South Korean pilot faker on the run
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People who fabricate experience need the full force of the LAW thrown at them ..
They defile our profession, further erode our standing and make potential employers suspicious of the "bone fide" ....
It amazes me that they get away with it ... there is always someone who knows someone etc ... even if it is 3 times removed. Aviation is a small world ..
I.Duke
They defile our profession, further erode our standing and make potential employers suspicious of the "bone fide" ....
It amazes me that they get away with it ... there is always someone who knows someone etc ... even if it is 3 times removed. Aviation is a small world ..
I.Duke
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Darn Slasher... You've got a magnet for Parker Drivers? LOL
We had 1 at Deer, now BCA that could not pass IOE, and was even scary in the right seat. I think he was Indian.
CP and other bosses asked me if this was usual. I said no way. Took the Co. a month to fig out and canned him.
We had 1 at Deer, now BCA that could not pass IOE, and was even scary in the right seat. I think he was Indian.
CP and other bosses asked me if this was usual. I said no way. Took the Co. a month to fig out and canned him.
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Yes Jota - in a previous employ the training dept was always
the last to know the guy's log book was Parker-penned when
it was blindingly obvious even to the airport cat.
I always had my susses that these guys somehow did a deal
that was attractive to the Co - eg lower pay or reduced T&Cs
- and that the training department, while all the candidates
resumes and log books appearing to be in order, sorta "held
hope" that they'd make the grade. Only when the very hard
objective evidence was in did they finally give 'em the arse.
the last to know the guy's log book was Parker-penned when
it was blindingly obvious even to the airport cat.
I always had my susses that these guys somehow did a deal
that was attractive to the Co - eg lower pay or reduced T&Cs
- and that the training department, while all the candidates
resumes and log books appearing to be in order, sorta "held
hope" that they'd make the grade. Only when the very hard
objective evidence was in did they finally give 'em the arse.
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Fake Pilot Name Mentioned
Hello World,
I posted his name for a reason and I know the facts. No personal vendetta, but when a pilot trys to falsify his credentials to get a job it is wrong. It lowers our credibility and guys like this should be named...!!! I want others to know his name in case he has faked it somewhere else. I would agree with you if i wasn't sure but this one I know the details.
Good Luck,
On Final
I posted his name for a reason and I know the facts. No personal vendetta, but when a pilot trys to falsify his credentials to get a job it is wrong. It lowers our credibility and guys like this should be named...!!! I want others to know his name in case he has faked it somewhere else. I would agree with you if i wasn't sure but this one I know the details.
Good Luck,
On Final
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Fake Pilots in China
Nearly 200 commercial pilots faked experience, China says
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September 09, 2010|By the CNN Wire Staff
A Chinese airliner takes off from the Beijing International Capital airport. False flying records are common knowledge among Chinese pilots, China Daily reported.
Nearly 200 commercial pilots in China falsified their flying experience, Chinese aviation officials have discovered.
The announcement follows one of China's worst plane crashes in six years, and highlights the high demand for pilots as the country has seen a boon in air travel.
Aviation officials began investigating pilot qualifications after the Shanghai-based China Business News broke the story. Implicated pilots have had their licenses revoked or have been ordered to take extra training, according to state-run media.
The investigation of pilot qualifications is part of an overhaul of airline safety, the Civil Aviation Administration of China said, according to the state-run China Daily.
China had its worst commercial airline disaster in years in August. A Shenzhen Airlines flight crashed in northeastern China, killing 42 people and injuring 54. Officials have not announced the cause of the crash.
The country's travel industry has boomed in recent years, as its economy has surged and personal income has swelled.
False flying records are common knowledge among Chinese pilots, China Daily reported, quoting a pilot identified only by his last name, Xu.
"The rapid expansion of China's civil aviation requires more commercial pilots, and the gap was usually filled up by those pilots who drive military aircrafts, but transferred to commercial flights," he told China Daily.
"These pilots were very likely to falsify their flying history in the military, since it is hard to track and verify. By doing this, they can get promoted more quickly in flying commercial airplanes," he said.
"The airline companies only keep half an eye on this, since they are happy to see more pilots certified by the administrative agency," added Xu, a commercial pilot with three years' flying experience, according to China Daily.
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September 09, 2010|By the CNN Wire Staff
A Chinese airliner takes off from the Beijing International Capital airport. False flying records are common knowledge among Chinese pilots, China Daily reported.
Nearly 200 commercial pilots in China falsified their flying experience, Chinese aviation officials have discovered.
The announcement follows one of China's worst plane crashes in six years, and highlights the high demand for pilots as the country has seen a boon in air travel.
