Malaysian Airlines MH370 contact lost
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Dumbo Jet
I know that the INMARSAT and AAIB boffins have the technical and mathematical skills to carry out the signal analysis to determine the details published. That being the case, the obvious conclusion is that the aircraft was deliberately flown until the fuel was exhausted. If it had been possible for someone to enter the flight deck, then surely some attempt at communication would have been made and the aircraft would not have crashed into the sea.
I know that the INMARSAT and AAIB boffins have the technical and mathematical skills to carry out the signal analysis to determine the details published. That being the case, the obvious conclusion is that the aircraft was deliberately flown until the fuel was exhausted. If it had been possible for someone to enter the flight deck, then surely some attempt at communication would have been made and the aircraft would not have crashed into the sea.
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Just because it doesn't make sense doesn't mean it didn't happen. How many times have we seen unusual things happen in accidents as a result of the situation?
Surely AFR447 shows this? !
Surely AFR447 shows this? !
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INMARSAT stated on the BBC news that remote monitoring was already mandatory on seagoing vessels and was totally practical for aircraft, he claimed it could be introduced for 1$ per flying hour.
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Well, while all the guesswork goes on amongst PPRuners, in Beijing, victims' relatives are quite clear who is to blame for this set of events... 'executioners', if you will. Statement as follows:
"At 10pm on March 25, the Malaysian prime minister sent a statement to the families of MH370 passengers without any direct evidence that MH370 crashed in the south Indian ocean and no people survived.
"From March 8 when they announced that MH370 lost contact to today, 18 days have passed during which the Malaysian government and military constantly tried to delay, deceive the passengers' families and cheat the whole world.
"This shameless behaviour not only fooled and hurt the families of the 154 passengers but also misguided and delayed rescue actions, wasting a large quantity of human resources and materials and lost valuable time for the rescue effort.
"If the 154 passengers did lose their lives, Malaysia Airlines, the Malaysian government and military are the real executioners who killed them. We the families of those on board submit our strongest protest against them.
"We will take every possible means to pursue the unforgivable crimes and responsibility of all three."
"At 10pm on March 25, the Malaysian prime minister sent a statement to the families of MH370 passengers without any direct evidence that MH370 crashed in the south Indian ocean and no people survived.
"From March 8 when they announced that MH370 lost contact to today, 18 days have passed during which the Malaysian government and military constantly tried to delay, deceive the passengers' families and cheat the whole world.
"This shameless behaviour not only fooled and hurt the families of the 154 passengers but also misguided and delayed rescue actions, wasting a large quantity of human resources and materials and lost valuable time for the rescue effort.
"If the 154 passengers did lose their lives, Malaysia Airlines, the Malaysian government and military are the real executioners who killed them. We the families of those on board submit our strongest protest against them.
"We will take every possible means to pursue the unforgivable crimes and responsibility of all three."
If (and at this stage it still is a big IF) the plan was to crash the plane in the most remote part of the world could a flight east towards the Pacific have been possibly even more appropriate ?
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Dumbo Jet
I know that the INMARSAT and AAIB boffins have the technical and mathematical skills to carry out the signal analysis to determine the details published. That being the case, the obvious conclusion is that the aircraft was deliberately flown until the fuel was exhausted. If it had been possible for someone to enter the flight deck, then surely some attempt at communication would have been made and the aircraft would not have crashed into the sea.
I know that the INMARSAT and AAIB boffins have the technical and mathematical skills to carry out the signal analysis to determine the details published. That being the case, the obvious conclusion is that the aircraft was deliberately flown until the fuel was exhausted. If it had been possible for someone to enter the flight deck, then surely some attempt at communication would have been made and the aircraft would not have crashed into the sea.
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If that turn was inconsistent with the earliy satellite data, someone would have pointed it out by now. Obviously, merely being consistent doesn't mean it did make that turn, but tends to support that theory.
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Nightingale said: Maybe some of us are doing the captain an injustice. The cargo information is hazy. (Latest reports say the Malaysians are declining to provide the manifest to the Australians without a formal written request.) Let us not forget the plane was flying to Beijing. Maybe there was something "sensitive" on board for the Chinese government and the Malaysians need to clear this with China before releasing the information. Maybe one or more passengers had got wind of this cargo and tried to hijack the plane to make demands against release of the cargo. The captain and FO were forced to turn off the signals but managed to turn south before they were killed. Then there was no-one left to fly the plane so it continued on auto pilot until it crashed into the Indian Ocean. Well it is no crazier than any of the other theories being put forward here"
I think you are spot-on ..... in response to a catastrophic fire caused by e.g. the Li-Ion batteries being carried as cargo. If these were in the forward cargo they could have affected electrical busses in close proximity resulting in loss of ACARS and transponder as well as radios.
It would be perfectly normal under such circumstances to don O2 masks and select heading back towards the nearest suitable airport (KUL or Phuket?) then FLCH to descend the aircraft to FL120 while trying to communicate (unsuccessfully) and avoid breathing acrid fumes. Oxygen bottles could have overheated from a fire and blown out so no O2 supply for the crew.
The aircraft turns onto the selected heading and descends to FL120 at the selected speed. It levels off and continues flying on the same heading at FL120 and maintaining e.g 280 knots until it runs out of fuel and glides at 280 knots into the ocean.
