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Old 13th Dec 2012, 20:32   #101 (permalink)
 
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Quote:
Your advocating suicide among pilots is out of place on a professional aviator's forum.
Sorry, I did not mean to. What I was trying to say was: I you get in an small aircraft all alone and you suffer from anything major, you will most likely kill just yourself.
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Old 13th Dec 2012, 20:42   #102 (permalink)
 
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So said 411A (PBUH) before he went out with a big bang. Luckily he was not at the controls

Completely out of place extension and correlation in a professional web site
Why? He told us all he was fit as a fiddle, passed all his medicals, and we should all bugger off because old farts rule the aviation world.
He died on the job and it was pure luck it didn't happen when he was at the controls of his L-1011 during a bad weather approach.
And now we have an aircraft go down with a 78 year old captain in command.
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Old 13th Dec 2012, 20:47   #103 (permalink)
 
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my wife had a patient yesterday that was 23 who has three MI's (that's heart attack) my wife, by the way, mid-20's...
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Old 13th Dec 2012, 21:19   #104 (permalink)

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Well I see one more time we have some one here that has solved the cause of the accident before the wreckage has stopped smoldering.

The pilot was too old, tell the investigators to pack up and go home.
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Old 13th Dec 2012, 21:21   #105 (permalink)
 
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Machinbird: I know a lot of pilots our age that are fine pilots. At some point you notice your driving skills and flying skills gradually diminish. Some at 50, some at 90.

We have all babysat a 55 year old captain to keep him out of trouble and I have had retirement flights with captains turning 60 that were the ace of the base. Age always gets you but not everybody at the same age.

I was told by a couple they could get me into their outfits flying but declined because I didn't need the money and felt fortunate to have 23,000 hrs and no incidents. Why push it? The late night stuff gets you first. We will see how this investigation progresses. Kind of agree that this was no demo flight at 3:30 in the morning. A lot of that was going on in the 70's when I was flying Lears into Mexico.
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Old 13th Dec 2012, 22:47   #106 (permalink)
 
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I'm 76 and would not want to ride in the cabin of an old airplane with an old captain.

I felt the age 60 retirement rule (which was still in effect when I elected to retire at 54) was medically a good, conservative rule.

No matter what anyone says as a general rule the chances of a heart attack or stroke increases materially beyond age 70 or so.

Also, someone mentioned that the gentleman should have been home asleep. I strongly agree with that based on my personal experience.

I have also found it best not to drive at night other than on a short, local trip. As you get older the eyes have far more difficulty at night even though vision is good during the day.

Just one OF's considered opinion.
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Old 13th Dec 2012, 22:49   #107 (permalink)
 
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A lot of that was going on in the 70's when I was flying Lears into Mexico.
So this has been going on for 30-40 years, and nobody has raised a finger to stop it? Is it because those who know about it are also the ones flying the aircraft? Is this business the end of the road for old pilots who can't find a job elsewhere?
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Old 14th Dec 2012, 00:01   #108 (permalink)
 
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MAS, no our company didn't want to bother with the paperwork and expense of doing what we had a certificate to do so treated is an FAR part 91 private flight. It worked but only because the Mexicans didn't seem to care if you slipped them a 20.
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Old 14th Dec 2012, 00:04   #109 (permalink)
 
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bubbers:

Quote:
It worked but only because the Mexicans didn't seem to care if you slipped them a 20.
Bribes and corruption are in the invisible ink portion of Mexico's constituion.
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Old 14th Dec 2012, 00:22   #110 (permalink)
 
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You got that right and still is.
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Old 14th Dec 2012, 00:37   #111 (permalink)
 
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Magenta "X" indicates approximately crash site location:

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Old 14th Dec 2012, 01:05   #112 (permalink)
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Machinbird View Post
Bubbers, the wreckage, even if badly fragmented, can tell you a lot.
+1 (along with the rest of your post)

Aviation accident investigation agencies don't have specialists in (among other things) physics, metallurgy and electronics on the payroll simply to make headcount!

The famous investigation into the DH.106 Comet was done with no flight recorder evidence, and even the famous water tank test eventually served only to confirm the theory that the "tin-kickers" who assessed and reconstructed the accident sequence from partial wreckage had already figured out.
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Old 14th Dec 2012, 01:44   #113 (permalink)
 
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DW, ok let us see what the Mexicans do to solve this. I think the cost of doing what you think should be done will be ignored and the cause of crash will be unknown. I can guarantee it. Let us wait for the final cause in a few years. All of their aviation accident investigators will be in the US by then anyway so what do they care.
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Old 14th Dec 2012, 02:08   #114 (permalink)
 
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bubbers44:

Once they arrive in the U.S. they probably won't be working for the NTSB. My jaded view aside, they do have some NTSB folks down there helping. Perhaps more than we will ever know.

Washington, DC and the federal government of Mexico are often clandestine, strange pals.
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Old 14th Dec 2012, 02:21   #115 (permalink)
 
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We will see. Just heard one of her songs a few minutes ago. So sad.

Last edited by bubbers44; 14th Dec 2012 at 02:22.
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Old 14th Dec 2012, 03:42   #116 (permalink)
 
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In Mexico, his privileges are governed by his Mexican license.
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Old 14th Dec 2012, 04:41   #117 (permalink)
 
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In an "N" registered aircraft, the FAA may have something to say about that!
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Old 14th Dec 2012, 08:48   #118 (permalink)
 
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Business as usual in Mexico:

Jenni Rivera Plane Crash Site Robbed by Police | Fox News Latino
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Old 14th Dec 2012, 09:02   #119 (permalink)
 
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Owner of Rivera plane investigated by DEA

The man widely believed to be behind the aviation company is an ex-convict named Christian Esquino who has a long and checkered legal past, including convictions for fraud, one as part of a sweeping drug investigation in Florida in the late 1980s.

Owner of Rivera plane investigated by DEA - Yahoo! News
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Old 14th Dec 2012, 12:56   #120 (permalink)
 
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Captain held all valid certificates, aircraft was approved for up to 6 month stay in Mexico. Entered FlightAware

According to Mexican press, aircraft was being operated privately on behalf of Jenni Rivera pending a sale of the aircraft to her. (or at least illegally chartered but written up that way???) (allegedly!)
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