Air Algerie loses contact with its plane leaving Ouagadougou
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I'm tentatively putting my $10 on a failed jack screw.
German news were reporting about heavy sandstorms in the area, how high can they possibly reach?
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Regarding Swiftair...
They are partly a Pay-to-Fly Airline where young, inexperienced pilots PAY the Airline over 30.000 euro just for the right to work for them a couple of months. After that, they are often kicked out and replaced by new ones.
This is certainly the case on ATR42/72. I don't know if they do this on MD83 and B737.
The crews I have met however were all nice, professional but critical of the practices and work ethics of their Upper Management.
I do know that the technical status of their B737 fleet is often questionable, resulting in them seeing their DHL work reduced very recently due to reliability issues.
I do doubt though that Swiftair crews would go airborne with an not airworthy aircraft.
Swiftair also has good Africa experience, flying B737, MD83 and ATR's all over the Continent.
They are partly a Pay-to-Fly Airline where young, inexperienced pilots PAY the Airline over 30.000 euro just for the right to work for them a couple of months. After that, they are often kicked out and replaced by new ones.
This is certainly the case on ATR42/72. I don't know if they do this on MD83 and B737.
The crews I have met however were all nice, professional but critical of the practices and work ethics of their Upper Management.
I do know that the technical status of their B737 fleet is often questionable, resulting in them seeing their DHL work reduced very recently due to reliability issues.
I do doubt though that Swiftair crews would go airborne with an not airworthy aircraft.
Swiftair also has good Africa experience, flying B737, MD83 and ATR's all over the Continent.
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German news were reporting about heavy sandstorms in the area, how high can they possibly reach.
>>>>>
One source states sandstorms can rise to c-50 ft, others give over 20,000 ft. Maybe others can give more reliable info. Is the cruising height the a/c was on at the time of the diversion known ?
>>>>>
One source states sandstorms can rise to c-50 ft, others give over 20,000 ft. Maybe others can give more reliable info. Is the cruising height the a/c was on at the time of the diversion known ?
Reuters reporting
Bad weather likely cause of Air Algerie crash: French officials
Poor weather was the most likely cause of the crash of an Air Algerie flight over the West African state of Mali with 116 people on board, French officials said on Friday.
Investigators at the scene of the crash had concluded the airliner broke apart when it hit the ground, the officials said, suggesting this meant it was unlikely to have been the victim of an attack.
(...)
Separately, Transport Minister Frederic Cuvillier said the strong smell of aircraft fuel at the crash site and the fact that the debris was scattered over a relatively small area also suggested the cause of the crash was linked to weather, a technical problem or a cumulation of such factors.
"We exclude - and have done so from the start - any ground strike," Cuvillier told France 2 television.
Investigators at the scene of the crash had concluded the airliner broke apart when it hit the ground, the officials said, suggesting this meant it was unlikely to have been the victim of an attack.
(...)
Separately, Transport Minister Frederic Cuvillier said the strong smell of aircraft fuel at the crash site and the fact that the debris was scattered over a relatively small area also suggested the cause of the crash was linked to weather, a technical problem or a cumulation of such factors.
"We exclude - and have done so from the start - any ground strike," Cuvillier told France 2 television.
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Other planes in area?
In some of the news stories about the crash, there have been reports that the plane deviated to avoid bad weather, and also to ensure separation from the Algiers - Bamako flight.
Has anyone seen reports from other pilots in the area that night? It would be interesting to have their analysis of the weather conditions, etc.
I apologize I don't know how to check flightaware or other sites to find out what other planes might have been on a similar route at the time of the crash.
Has anyone seen reports from other pilots in the area that night? It would be interesting to have their analysis of the weather conditions, etc.
I apologize I don't know how to check flightaware or other sites to find out what other planes might have been on a similar route at the time of the crash.
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Regarding Swiftair...
They are partly a Pay-to-Fly Airline where young, inexperienced pilots PAY the Airline over 30.000 euro just for the right to work for them a couple of months. After that, they are often kicked out and replaced by new ones.
