BA LHR stand capacity
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Manchester, UK
Posts: 607
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
BA LHR stand capacity
On Thanksgiving BA moved two 789s to Manchester for temp parking - we're told this was due to the high number of planned cancellations.
It also doesn't take much for BA to divert arrivals when a backlog is created due poor weather, particularly snow.
So, with the imminent BA cabin strike possibly also resulting in parking issues, how many stands do BA have access to at LHR?
It also doesn't take much for BA to divert arrivals when a backlog is created due poor weather, particularly snow.
So, with the imminent BA cabin strike possibly also resulting in parking issues, how many stands do BA have access to at LHR?
How many stands? Not enough. On return (as pax) to T5 from Venice a couple of months back, we landed on time but then had to wait 45 minutes for a stand to become available. Something about p***ups and breweries?
During normal (non-disrupted) operations, almost all of the stands are in use almost all of the time. Yesterday, BA operated 630 movements at LHR and used 79 stands over the course of the day. That's called maximising the utilisation of your assets.
It would be hugely expensive to maintain a batch of spare stands to cater for the relatively few days per year (typically around 15) when things go pear-shaped.
Same applies to spare aircraft, spare runways, spare anything in fact ...
It would be hugely expensive to maintain a batch of spare stands to cater for the relatively few days per year (typically around 15) when things go pear-shaped.
Same applies to spare aircraft, spare runways, spare anything in fact ...
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Manchester, UK
Posts: 607
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
It wasn't really a 'spares' question and just wanted to understand where the tipping point was.
So basically, more than 70+ BA aircraft on the ground = some creative parking or movements elsewhere.
Cheers
So basically, more than 70+ BA aircraft on the ground = some creative parking or movements elsewhere.
Cheers
According to the AIP, T5 has 72 unduplicated stands, and then you need to allow for aircraft taxying in/out, plus the fact that BA also serve around 20 destinations from T3.
If I get time later, I'll do some sums to work out what the peak was for yesterday, which was a reasonably normal day.
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Near sheep!
Posts: 915
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Anyone that thinks an airline such as BA should have enough stands at their main Base to accommodate the majority of their a/c doesn't have a clue about aviation.
Could KLM do it at Schipol?
Could KLM do it at Schipol?
BA typically have about 70 aircraft (roughly a quarter of their fleet) on the ground at LHR overnight (not including aircraft in the hangars).
It won't come as any surprise that the number swells to just under 100 by around 0700, with both the early-morning longhaul arrivals and the first shorthaul inbounds mainly from European countries on CET.
From about 0800 the population stays pretty consistently in the 80-90 range until the late afternoon, after which it gradually declines to the overnight figure as aircraft depart for night stops abroad.
Obviously the count of aircraft on the ground at any point in time includes aircraft taxying in/out, holding for takeoff and being towed to/from the Engineering Base, so actual stand occupancy will be a correspondingly lower figure.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Manchester, UK
Posts: 607
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Strange that a simple fact finding question is interpreted as a statement on spare levels - it wasn't and I'm well aware of the 'spares' question (daily bus company dilemma).
Dave. Thanks for that the stats.
Dave. Thanks for that the stats.
It would be hugely expensive to maintain a batch of spare stands to cater for the relatively few days per year (typically around 15) when things go pear-shaped.
Same applies to spare aircraft, spare runways, spare anything in fact ...
Same applies to spare aircraft, spare runways, spare anything in fact ...
Take little Helsinki. One-fifth the number of pax that Heathrow handles. But they managed to justify opening a third main runway a few years ago, and also have a large remote parking stand. I've hardly been sent there, but on the couple of occasions when I have because the jetways couldn't handle us, all the ground support equipment and enough passenger buses have been sat waiting for us.
Someone at BA must surely notice that at their overseas destinations, overcrowded or not, the ground crew are invariably in place when the aircraft arrives, whether late, on time, or early, whereas at Heathrow in my experience it's a 50% chance you have to wait for people to turn up. "Waiting for a stand", along with "we're just a little early", or (more commonly), "we're just a little late" is a hollow call when the stand can be seen to be empty, along with others, and you are blocking those around waiting for the Stand Guidance to be turned on.
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Finland
Age: 77
Posts: 465
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
WHBM
I don't know how often you visit Helsinki but I think you look at it with rose tinted spectacles.
Yes, they do have a third runway, some distance from the main terminal.
Yes, it was opened not so long ago.
It is built in what was once a forest - bit different to Heathrow, very few lived there or for several kilometres around.
The airfield does have a large remote stand and I have used it on every arrival and departure, bar one, during the past year as the work in progress has severely reduced the number of gate stands.
The buses may turn up on time, the engineer may be there on arrival unless there is industrial action of some kind - alittle more frequently than in the UK.
Of course today it was -20 and when you get off the bus, at the remote stand, you may find it rather cold waiting your turn to go up the steps.
Be very careful when the snow has melted and refrozen as you may slip when you get off that bus (I've seen it many times).
