especially in the wet, I would rather initiate a "stop" immediately upon first sight or sound of any warning, rather than investigate while continuing to V1. The only harm it can do at such a relatively low speed is cause a bit of extra brake wear, and time to replace the energy dissipation.
If the runway is wet or contaminated, yes the brief includes contingencies. We don't use runways shorter than 5,000 feet if they're wet. Unfortunately some corporate ops are not as standardized as airline ops...much to their detriment. The problem is that some ops don't use common sense. When I was instructing on the Falcon 2000, I gave a crew a significant electrical problem (the PF lost his panel) at 90 knots on an 11,000 foot runway. V1 was about 120-123. It was at night and 600 RVR. They took the damned airplane flying when the BFL was 3200 feet!!
You're so correct, it's about THINKING and once in a while, folks don't.
It isn't a case of not knowing the calls/drills, just being professional! Verbalising these things just before they may be needed in anger leaves them in the forefront of the mind. In our company the captain does a touch drill of actions required for an RTO when entering the runway. Lots of these guys have been on type for 20yrs+ and guess what, they have no problem with reminding themselves (and the FO) what they will do. Nobody sees themselves as SO experienced and SO familiar with things that they can be taken as read.
Familiarity breeds contempt!
As for a thorough brief being "to the detriment of the operation", not sure what kind of operation you are involved in but im glad that im not in it with you!
So am I. Lets face facts here. A brief review is quite OK, but some of the diatribes I have heard from some Commanders while I was performing line checks, would make for a long Hollywood film. A loooong one.
I can't really agree with you on the calling of the AD and RW. Fine if you are long haul flying with 6 sectors a month you will have everything chisseled into your brain, but if you are an RYR or EZY pilot you could be doing the same number of sectors in a single day (and not necessarily back to base after each sector). Now you are in an operation where you are carrying lots of plates with you, flying at an airport that has been pulled out of the hat of 40 or more destinations you could possibly fly to, there IS a propensity for error and the verbal check is an extra line of defence to ensure you are both singing/flying from the same sheet.
411, I agree with the KISS theory but only to a point - For you and your crews with decades on type perhaps it is fine, but in an outfit like FR you simply can't guarentee that the other guy is up to speed - Here in RIXland we have a revolving door of low hour FOs who benefit from the statement of the b**dy obvious, and snr Captains who have previously worked in other outfits with different SOPs (for some reason our SOPs are more than a little different to anything seen or heard of before). It is better to have a review of the obvious than have the RHS (or LHS for that matter) guy/gal sitting partially in the dark.
...have a revolving door of low hour FOs who benefit from the statement of the b**dy obvious...
In this particular case, I would agree. However, this is exactly what line training is for. Perhaps these revolving door types are simply not paying attention....
Fully respect your point of view, I appreciate your point. I did 5 sectors last weekend we'd planned for one maybe two and not once forgot where we were. We carry plates for the whole of Europe over our shoulders.
If its your "SOP" then you've just said the magic word, but to some it could seem a little superfluous. However the airlines you mention do employ low hours cadets (absolutley no problem with that.....) and if the training department thinks its a good idea then cest la vie.
Its frustrating to be told where you are though by somebody who although signed off to line struggles with memory items!!
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