Aviation officials began investigating pilot qualifications after the Shanghai-based China Business News broke the story. Implicated pilots have had their licenses revoked or have been ordered to take extra training, according to state-run media.
The investigation of pilot qualifications is part of an overhaul of airline safety, the Civil Aviation Administration of China said, according to the state-run China Daily.
China had its worst commercial airline disaster in years in August. A Shenzhen Airlines flight crashed in northeastern China, killing 42 people and injuring 54. Officials have not announced the cause of the crash.
The country's travel industry has boomed in recent years, as its economy has surged and personal income has swelled.
False flying records are common knowledge among Chinese pilots, China Daily reported, quoting a pilot identified only by his last name, Xu.
"The rapid expansion of China's civil aviation requires more commercial pilots, and the gap was usually filled up by those pilots who drive military aircrafts, but transferred to commercial flights," he told China Daily.
"These pilots were very likely to falsify their flying history in the military, since it is hard to track and verify. By doing this, they can get promoted more quickly in flying commercial airplanes," he said.
"The airline companies only keep half an eye on this, since they are happy to see more pilots certified by the administrative agency," added Xu, a commercial pilot with three years' flying experience, according to China Daily.
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This is a bit off the topic, but if you want to live in Asia and in particular in VN, you must deal with corruption at all level of dayly life. Purchasing a PhD degree is as easy as buying a fake Rolex or fake Evian bottle of water. Same goes for a Pilot licence, you have to pay 10 000$ US more for the left seat compared to the right seat.
The international and local Vietnamese media cover pages and pages hinting about corruption in VAC with things like this :
" The “shortcomings” in contracting pilots were announced by the aviation authority after it completed an inspection of VNA from November 10 to December 1.
The inspection of the carrier’s recruitment methods had been launched after controversy erupted over its hiring of a South Korean pilot who had apparently forged documents about his experience in flying Airbus 320 aircraft.
The Korean pilot failed to make a smooth landing when he was the co-pilot for a Vietnam Airlines flight in Busan, South Korea, in April. The Vietnamese chief pilot then had to take over the plane and landed safely." (http://www.thanhniennews.com/2010/pa...ng-pilots.aspx)
Another one :
VietNamNet - Vietnam Airlines
Here again :
" Vietnam Airlines had breached its own regulations in recruiting foreign pilots, the Civil Aviation Authority of Vietnam (CAAV) has found... CAAV inspected documents of 55 foreign pilots that VNA hired in 2010 and 2011 and found that their CVs do not comply with required form, while other documents had not been notarized and translated into Vietnamese as required... VNA directly contracted two foreign pilots in 2010 and 2011 – Huynh Ly Phuong Dong and Yong Suk Lee, but CAAV’s Quality Safety and Security Agency did not participate in assessing the pilot’s documents as required, inspectors found.
(Vietnam Airlines violating rules on hiring pilots - Vietnam news)
Many more news papers, websites, linked this recruitment flaws as another signs of corruption, arguing that the training was performed by VAC. Airlines in Vietnam finding it difficult to recruit pilots despite high pay Vietnamese airlines struggling to recruit pilots - eTurboNews.com
VAC assured that they will review their recrutment and training procedures of about 140 pilots. One does not need to read between the line to catch that the recruitment of local pilots are better run and does not to be investigated ? A quick look in Vietnamese pilot files would reveal too much of their own corruption so that the official report on the investigation may be totally unreliable and loaded with lies.
How could he escape VN while suspected of forgery and potentially accused of criminel charges if his exit was not facilitated by some authorities ?
Does anybody know what were their conclusion main lines ?
Do they target expat pilots only or do they include locals as well ?
Did anybody got fired resulting from the investigation ?
Thanks +++, fly high.
BayBong.
The international and local Vietnamese media cover pages and pages hinting about corruption in VAC with things like this :
" The “shortcomings” in contracting pilots were announced by the aviation authority after it completed an inspection of VNA from November 10 to December 1.
The inspection of the carrier’s recruitment methods had been launched after controversy erupted over its hiring of a South Korean pilot who had apparently forged documents about his experience in flying Airbus 320 aircraft.
The Korean pilot failed to make a smooth landing when he was the co-pilot for a Vietnam Airlines flight in Busan, South Korea, in April. The Vietnamese chief pilot then had to take over the plane and landed safely." (http://www.thanhniennews.com/2010/pa...ng-pilots.aspx)
Another one :
VietNamNet - Vietnam Airlines
Here again :
" Vietnam Airlines had breached its own regulations in recruiting foreign pilots, the Civil Aviation Authority of Vietnam (CAAV) has found... CAAV inspected documents of 55 foreign pilots that VNA hired in 2010 and 2011 and found that their CVs do not comply with required form, while other documents had not been notarized and translated into Vietnamese as required... VNA directly contracted two foreign pilots in 2010 and 2011 – Huynh Ly Phuong Dong and Yong Suk Lee, but CAAV’s Quality Safety and Security Agency did not participate in assessing the pilot’s documents as required, inspectors found.
