Ridiculous CRM call for Help- I am in the Red Zone
This procedure is a classic example of theory vs practice, and particularly not thinking about the use of SOPs.
Inter-crew communication is a positive safety aspect in normal circumstances and to an extent as workload increases, but at some limiting point there may not be sufficient mental resources to identify a condition of being ‘maxed-out’ either in yourself or others, let alone communicate. Furthermore, human bias is to carry-on in the belief that you are able to manage and that what you are doing is adequate for the situation; but the situation or activity may not be understood because of cognitive limits.
Solutions involve planning ahead, workload management, and ‘strategic’ decision making, but of greater importance the organisational planning which could prevent crews being exposed to such situations.
There is a good description of the issue in the recent BEA ‘ASAGA’ study (sim section), around an eye catching conclusion that ‘the concept of CRM is flawed’ (something lost in translation), but does identify that there are relatively normal situations where the human can be limited and that there is little or no opportunity for intervention. http://www.skybrary.aero/bookshelf/books/2404.pdf
A similar example might be identified in the recent 737 accident report – http://www.pprune.org/rumours-news/5...o-terrain.html
This problem represent a more general view of SOPs which are promoted as a catch-all solution, yet SOPs only cover a limited range of situations, and more often only those which can be identified beforehand in ‘normal’ operation. Thus when crews encounter ‘abnormal’ (unplanned for) situations there is no SOP, and perhaps limited mental recourse to reconsider options.
Does the industry now expect too much from human intervention, are some normal operations now approaching a limit of complexity which is beyond the average human capability, and of course consider issues of the changes in training and experience (exposure) in these situations?
Inter-crew communication is a positive safety aspect in normal circumstances and to an extent as workload increases, but at some limiting point there may not be sufficient mental resources to identify a condition of being ‘maxed-out’ either in yourself or others, let alone communicate. Furthermore, human bias is to carry-on in the belief that you are able to manage and that what you are doing is adequate for the situation; but the situation or activity may not be understood because of cognitive limits.
Solutions involve planning ahead, workload management, and ‘strategic’ decision making, but of greater importance the organisational planning which could prevent crews being exposed to such situations.
There is a good description of the issue in the recent BEA ‘ASAGA’ study (sim section), around an eye catching conclusion that ‘the concept of CRM is flawed’ (something lost in translation), but does identify that there are relatively normal situations where the human can be limited and that there is little or no opportunity for intervention. http://www.skybrary.aero/bookshelf/books/2404.pdf
A similar example might be identified in the recent 737 accident report – http://www.pprune.org/rumours-news/5...o-terrain.html
This problem represent a more general view of SOPs which are promoted as a catch-all solution, yet SOPs only cover a limited range of situations, and more often only those which can be identified beforehand in ‘normal’ operation. Thus when crews encounter ‘abnormal’ (unplanned for) situations there is no SOP, and perhaps limited mental recourse to reconsider options.
Does the industry now expect too much from human intervention, are some normal operations now approaching a limit of complexity which is beyond the average human capability, and of course consider issues of the changes in training and experience (exposure) in these situations?
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This has to be an early April Fool joke. Surely every language has enough simple words to describe that you are approaching your capacity limit. When either the aircraft and/or myself are 'hot and high' I ask for more track miles, delaying vectors or more time. So do my colleagues. But what takes the biscuit are the canned pre-departure briefings. I wonder if these come in different flavours. Ones with windshear and cross-wind from the left. Others with a four and a half knot tailwind and a dodgy looking air start machine. But if this is true, it shows that the lunatics have taken over the asylum. And the name of the airline should be made public. It will allow me to give them more room - I wouldn't want to be responsible for driving them into the Amber zone. And I certainly wouldn't take the mickey on the radio. 
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What is the reason that the airline has to be kept hush hush?
Standard concern re companies and individuals.
(a) if you want to ID the entity then provide legally defensible evidence regarding the matter at hand and the PPRuNe grown ups can decide if they want the ID information provided on the site
otherwise better to avoid the potential for -
(b) incorrect information damaging reputations and
(c) providing an entre for legal redress.
Them's the rules.
If you have a vicarious need for the information by all means PM the OP .. just don't report the results in the thread unless you meet (a).
Standard concern re companies and individuals.
(a) if you want to ID the entity then provide legally defensible evidence regarding the matter at hand and the PPRuNe grown ups can decide if they want the ID information provided on the site
otherwise better to avoid the potential for -
(b) incorrect information damaging reputations and
(c) providing an entre for legal redress.
Them's the rules.
If you have a vicarious need for the information by all means PM the OP .. just don't report the results in the thread unless you meet (a).
Doesn't seem like a bad idea to me, it could be useful to have a formal way of telling the other guy that you have lost or are losing the plot. It does happen from time to time, BA used to use the phrase 'my bucket is full'.
We have emergency statements etc for when you think the other guy is performing badly so why not a way of telling the other guy about your own state of mind.
We have emergency statements etc for when you think the other guy is performing badly so why not a way of telling the other guy about your own state of mind.
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As was clearly described in the movie Airplane...
The Red Zone if for loading and unloading only. There is no parking in the Red Zone.
No, there is no parking in the White Zone, the Red Zone is for loading and unloading only.
Don't start with that Red Zone / White Zone s#&t again....
The Red Zone if for loading and unloading only. There is no parking in the Red Zone.
No, there is no parking in the White Zone, the Red Zone is for loading and unloading only.
Don't start with that Red Zone / White Zone s#&t again....