Do the maths using the FPM at FL120 and 280 knots or thereabouts but I wish these so-called "experts" would leave the crew and their poor families out of it unless they have any concrete evidence otherwise.
(Remember LI-Ion batteries carried as cargo brought down a brand new 747-400 in Dubai in 2010. The crew were completely incapacitated and unable to fly the aircraft in daylight and in contact with ATC)
I think you are spot-on ..... in response to a catastrophic fire caused by e.g. the Li-Ion batteries being carried as cargo. If these were in the forward cargo they could have affected electrical busses in close proximity resulting in loss of ACARS and transponder as well as radios.
It would be perfectly normal under such circumstances to don O2 masks and select heading back towards the nearest suitable airport (KUL or Phuket?) then FLCH to descend the aircraft to FL120 while trying to communicate (unsuccessfully) and avoid breathing acrid fumes. Oxygen bottles could have overheated from a fire and blown out so no O2 supply for the crew.
The aircraft turns onto the selected heading and descends to FL120 at the selected speed. It levels off and continues flying on the same heading at FL120 and maintaining e.g 280 knots until it runs out of fuel and glides at 280 knots into the ocean.
Do the maths using the FPM at FL120 and 280 knots or thereabouts but I wish these so-called "experts" would leave the crew and their poor families out of it unless they have any concrete evidence otherwise.
(Remember LI-Ion batteries carried as cargo brought down a brand new 747-400 in Dubai in 2010. The crew were completely incapacitated and unable to fly the aircraft in daylight and in contact with ATC)
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The aircraft turns onto the selected heading and descends to FL120
The crew were completely incapacitated and unable to fly the aircraft in daylight and in contact with ATC)
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No proof of fuel exhaustion.
They had fuel for 7:30 hrs and the flight lasted over 7 hrs.
In view of the above it is you who has to prove there was no fuel exhaustion.
Gouli ... .
If someone was alive in the cabin then the portable ELT's would have been activated.
That should at least put paid to all the posts relating to Lithium battery fires, flying under the radar and deliberate attempts to kill everyone by hypoxia/anoxia
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Originally Posted by James7
If someone was alive in the cabin then the portable ELT's would have been activated.
Originally Posted by Beijing
"If the 154 passengers did lose their lives, Malaysia Airlines, the Malaysian government and military are the real executioners who killed them. We the families of those on board submit our strongest protest against them.
"We will take every possible means to pursue the unforgivable crimes and responsibility of all three."
"We will take every possible means to pursue the unforgivable crimes and responsibility of all three."
Now back to credible News.
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BEA on the search for AFR447
The following conclusions reached by the BEA after its search for AFR447 may be of interest:
- Above all, more frequent position reporting by aircraft is required (flight AF 447 transmitted its position every 10 min). This is the subject of a recommendation made by the BEA in its Interim Report n° 2 on 17 December 2009.
- Drift buoys must be released as soon as possible after any accident, in order to follow the drift currents, which can be highly unpredictable beyond a few days.
- Calling on a submarine to listen for acoustic beacon signals at 37.5 kHz is not appropriate.
- The transmission times of acoustic beacons must be increased from 30 to 90 days: despite this, it is noted that there is some doubt as to whether they functioned. The recommendation made by the BEA to install an additional beacon, transmitting on a lower frequency and thus with longer range, should enable the risk of non-detection to be decreased.
- The Remus AUV, equipped with sonar and camera, proved themselves to be highly effective.
- Exploring undersea areas with rough terrain at great depths and so far from the coast is a technological and organisational challenge. It takes a long time to organise such operations, which call on resources in material and the few world specialists, and need significant financial resources (from 5 to 15 M€).
- Drift buoys must be released as soon as possible after any accident, in order to follow the drift currents, which can be highly unpredictable beyond a few days.
- Calling on a submarine to listen for acoustic beacon signals at 37.5 kHz is not appropriate.
- The transmission times of acoustic beacons must be increased from 30 to 90 days: despite this, it is noted that there is some doubt as to whether they functioned. The recommendation made by the BEA to install an additional beacon, transmitting on a lower frequency and thus with longer range, should enable the risk of non-detection to be decreased.
- The Remus AUV, equipped with sonar and camera, proved themselves to be highly effective.
- Exploring undersea areas with rough terrain at great depths and so far from the coast is a technological and organisational challenge. It takes a long time to organise such operations, which call on resources in material and the few world specialists, and need significant financial resources (from 5 to 15 M€).
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This latest announcement makes zero sense to me physically. The talk about Doppler effect looks like techno-gibberish that makes me wonder what exactly they are hiding and why.
We have a radially symmetric configuration. One satellite in geosynchronous orbit, approximately round Earth, and an aircraft somewhere above the Earth. We can measure the distance from the satellite to the aircraft via time-of-flight, and we can measure the radial speed of the aircraft via Doppler effect, but nothing here breaks either the rotational symmetry or mirror symmetry.
We have a radially symmetric configuration. One satellite in geosynchronous orbit, approximately round Earth, and an aircraft somewhere above the Earth. We can measure the distance from the satellite to the aircraft via time-of-flight, and we can measure the radial speed of the aircraft via Doppler effect, but nothing here breaks either the rotational symmetry or mirror symmetry.
Last edited by hamster3null; 24th Mar 2014 at 20:01.
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similarly no talk of "jitters" I read in another thread.