(Vietnam Airlines violating rules on hiring pilots - Vietnam news)
Many more news papers, websites, linked this recruitment flaws as another signs of corruption, arguing that the training was performed by VAC. Airlines in Vietnam finding it difficult to recruit pilots despite high pay Vietnamese airlines struggling to recruit pilots - eTurboNews.com
VAC assured that they will review their recrutment and training procedures of about 140 pilots. One does not need to read between the line to catch that the recruitment of local pilots are better run and does not to be investigated ? A quick look in Vietnamese pilot files would reveal too much of their own corruption so that the official report on the investigation may be totally unreliable and loaded with lies.
How could he escape VN while suspected of forgery and potentially accused of criminel charges if his exit was not facilitated by some authorities ?
Does anybody know what were their conclusion main lines ?
Do they target expat pilots only or do they include locals as well ?
Did anybody got fired resulting from the investigation ?
Thanks +++, fly high.
BayBong.
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" Heard from ex KAL boys, now in the sandpit, that there was a young Japanese chap who claimed to be ex Airbus factory pilot who conned KAL and became a B777 captain for a couple of years before he was outed by some Taiwanese chaps who pointed out to the koreans that he was only an F/O in Taiwan, never a captain before he went to KAL. He then did a runner!
There were also stories of South African cruise captains who duped KAL to become full fledged captains on the 744. However because senior KAL management was involved they had to let their appointments stand for fear of massive " loss of face " not forgetting the public outcry were they to fess up. Also a few aussie f/os from the '89 disputes went to the backwaters of Africa and the Middle - East for a couple of years and turned up as wide bodied airbus and B747 classic captains in KAL. Again they were protected by expat management pilots in KAL, and for fear of complications the KAL management just did nothing even though the KAL pilot union reported it."
Ipo, This old post is still very pertinent to the present, keep going ! KAL expat management acts in totally opposite direction to VAC' attitude for similar issues. Both aim at "saving face" : while KAL put it under the carpet and protected its pilots, VAC puts expat pilots - and only expat pilots - on the spotlight as doctorklosee reported on the Korean faked pilot on 11/11/11.
VAC could not save it's face anymore.
I guess if the con pilots got promoted to captains and fulfilled the expectations for a number of years, their performance during those years must have been OK ?
Who could tell us about what was the results of VAC self-examination and the CAAV final report ? Knowing that both reports would be as faked as the Korean pilot, I am intrigued ! Thanks.
There were also stories of South African cruise captains who duped KAL to become full fledged captains on the 744. However because senior KAL management was involved they had to let their appointments stand for fear of massive " loss of face " not forgetting the public outcry were they to fess up. Also a few aussie f/os from the '89 disputes went to the backwaters of Africa and the Middle - East for a couple of years and turned up as wide bodied airbus and B747 classic captains in KAL. Again they were protected by expat management pilots in KAL, and for fear of complications the KAL management just did nothing even though the KAL pilot union reported it."
Ipo, This old post is still very pertinent to the present, keep going ! KAL expat management acts in totally opposite direction to VAC' attitude for similar issues. Both aim at "saving face" : while KAL put it under the carpet and protected its pilots, VAC puts expat pilots - and only expat pilots - on the spotlight as doctorklosee reported on the Korean faked pilot on 11/11/11.
VAC could not save it's face anymore.
I guess if the con pilots got promoted to captains and fulfilled the expectations for a number of years, their performance during those years must have been OK ?
Who could tell us about what was the results of VAC self-examination and the CAAV final report ? Knowing that both reports would be as faked as the Korean pilot, I am intrigued ! Thanks.
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Knowing how VNA "operates" I would think that this story needs a little more than just face value acceptance of a fake pilot? As someone mentioned in a post above, the viet "captains" (loosely termed) will not accept responsibility for their own actions and are on the look out to "blame" anyone and everyone for their lack of competence/qualification etc. when the weather is bad or if things look like they might be "difficult" these Heros call in sick every time.
If anyone is holding a "fake" or dubious licence, I would be looking first at the Vietnamese card carrying communists and all round back slapping mates club?
If anyone is holding a "fake" or dubious licence, I would be looking first at the Vietnamese card carrying communists and all round back slapping mates club?
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Hi Bay Bong.
If you new what actually happened at Pusan on this flight you might refrain from writing garbage.
Your facts are totally incorrrect and if you would like to know the truth maybe pm me.