I think Heathrow do very well compared to Helsinki with five times the number of passengers!!
I don't know how often you visit Helsinki but I think you look at it with rose tinted spectacles.
Yes, they do have a third runway, some distance from the main terminal.
Yes, it was opened not so long ago.
It is built in what was once a forest - bit different to Heathrow, very few lived there or for several kilometres around.
The airfield does have a large remote stand and I have used it on every arrival and departure, bar one, during the past year as the work in progress has severely reduced the number of gate stands.
The buses may turn up on time, the engineer may be there on arrival unless there is industrial action of some kind - alittle more frequently than in the UK.
Of course today it was -20 and when you get off the bus, at the remote stand, you may find it rather cold waiting your turn to go up the steps.
Be very careful when the snow has melted and refrozen as you may slip when you get off that bus (I've seen it many times).
I think Heathrow do very well compared to Helsinki with five times the number of passengers!!
Finncapt, I wasn't commenting on the issues around getting R3 built at Heathrow, more that the airport, and Finnish government, felt it worthwhile to design and build, and likewise all that remote stand capacity, when it had been commented that spare capacity was too expensive to provide.
** - Good to hear from you again, I think you may have been making PA's back to me in the cabin when I was a regular on the BA (New Zealand) DC-10s on LHR-LAX.
** - Good to hear from you again, I think you may have been making PA's back to me in the cabin when I was a regular on the BA (New Zealand) DC-10s on LHR-LAX.
I don't recall anyone saying that they should.
BA typically have about 70 aircraft (roughly a quarter of their fleet) on the ground at LHR overnight (not including aircraft in the hangars).
It won't come as any surprise that the number swells to just under 100 by around 0700, with both the early-morning longhaul arrivals and the first shorthaul inbounds mainly from European countries on CET.
From about 0800 the population stays pretty consistently in the 80-90 range until the late afternoon, after which it gradually declines to the overnight figure as aircraft depart for night stops abroad.
Obviously the count of aircraft on the ground at any point in time includes aircraft taxying in/out, holding for takeoff and being towed to/from the Engineering Base, so actual stand occupancy will be a correspondingly lower figure.
I am at Heathrow most days throughout the year and cannot understand that T5 is apparently at capacity. However during the Summer season Charters are given T5 capacity. As there seems to be no ryhme or reason to the T3 flights. IE aircraft type, or country of origin. One would think Charters could not be accomodated at the "Flagship" terminal. Just curious?
BA typically have about 70 aircraft (roughly a quarter of their fleet) on the ground at LHR overnight (not including aircraft in the hangars).
It won't come as any surprise that the number swells to just under 100 by around 0700, with both the early-morning longhaul arrivals and the first shorthaul inbounds mainly from European countries on CET.
From about 0800 the population stays pretty consistently in the 80-90 range until the late afternoon, after which it gradually declines to the overnight figure as aircraft depart for night stops abroad.
Obviously the count of aircraft on the ground at any point in time includes aircraft taxying in/out, holding for takeoff and being towed to/from the Engineering Base, so actual stand occupancy will be a correspondingly lower figure.
I am at Heathrow most days throughout the year and cannot understand that T5 is apparently at capacity. However during the Summer season Charters are given T5 capacity. As there seems to be no ryhme or reason to the T3 flights. IE aircraft type, or country of origin. One would think Charters could not be accomodated at the "Flagship" terminal. Just curious?
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: London (Babylon-on-Thames)
Age: 42
Posts: 6,168
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Charters are used to fill the gaps in the flying program when UK-EU business is quieter being, well the weekend! Isn't T5B and T5C devoid of wide body night stoppers for obvious reasons, i.e. BA's first wave of long haul is operated by aircraft that arrived earlier which leaves the totality of the short haul first wave, of about 30-ish aircraft? 70 seems high....? It seems ballpark accurate if you count everything parked at the BeaLine and West Bases as well though?
My figure did indeed include everything other than aircraft in the hangars on checks (i.e. excluding only those that hadn't flown for several days).
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Wor Yerm
Age: 68
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
One of the things that LHR does better than virtually anywhere else is dynamic planning. The Ops. Staff do the cooking equivalent of preparing an exotic fish, steak and fruit five course meal from a tin of beans. They do that because they appear to have a thin rules and procedures book but common sense in spades! I'm lucky because if the airport's chief executives had the same ability, I wouldn't have a job.
PM
PM
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Dubai and Sunderland
Posts: 818
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The main reasons I have give up on LHR & BA! In space of 12 months having arrived on time or even early then missing connection due having to wait for a stand! They don't appear to like changing a stand when things go wrong, on two occasions we sat over an hour waiting for 'our' stand whilst other inbounds went straight to stands?? The third time we waited 90min for BA to find a qualified A380 push back crew to push the A380 off 'our' stand, we only got a different stand because the A380 flight was cancelled due to crew hours!!
BA is a great airline away from T5 LHR!
BA is a great airline away from T5 LHR!