This is certainly the case on ATR42/72. I don't know if they do this on MD83 and B737.
They are partly a Pay-to-Fly Airline where young, inexperienced pilots PAY the Airline over 30.000 euro just for the right to work for them a couple of months. After that, they are often kicked out and replaced by new ones.
This is certainly the case on ATR42/72. I don't know if they do this on MD83 and B737.
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I've flown along that trans-Sahara route a many many times (primarily between London and Accra / Ghana, and other West African destinations, in B737-700 and B757-200) that said, there's no radar coverage over vast swathes of the Sahara Desert and therein ATC uses what's known as a 'procedural service' (i.e. using only radio position reports), and that radio position reporting was often via HF and seemingly to some bloke sitting in a tin shack in Bamako and whom sounded like he was speaking into a tin bucket (and all he ever wanted to know was your aircraft type and registration, so that they could send your airline the bill for their 'service')
Also at this time of year, the ITCZ can top out out +50 thousand feet, therein allowing Cb's to grow to huge size... and trust me when I say that Cb's over the Sahara can match anything that the mid-west USA has to offer in its tornado season.
You can be at +FL370 and yet still looking up to see the the top of those clouds as they stretch high above you, even when you're +100 Nm away from them. I've also regularly witnessed lightening jumping the gaps between those Cb's, and you can sometimes even smell the electrical ozone in the air. Those Cb's can be true monsters and well worthy of giving much respect and distance !
Accordingly it's also not uncommon to be hundreds of miles off track (as indeed will be other aircraft too) whilst dodging around lines of massive thunderstorms. However, given the difficulty of getting an ATC 'Clearance' (i.e. to diverge away from the airway), rather than dive through a Cb, you just did whatever was necessary to avoid it (just as indeed would everybody else). At those times, TCAS and 126.9 (IFBP) are invaluable aids for Situational Awareness!
TIA !
Also at this time of year, the ITCZ can top out out +50 thousand feet, therein allowing Cb's to grow to huge size... and trust me when I say that Cb's over the Sahara can match anything that the mid-west USA has to offer in its tornado season.
You can be at +FL370 and yet still looking up to see the the top of those clouds as they stretch high above you, even when you're +100 Nm away from them. I've also regularly witnessed lightening jumping the gaps between those Cb's, and you can sometimes even smell the electrical ozone in the air. Those Cb's can be true monsters and well worthy of giving much respect and distance !
Accordingly it's also not uncommon to be hundreds of miles off track (as indeed will be other aircraft too) whilst dodging around lines of massive thunderstorms. However, given the difficulty of getting an ATC 'Clearance' (i.e. to diverge away from the airway), rather than dive through a Cb, you just did whatever was necessary to avoid it (just as indeed would everybody else). At those times, TCAS and 126.9 (IFBP) are invaluable aids for Situational Awareness!
TIA !
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BBC reports flight recorder found
BBC is reporting on a statement by French President Hollande.
- No survivors
- French troops on site of crash
- A "flight data recorder" has been found
- Speculation that this was weather related
BBC News - Air Algerie AH5017: 'No survivors' from crash in Mali
Would weather reports of other pilots / flights possibly in the vicinity that night, e.g. Bamako Algiers (AH5009) or Accra Amsterdam (KLM 590)
be available online anywhere?
- No survivors
- French troops on site of crash
- A "flight data recorder" has been found
- Speculation that this was weather related
BBC News - Air Algerie AH5017: 'No survivors' from crash in Mali
Would weather reports of other pilots / flights possibly in the vicinity that night, e.g. Bamako Algiers (AH5009) or Accra Amsterdam (KLM 590)
be available online anywhere?
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For aircraft to "disappear from radar " you need to have a radar in the first place.
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Position an absolute must, there may be survivors who die before you find it.
Plethora of data is also essential take mh370 , we would probably know what caused it as well as a very good idea where it is.
How long was it before they found payne stewart's aircraft on land.
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Also at this time of year, the ITCZ can top out out +50 thousand feet, therein allowing Cb's to grow to huge size...