If you new what actually happened at Pusan on this flight you might refrain from writing garbage.
Your facts are totally incorrrect and if you would like to know the truth maybe pm me.
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Hi Stork, I only cut & paste from Vietnamese news paper publishing in English, and other international news on the web. Did not invent anything.
What was so offensive in what I wrote ?
What was so offensive in what I wrote ?
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Knowing how VNA "operates" I would think that this story needs a little more than just face value acceptance of a fake pilot? As someone mentioned in a post above, the viet "captains" (loosely termed) will not accept responsibility for their own actions and are on the look out to "blame" anyone and everyone for their lack of competence/qualification etc. when the weather is bad or if things look like they might be "difficult" these Heros call in sick every time.
If anyone is holding a "fake" or dubious licence, I would be looking first at the Vietnamese card carrying communists and all round back slapping mates club?
If anyone is holding a "fake" or dubious licence, I would be looking first at the Vietnamese card carrying communists and all round back slapping mates club?
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Then there was that Swede 737 captain that had flown for over 13 years, 10.000hrs and aced all sim rides until the paperwork finally caught up with him. He had a PPL only. But by all accounts he was a very good pilot and his colleagues only had good things to say about him...
Talk about learning on the job!
Talk about learning on the job!
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No, what's really is sad is that 90% of the people commenting on this thread have completely missed the real point to this thread.
Has nothing to do with Korean pilot, funny.
Has nothing to do with Korean pilot, funny.
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Yes, that was my point too! Lots of fingers being pointed around at the moment with the latest incident I'm sure? I wonder what it could of been? Wrong type of rain? Runway in the wrong place? Substandard tyre rubber? Brakes faulty? Flight plan not having detailed enough instructions on how to actually land the plane on it??? Runway not notifying the capt that it was ending?
Hmmm? I wonder if it could of been the card carrying imposter on the flight deck???? Nah? Better rule that one out?
Hmmm? I wonder if it could of been the card carrying imposter on the flight deck???? Nah? Better rule that one out?
On my last flight over the captain could not even say the arrival time in English properly. Twice I heard him gabble and fake it.
The standard of English language of KE pilots has grown worse and worse over the 30 years I have flown with them, and now the SK govt is discussing cutting back on English teaching in schools.
The Chosun Ilbo (English Edition): Daily News from Korea - Gov't to Cut Down on English Teaching in Schools
The standard of English language of KE pilots has grown worse and worse over the 30 years I have flown with them, and now the SK govt is discussing cutting back on English teaching in schools.
The Chosun Ilbo (English Edition): Daily News from Korea - Gov't to Cut Down on English Teaching in Schools
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On my last flight over the captain could not even say the arrival time in English properly. Twice I heard him gabble and fake it.
The standard of English language of KE pilots has grown worse and worse over the 30 years I have flown with them, and now the SK govt is discussing cutting back on English teaching in schools.
The Chosun Ilbo (English Edition): Daily News from Korea - Gov't to Cut Down on English Teaching in Schools
The standard of English language of KE pilots has grown worse and worse over the 30 years I have flown with them, and now the SK govt is discussing cutting back on English teaching in schools.
The Chosun Ilbo (English Edition): Daily News from Korea - Gov't to Cut Down on English Teaching in Schools
Foreign pilots are also forced to use this same nursery school English level scripted PA religiously to avoid making Korean pilots look incompetent. The chairman claimed that Korean passengers complained about differences in contents of Korean language PAs with any non-scripted English PAs made by foreign pilots. That made the Koreans feel inferior.
The strange thing is that they are also very hesitant and seemingly incompetent in their own Korean language! I was in the cockpit for the landing in one case when we were instructed to go around and hold over a fix because of a disabled aircraft on the runway. In the holding, the Korean captain struggled trying to find the correct scripted PA; he couldn't find one in the Captain's PA booklet, became very flustered and almost lost the plot snapping at the F/O ( who also couldn't find the proper PA )...I told him just to make a simple impromptu Korean PA in simple Korean everyday language! He just couldn't or wouldn't !!! Making any English PA in that situation is out of the question.
I had to calm him down, saying that I would take care of the PA together with the purser...they ( the skipper and f/o ) just concentrate getting us safely on the ground in one piece. The purser managed to come up with some suitable Korean PA modified from a page in his PA booklet whilst I just made a simple English PA off the cuff.
I heard that shortly after that, they came up with policy whereby the captain delegates most of the PA involving unusual events to the purser who has a booklet covering most expected delays, etc. By then I was already out of that cuckoo's nest!
I get a sense of what you are saying, Bill, each and every time my grammar senses are grated with the identical set phrase: "Fasten your seatbelts due to turbulence!"
