nasty podstrike @ KLAX
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Here's a famous video of another Santa Ana wind freighter go around from the late 1990's where they aborted the landing at ONT and diverted to LAX:
https://youtu.be/wGe7__S01P4
https://youtu.be/wGe7__S01P4
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Clearly caused by a freak gust - presumably just put it down to experience, repair the pod and move on?
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What would be the consequence for the pilots in a case like this? Clearly caused by a freak gust - presumably just put it down to experience, repair the pod and move on?
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What would be the consequence for the pilots in a case like this? Clearly caused by a freak gust - presumably just put it down to experience, repair the pod and move on?
It is a shame that 'ambulance chasing' mentality has crept into our consciousness. In some people's mind, the "where there's blame there's a claim" attitude means that someone must always be at fault whenever there is an accident or damage. While it pays filthy lawyers and their grasping, scummy clients, it doesn't necessarily reflect what actually occurred and it certainly doesn't prevent re-occurrence. All it does is hide the truth, encourage the burying of evidence and make the world a significantly expensive and dangerous place to be.
I hope these guys are well defended by their union and their company use this a positive, but (very?) expensive learning opportunity. It's what properly run organsations do.
PM
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I am NOT privy to any of this - but: It seems extraordinarily unlikely that the PF would have his/her feet held to the fire in a western country for a gusting crosswind - if forecast within AFM limits.
Punitive action is the signature of immature management in a third-world country. Yes, it happens there, and it's a risk one engages when so employed.
Punitive action is the signature of immature management in a third-world country. Yes, it happens there, and it's a risk one engages when so employed.
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I am NOT privy to any of this - but: It seems extraordinarily unlikely that the PF would have his/her feet held to the fire in a western country for a gusting crosswind - if forecast within AFM limits.
A recent example of the feds pinging on exact callouts from the manual is with the 2013 Southwest 345 crash landing at LGA:
In addition, the captain did not follow SOPs at several points during the flight. As PM, she should have made the standard callout per the Southwest FOM when the airplane was above glideslope, stating "glideslope" and adding a descriptive word or words to the callout (for example, "one dot high"). Rather than make this callout, however, the captain repeatedly said "get down" to the first officer before stating "I got it." The way she handled the transfer of airplane control was also contrary to the FOM, which indicates that the PM should say "I have the aircraft."
Also, it appears to me that the FAA and NTSB harvest the 'non-pertinent conversation' portions of the CVR record much more than in the past.
Remember for years we were taught that the CVR only recorded the last 30 minutes, you could erase it and anything on it would only be used to promote safety and never for punitive purposes?
Now there are at least two hours of conversation on the CVR and if you turn onto the wrong taxiway after landing it can become a reportable incident with the whole two hours fair game for review. And, that erase button may or may not really work on some models of the CVR it turns out.
One thing the Polar crew has going for them is the fact that they were flying a freighter, not a passenger plane. Traditionally you could crash widebodies for years in the cargo business (e.g. FedEx and more recently UPS) and the public and media would have little interest or awareness since there was 'no significant loss of life' as a local official infamously once said.
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Regarding a couple of posts,
The drain mast on the bottom of the engine should always be checked on the walkaround as it is likely the first thing damaged and possibly the only visible damage from a pod strike. A VS pilot once discovered this during a walkaround according to a report I read.
As for erasing the CVR on the new solid state ones, I know of one incident where there was an overrun of a regional jet where the captain returned to the aircraft, powered up and erased. Little did he know that while the safety board could not read it, it could be returned to the manufacturer for retrieval of the recording.
The drain mast on the bottom of the engine should always be checked on the walkaround as it is likely the first thing damaged and possibly the only visible damage from a pod strike. A VS pilot once discovered this during a walkaround according to a report I read.
As for erasing the CVR on the new solid state ones, I know of one incident where there was an overrun of a regional jet where the captain returned to the aircraft, powered up and erased. Little did he know that while the safety board could not read it, it could be returned to the manufacturer for retrieval of the recording.
Not being a pilot I have no feel for how easy or difficult it is to land in these conditions. Is this situation down to bad technique - possibly as the result of poor training - or could it happen on any landing in such conditions and that it doesn't more often is purely down to luck, in other words no gust at the critical moment?
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I'll stick my neck out. I find that the closer I get to my aircraft's limit, the more challenging it becomes. But it it managable. I can also tell you that the aircraft will normally handle some degree of misshandling. I think it would also be fair to say that this aircraft will have been flown by a competent, very experienced and well trained crew. So what went wrong? I'll try not to guess that one. But I'll tell you that the approaches I find the most difficult are very gusty, and highly variable cross winds. You are forever having to change everything to keep the thing going where you want it. Worse than that, the closer you get to the ground, the more accurate your flying has to be. And then, just at the moment when you don't want the out of limit gust you get hit...
PM
PM