From what I can see this one also seems to have ejected a lot of 'junk' (presumably ice and sand) into the upper atmosphere. The crash site is right in the region where all this would be slowly descending back to lower altitudes.
No matter if they were a factor in this or not: African CBs are nasty, nasty, things.
Originally Posted by oldoberon
How long was it before they found payne stewart's aircraft on land.
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Stewart's Jet
How long was it before they found payne stewart's aircraft on land.
The aircraft also did not have a FDR.
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Hi,
First images (video) of the crash site
INFO FRANCE 2. Les premières images des débris de l'avion d'Air Algérie
First images (video) of the crash site
INFO FRANCE 2. Les premières images des débris de l'avion d'Air Algérie
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Air France to avoid overflying of North Mali, management said;
Air France has ordered all its aircraft around the Mali following the crash of an Air Algeria flight Thursday, Friday Juniac Alexander, the CEO of Air France, micro Europe 1 . This decision held until further notice, pending more information on this tragic incident, said the head of the airline.
Air France décide de contourner le Mali - Europe1.fr - Economie#
Link in French...
Air France has ordered all its aircraft around the Mali following the crash of an Air Algeria flight Thursday, Friday Juniac Alexander, the CEO of Air France, micro Europe 1 . This decision held until further notice, pending more information on this tragic incident, said the head of the airline.
Air France décide de contourner le Mali - Europe1.fr - Economie#
Link in French...
Last edited by RFGN; 25th Jul 2014 at 13:00.
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Press conference in Paris
Mr Laurent Fabius Minister of Foreign Affairs, Mr Le Drian Minister of Defence and Mr Cuvillier Minister of Transport.
Crash site is in the Gossi area 150km SW of Gao.
A drone Riper found debris at around 20LT (2000z) in night condition.
There had been informations previously gathered from various sources, Burkinabe, Malian and Dutch military from the MINUSMA. Field of debris is secured and is a square of approximately 300m by 300m.
Malian authorities have requested assistance from France in the inquiry. A team of the BEA and forensic experts are send today and should be on scene tomorrow.
No indication given on which Black box has been found...
Crash site is in the Gossi area 150km SW of Gao.
A drone Riper found debris at around 20LT (2000z) in night condition.
There had been informations previously gathered from various sources, Burkinabe, Malian and Dutch military from the MINUSMA. Field of debris is secured and is a square of approximately 300m by 300m.
Malian authorities have requested assistance from France in the inquiry. A team of the BEA and forensic experts are send today and should be on scene tomorrow.
No indication given on which Black box has been found...
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@ RFGN:
According to an (edited?) version of the article you linked, the no-fly order was only for a brief period of time, and routes flown are now "back to normal" (since noon today).
According to an (edited?) version of the article you linked, the no-fly order was only for a brief period of time, and routes flown are now "back to normal" (since noon today).
Air France a donné un temps l'ordre à tous ses avions de contourner le Mali suite à l'accident d'un vol d'Air Algérie jeudi, a annoncé vendredi Alexandre de Juniac, le Pdg d'Air France, au micro d'Europe 1. Cette décision avait été prise le temps d'en savoir plus sur cet incident dramatique, a précisé le patron de la compagnie aérienne. Depuis vendredi midi, "les survols ont repris, la situation est revenue à la normale", a précisé une porte-parole à Reuters.
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Perhaps it's of particular interest today that AVHerald has just posted the final report about an incident of a temporary loss of control by AirFrance flight AF-3575 over Tanzania in February 2012, following an encounter with severe weather in the ITCZ.
Report: Air France A332 over Tanzania on Feb 12th 2012, severe turbulence and temporary loss of control
http://www.bea.aero/docspa/2012/f-cg...g120227.en.pdf
Report: Air France A332 over Tanzania on Feb 12th 2012, severe turbulence and temporary loss of control
http://www.bea.aero/docspa/2012/f-cg...g120227.en.pdf
Last edited by Kbboca; 25th Jul 2014 at 17:16. Reason: [edited for spelling]