GregA380

If you choose not to believe me that's up to you.

You could always go and ask the people who deliver the test instead. They don't bite.......then you will know for sure. Communication is the key!

Machfive

Now now..he/ she is only trying to help.

google88

the compass test is done during your flight grading.u will have a tech written (multiple choice) maths test and a lot of other stuff to do in compass test.its approximately 90-120 mins depending on the candidate. i am not sure if its the same for cadet program but i had to give the compass test when i was down there for the advanced entry flight grading.

chan1008

Hi Greg A380 , thanks for the info. I do believe you, in fact the exam format you described closely match from what I heard from the peoples who are waiting for a retest, mind sharing more detailed info on the new format? (Especially the area we need to pay attention)

Thanks for sharing

gone_with_the_wind

chan1008

Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Hong Kong
Posts: 4

I will attend the ICAO test soon and will know if anyone is lying.

rainbow_world

Hi, I was asked to send the application form by May 12, 2012 and I've still not heard back from Cathay. I wanted to ask about how long it takes for them to reply back?

lonestar2012

Hello guys,

I am invited for 2 nd interview in HK, and I am told to Re-Do reasoning test again, which I already did in my 1st interview. Has anyone been told to do Reasoning test again?

Thanks in advance.

orangeboy

Best would be to just confirm with them if you need to do it again through a simple email.

chan1008

gone_with_the_wind..
Well...Good luck with your ICAO exam, and hopefully hearing some feedback from you after you completed the ICAO^^

google88

yes there are a few guys who are asked to do the reasoning test again. nothing to worry about just do some online practice and u should be fine.

lucky86

No need to practice reasoning test.

Just do the test, and get out.

Don't pretend to be someone you're not.

kawcraft

Hey guys, im actually quite worried about the aptitude test.

ive search that some people recommended the cockpitweb and pilapt software, but they cost over 100 pounds?? are they actually worth it? are there any cheaper if not free alternatives/tips that anyone would kindly share?

Thanks in advance.

Michael Egerton

XLAN
GregA380's post was accurate and genuinely useful. Thanks for someone telling it like it is.

So XLAN, do you seem to dislike Aviation English organisations? Do you ever think that these standards are for your benefit and that you should be incredibly grateful to people that dedicate their time, experience and unique skill set to actually help people?

Or are you scared that companies like Aviation English Asia, have a very accurate impression of the very real lack of language proficiency among airline pilots.

ICAO English standards were introduced primarily for flight safety not to make money from poor HK locals who want to be pilots but think that focusing on English just for the test will help them.

I received abuse from Slade for 4 years. Some students betrayed me after being pressured by Slade. Slade evidently hates me, because we make him look incompetent. He is. And dishonest too. But I'm not the real victim. The real victim is the public that fly on these flights under the belief that current CX/KA pilots have an operational level of English. Brian Slade's interpretation of the ICAO LPRs in Document 9835 is so absurd that any competent member of a rating organisation would cringe. Here's an example "there is no grammar in the icao test, you just need a good structure- like a beginning, middle and end".

Thanks for this great advice Brian. I'll tell that to your children when they take their HKCEE.

Slade deserves to be publicly criticised on these forums not only because he is a liar, a defamer, and a fraudster peddling irrelevant and useless english classes that are completely inadequate for the purpose sold. He is exploiting the ignorance of Hong Kong people and the Chinese culture of bribery. Brian Slade and Marcus DeSantis have created a culture of intimidation, where pilots are afraid of losing their job for fear of reporting what happens.

If you think that bribing an assessor is an appropriate behaviour for a pilot then just go and give your money to Brian Slade, James Strang and Marcus DeSantis because honestly you would never ever enjoy what we do on our courses.

Do you want to know something else? Professional Aviation English teachers don't hang out in Starbucks or baptist university. We spend 8-12 hours a day talking to real pilots, ATCs and people in the industry. We learn and study aviation constantly. We have to, because we are pilots affected by the lack of language proficiency in commercial aviation too. But despite the need it's hardly a goldmine - it's incredibly difficult work.

