US vs. Singapore (or Asia)
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US vs. Singapore (or Asia)
I'm not sure if this belongs to the North America or Asia forum since it involves both regions. Does anyone know if there are better opportunities in the US or Singapore for females to be hired by the airlines? Also, which country has a higher demand for airline pilots in the near future? I have to choose between US or Singapore citizenship (I'm not allowed to have both), and would like to have some insights on both countries' aviation industry. Thank you.
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US vs. Singapore (or Asia)
In US you will live like a slave. You will be flying small jets most of you're life by the time you get to a major (Boeing or Airbus) you're definitely going to run out of black hair. Pilots in regionals are treated really bad.
Singapore currently has few jobs but in near future it's going to open up big and most importantly Singapore license is as good as JAA/EASA. In Singapore you have a really good chance of getting you're first break directly into a major airline
Singapore currently has few jobs but in near future it's going to open up big and most importantly Singapore license is as good as JAA/EASA. In Singapore you have a really good chance of getting you're first break directly into a major airline
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Remember in the USA there is more to life than the mundane world of airline flying, lots of corporate jets work brings in good money and just like in the airlines sometimes a nice lifestyle.... its pretty rare to get a corporate job in Singapore
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Sport08, what are your credentials at this time? Where are you in your career? Your citizenship? If you are at the beginning, can't predict what the situation will be 5 years from now.
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(1)
There are some Singaporeans holding dual citizenships. (I am no kidding, holding two passports).
Hidden loop hole, to go around.
(2)
1. Singapore aviation industry does not favour the locals.
2. CAAS license is good to use in Singapore and Malaysia only.
(3)
In U.S., there are many flying jobs to build hours. Whereas in Singapore, got flying job for you meh?!
(4)
Singaporeans can't wait to get out and you are coming in? Do you know that every year there are many Singaporeans migrated? Singapore Gov't dare not to release the figure.
There are some Singaporeans holding dual citizenships. (I am no kidding, holding two passports).
Hidden loop hole, to go around.
(2)
1. Singapore aviation industry does not favour the locals.
2. CAAS license is good to use in Singapore and Malaysia only.
(3)
In U.S., there are many flying jobs to build hours. Whereas in Singapore, got flying job for you meh?!
(4)
Singaporeans can't wait to get out and you are coming in? Do you know that every year there are many Singaporeans migrated? Singapore Gov't dare not to release the figure.
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captjns, thanks for asking. I have FAA commercial single engine land, multi engine land, and single engine sea certificates. I have about 400 hours now, about 53 of which are in multi-engine aircraft. Unfortunately, I do not have any turboprop or jet time. I would have to convert my licenses to the CAAS ones if I want to work in SG, and the conversion process is long and expensive. I'm currently in the US doing my Masters in Aero Engineering, and graduate in Dec 2013. I was initially leaning towards staying in the US, but felt that the percentage of pilots who get an airline/corporate position is not that different from in SG. But I don't know enough about both industries to make comparisons, and so am trying to get other people's opinions.
Droste, I tried to find loopholes. But the SG govt said that they want to see proof of my US citizenship renunciation, so I can't find a way around that.
Droste, I tried to find loopholes. But the SG govt said that they want to see proof of my US citizenship renunciation, so I can't find a way around that.
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Believe it or not, Singapore is the only country in the whole world that gives permanet residency to foreigners like water. There is no other country like Singapore! Do some research, you'll know.
If you were to give up Singapore Citizenship, you still can get a blue i/c one day. Singapore Government mentioned that it has tightened the immigration. Bull****. I have reliable news from top ICA. The number of people getting blue/pink ic never changed. Foreigners are still swamping in like mad till this stage.
Your US Master Degree in Aerospace is demanding. Any coy in seletar will grab you. By the time, you want to apply for S'pore PR, don't tell me that difficult.
U.S recently relaxed it's immigration policy. Master Degree holders and above can apply for H1B visa. The USCIS rules begin to change. It is tough to get greencard/citizenship in the past but not difficult as it used to be.
There are vast of flying job opportunites in US. You can easily rack up the hours! For Singaporeans to build hours not easy unless you got an airline job. If you are a Singaporean and can't get airline job, you are grounded forever and you can't go back to the States again. By the time US Govt requires you to find a sponsor for your H1B visa.
If you were to give up Singapore Citizenship, you still can get a blue i/c one day. Singapore Government mentioned that it has tightened the immigration. Bull****. I have reliable news from top ICA. The number of people getting blue/pink ic never changed. Foreigners are still swamping in like mad till this stage.
Your US Master Degree in Aerospace is demanding. Any coy in seletar will grab you. By the time, you want to apply for S'pore PR, don't tell me that difficult.
U.S recently relaxed it's immigration policy. Master Degree holders and above can apply for H1B visa. The USCIS rules begin to change. It is tough to get greencard/citizenship in the past but not difficult as it used to be.
There are vast of flying job opportunites in US. You can easily rack up the hours! For Singaporeans to build hours not easy unless you got an airline job. If you are a Singaporean and can't get airline job, you are grounded forever and you can't go back to the States again. By the time US Govt requires you to find a sponsor for your H1B visa.
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In the us and most other countries, having a local cpl makes it easier to get a flying job. Though the pay may be low due competition for jobs.
In Singapore, trying to land a jet job without experience (jet hours) and type rating is almost impossible. Getting a instructing gig also impossible. You are better off without a license or with a ppl for airline self sponsored direct intake.