Some days we don't even have time for adverts. But airlines like our values, and they like our students so to be honest our students are the best advert we could ever hope for.

ayau813

Hi. I'm a third year university student in the UK. Would it be too early to send out an application before I've actually graduated?

Also, how much do they expect you to know for the initial interview if you have had no aviation experience whatsoever?

Thanks

SloppyJoe

Are you being serious?

After 5 years at CX not once have I thought another pilots English was even slightly unsatisfactory.

How many years have you been flying for CX?

If the answer is none, which I think is highly likely, you need to wind your neck in as obviously do not know what you are talking about making comments such as that.

If someones English is not satisfactory I highly doubt they will only fail because of the ICAO test. The interviews are all in English, if it is not up to standard this is where the biggest problem with language skill will be.

Michael Egerton

No offence taken, but I do know exactly what I'm talking about and strive every day to solve these problems. There are five main reasons for the lack of proficiency.

1. The previous ICAO test did not test operational language and Slade created a washback effect wherein focus was on the test not on genuine language proficiency outside of the limit of the test. This incidentally had not changed in five years.
2. ICAO level 4 as a global standard is not exactly great. It is illegal for an airline to insist on a higher standard.
3. Culture
4. Attitude of language professionals that think they know everything.
5. Attitude of aviation professionals that think they know everything.

When you have first and second officers that can't distinguish "there are fumes in the cabin" from "there are films in the cabin", or can't distinguish common words you have a problem.

Interviews are sometimes a good tool for assessing language proficiency, and I do partially agree with you there, but there are some things that a need a language test with some scientific data behind it.

Also language proficiency can deteriorate - there are many reasons why. If your experience within CX has been different then good for you. I hope it stays that way, but please consider that there are language professionals that are trying to improve communications and changing the attitude of people that don't know what they don't know is our biggest battle.

ashdaman

Hey guys..
I submitted a application in June,but up to now not had any reply :-(
How long does it usually take for a response presuming you do if your unsuccessful???

orangeboy

Just be patient. Most people wait 6-12 months for an interview.

HKID holders or people with considerably more experience can normally expect a reply sooner (but not always).

Also depends on which program you have applied to and where you put your preferred location to be.

Michael Egerton

greatbattle

Ask to speak to Eric or Rachel. I will try to find a specific email and phone number for you. My understanding is that actual ratings were not given until you had received the offer and were about to go on your adventure weekend before Adelaide. I thought that you just got an invitation for an eye test or the next stage if you scored above ICAO level 4.

In my view everyone who got an ICAO level 1,2,3,4,5 or 6 in the previous test should consider that rating as worthless and not an accurate representation of their actual proficiency. If you get a 4 or above in the new test I believe that (based on recent data and those now involved) it is accurate. If you are ICAO level 4 in the new test, that probably means your English still needs work - it's the bare legal minimum to fly.

The ICAO level 4 standard was only set because a lot of old ex-military pilots in russia, china and south america had very little chance of reaching level 5 so the research group that initially advised ICAO settled on 4 as a reasonably achievable global level. Most of those guys already knew how to fly, they just needed to learn how to do it in English. For a Cathay cadet pilot you have to be capable of learning how to fly in English, plus a whole lot of other stuff that isn't in the ICAO descriptors.

If there is a delay in getting feedback, it's probably because of the massive overhaul needed of the system. They also need to retest current FO/SOs which is probably a higher priority than cadet icao tests. In the interim you can always message me, set up a consultation and I'll tell you informally if you are way below 4, borderline 3/4 or approaching 5 based on global benchmarks and a few things that you can or can't do.

Another point mentioning is that if you are level 3 that doesn't mean that you can't do more practice and then retry in 3-6 months. If that is the case you have more chance of getting a level 5 (well, you would if you are an AEA student). There is no pressure to do anything with a specific provider and you can take your time, prepare more and enjoy improving your English.

AEA students that spend 2-6 months doing classes maybe two or three times a week tend to do very well, and absorb a lot of Cathay character from our teachers.

kawcraft

Can anyone share how they prepared for the aptitude test?