In Singapore, trying to land a jet job without experience (jet hours) and type rating is almost impossible. Getting a instructing gig also impossible. You are better off without a license or with a ppl for airline self sponsored direct intake.
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How about corporate pilot jobs in SG? Is it a feasible career option?
Additionally, are there any people who volunteer as pilots in SG? For eg. in the US, there's Angel Flight and Civil Air Patrol, is there something similar in SG?
SFC172N, yes one of my concerns is the pay for pilots in the US. I found out that the average pay is about 18-20k for regional pilots who already have many flight hours.
If regional pilots are getting that amount, I'm assuming that the pilots who are trying to build those flight hours must earn even less? I don't mind that since I get paid doing what I love, but I'm trying to understand how they support their families.
Additionally, are there any people who volunteer as pilots in SG? For eg. in the US, there's Angel Flight and Civil Air Patrol, is there something similar in SG?
SFC172N, yes one of my concerns is the pay for pilots in the US. I found out that the average pay is about 18-20k for regional pilots who already have many flight hours.
If regional pilots are getting that amount, I'm assuming that the pilots who are trying to build those flight hours must earn even less? I don't mind that since I get paid doing what I love, but I'm trying to understand how they support their families.
Last edited by sport08; 14th Nov 2013 at 21:18.
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Regional pilots? I know a guy who flies by day, and by night he works in a bar, and on his 2 days off he works as a tradie (construction worker). So much for minimum rest, FDP, etc.
Anyway, corporate jet jobs in sg are almost non-existant. In my whole time in WSSL all I saw is 2 old learjets with 9V on it. The rest of the jets had PK on them so they are probably Indonesian tycoons in sg shopping along Orchard Rd or going to the casino, ops, I mean integrated resorts.
Anyway, corporate jet jobs in sg are almost non-existant. In my whole time in WSSL all I saw is 2 old learjets with 9V on it. The rest of the jets had PK on them so they are probably Indonesian tycoons in sg shopping along Orchard Rd or going to the casino, ops, I mean integrated resorts.
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Sport,
My opinion would be to stay in the US. yes regional jobs pay crap as an FO but they're not too horrible as a captain. With the mass retirements coming up, if you pick the right regional you could be a captain relatively quickly. Regionals are also not the only option. There are lots of options. Some pay better than others, some have better lifestyles than others, some are better for career advancement than others, it all depends what you want. You don't have those options in Singapore. You've either got the SQ family, Tiger, or Jetstar Asia. Do SQ even take people who aren't ab initio cadets? While the pay is certainly better at those airlines than at US regionals, it is still low by international standards especially when considering the high cost of living in Singapore. Not to mention the lifestyle at those airlines is not ideal. Singapore is not exactly a bastion of employee and labor rights.
If you can figure out a way to keep both passports, at least for a few years my advice would be to try to get a job with Tiger/Jetstar in Singapore for a few years and then go back to the US. That should allow you to skip the US regional step and jump straight to a major or LCC in the US. If you're forced to give it up ASAP I personally would stick with the US. It might suck early in your career but you'll have far more options as you gain more experience. Starting out as a pilot is difficult and not very rewarding anywhere in the world right now, but at least the US has plenty of opportunities once you do have experience. Not to mention if you really do want to work in Asia in the future there is plenty of demand for experienced expats, sometimes even in Singapore.
Were you born in the US? If so I would think that even if you gave up your passport you should be able to get it back again later. That's just a guess though.
My opinion would be to stay in the US. yes regional jobs pay crap as an FO but they're not too horrible as a captain. With the mass retirements coming up, if you pick the right regional you could be a captain relatively quickly. Regionals are also not the only option. There are lots of options. Some pay better than others, some have better lifestyles than others, some are better for career advancement than others, it all depends what you want. You don't have those options in Singapore. You've either got the SQ family, Tiger, or Jetstar Asia. Do SQ even take people who aren't ab initio cadets? While the pay is certainly better at those airlines than at US regionals, it is still low by international standards especially when considering the high cost of living in Singapore. Not to mention the lifestyle at those airlines is not ideal. Singapore is not exactly a bastion of employee and labor rights.
If you can figure out a way to keep both passports, at least for a few years my advice would be to try to get a job with Tiger/Jetstar in Singapore for a few years and then go back to the US. That should allow you to skip the US regional step and jump straight to a major or LCC in the US. If you're forced to give it up ASAP I personally would stick with the US. It might suck early in your career but you'll have far more options as you gain more experience. Starting out as a pilot is difficult and not very rewarding anywhere in the world right now, but at least the US has plenty of opportunities once you do have experience. Not to mention if you really do want to work in Asia in the future there is plenty of demand for experienced expats, sometimes even in Singapore.
Were you born in the US? If so I would think that even if you gave up your passport you should be able to get it back again later. That's just a guess though.
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burnable gomi, Thanks for your opinion. I didn’t realize lifestyles at airlines in SG are not ideal. I always have the impression that the pay is good and the crew gets sufficient rest between flights as compared to what pilots in the US have. Additionally, aren't airlines in SG trying to dilute the foreign workforce? I thought that was why SQ was letting foreign pilots go. And yes I was born in the US.
By the way, out of curiosity, are there any civilian test pilot jobs in SG? If changes are made to an aircraft specifically for an airline either before or during its service period, do they get test pilots to conduct flight tests or is everything brought back to the aircraft’s original manufacturer?
By the way, out of curiosity, are there any civilian test pilot jobs in SG? If changes are made to an aircraft specifically for an airline either before or during its service period, do they get test pilots to conduct flight tests or is everything brought back to the aircraft’s original manufacturer?