Blood Pressure & Age
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Blood Pressure & Age
Hi lads ... this one is for the Medics and the more experienced among us.
At the ripe old age of 82, I was subjected to the CAA OAP special aircrew medical earlier this month. (My fourth!) I feel fit as a Strad and was passed OK for continued 'Class One' privileges ... but with the CAA's NHS GP noting that for my ongoing welfare, the BP figures of: 160/90 were high. The LIQ recommended I visit my own GP with a view to prescribing a suitable pressure reducing drug from the CAA's 'acceptable' list.
I'm one of those cantankerous individuals who, unless I find myself in serious trouble, won't put man-made chemicals into my body ... not even headache pills ... so I'm reluctant to start doing so now.
My query is this: Our esteemed PP member CAPT has written in his superb pilot training manual ... 'normal' BP is relative to age. He quotes a Systolic figure of: 100 PLUS age. That would give me a upper figure of 182.
Can I ask fellow PPs, especially those in my age group and of course the more knowledgable, for their experiences or comments. Safe flying to all.
Dennis Kenyon.
At the ripe old age of 82, I was subjected to the CAA OAP special aircrew medical earlier this month. (My fourth!) I feel fit as a Strad and was passed OK for continued 'Class One' privileges ... but with the CAA's NHS GP noting that for my ongoing welfare, the BP figures of: 160/90 were high. The LIQ recommended I visit my own GP with a view to prescribing a suitable pressure reducing drug from the CAA's 'acceptable' list.
I'm one of those cantankerous individuals who, unless I find myself in serious trouble, won't put man-made chemicals into my body ... not even headache pills ... so I'm reluctant to start doing so now.
My query is this: Our esteemed PP member CAPT has written in his superb pilot training manual ... 'normal' BP is relative to age. He quotes a Systolic figure of: 100 PLUS age. That would give me a upper figure of 182.
Can I ask fellow PPs, especially those in my age group and of course the more knowledgable, for their experiences or comments. Safe flying to all.
Dennis Kenyon.
My blood pressure, around 155, got picked up during a Chinese medical. My company doctor put me on Adalat, one every morning. That brought it down to around 130. The Chinese CAAC were happy, the Australian CASA were happy; don't know about the CAA.
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I'm one of those cantankerous individuals who, unless I find myself in serious trouble, won't put man-made chemicals into my body
While drugs may work like a charm and require little effort, there are various other ways to reduce blood pressure (I've tried with some success).
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Good morning Dennis,
As you are one of my Biggles type heros, I look at this as a chance to offer some help, I am 14 years behind you , but apart from Knackered Knees and one shoulder creaking ( too much Cricket and Rugby when I was younger)I think I am fit, but I am told my BP was a little high, after explaining to the Quack my want of flying he suggested to cut out this, that and the other and see what happened, well it did have a result and the BP dropped down to what was considered a reasonable level ( I have never smoked, nor been a coffee drinker apparently that too has an upward effect) I also now use a low dose of something called Amlodopine that also brings this BP down, my current BP three weeks ago was 138/74 which is or seems OK, After every flight take a few measures or try Macallen, or Talisker, very good for calming the nerves and mind, don't know about BP though!!..
Peter R-B
As you are one of my Biggles type heros, I look at this as a chance to offer some help, I am 14 years behind you , but apart from Knackered Knees and one shoulder creaking ( too much Cricket and Rugby when I was younger)I think I am fit, but I am told my BP was a little high, after explaining to the Quack my want of flying he suggested to cut out this, that and the other and see what happened, well it did have a result and the BP dropped down to what was considered a reasonable level ( I have never smoked, nor been a coffee drinker apparently that too has an upward effect) I also now use a low dose of something called Amlodopine that also brings this BP down, my current BP three weeks ago was 138/74 which is or seems OK, After every flight take a few measures or try Macallen, or Talisker, very good for calming the nerves and mind, don't know about BP though!!..
Peter R-B
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A (retired) doctor writes..
Isolated measurements of blood pressure are not reliable, and are certainly not sufficient to advise initiation of treatment. The standard advice these days is to send the patient off with an automatic machine which takes the BP at intervals over period, usually 24 hours. The machine records the readings and the data are then uploaded to a PC where they can be printed out and displayed graphically.
I share your aversion to foreign chemicals in my body, but I should declare that I am taking blood pressure lowering drugs myself. I have no licence to practice any more but even if I did I would shrink from any but the most general advice, which is: 1. Relate the measurements of your BP to your own personal and family history; e.g. Did any of your first degree relatives (parents and siblings) suffer or die from cardiovascular illness, have you major risk factors for such disease, e.g. Lipid or sugar metabolic deficiencies.
2. If after careful assessment your doctor thinks you are hypertensive, try to get a realistic estimate of the risk of potential harm and loss of years of life in your case. This is not really more than an educated guess, but it should help to set your ideas in context.
3. If you are advised to take medication, again, ask for an estimate of the degree of benefit you are likely to gain, together with the potential harm it might inflict.
At your age you may feel that a risk of a year or so's life shortening or prolongation is insufficient to warrant the daily consumption of a pill which may have effects on your (ahem) amorous potential or similar. I would not pay much attention to rules of thumb such as age plus a random figure. More important is any evidence of damage to your heart and arterial system and consequent reduction in function of critical organs. Only your doctor can give advice in this.
I share your aversion to foreign chemicals in my body, but I should declare that I am taking blood pressure lowering drugs myself. I have no licence to practice any more but even if I did I would shrink from any but the most general advice, which is: 1. Relate the measurements of your BP to your own personal and family history; e.g. Did any of your first degree relatives (parents and siblings) suffer or die from cardiovascular illness, have you major risk factors for such disease, e.g. Lipid or sugar metabolic deficiencies.
2. If after careful assessment your doctor thinks you are hypertensive, try to get a realistic estimate of the risk of potential harm and loss of years of life in your case. This is not really more than an educated guess, but it should help to set your ideas in context.
3. If you are advised to take medication, again, ask for an estimate of the degree of benefit you are likely to gain, together with the potential harm it might inflict.
At your age you may feel that a risk of a year or so's life shortening or prolongation is insufficient to warrant the daily consumption of a pill which may have effects on your (ahem) amorous potential or similar. I would not pay much attention to rules of thumb such as age plus a random figure. More important is any evidence of damage to your heart and arterial system and consequent reduction in function of critical organs. Only your doctor can give advice in this.
Hi
high pressure can leed to strokes - and if you have ever seen a fit man beeing immobilized on one side, unable to speek but knowing, he understands, whats going on, then you really should consider every aspect of reducing the pressure, including pills.....
Get well
with best regards
Udo "Flying Bull"
high pressure can leed to strokes - and if you have ever seen a fit man beeing immobilized on one side, unable to speek but knowing, he understands, whats going on, then you really should consider every aspect of reducing the pressure, including pills.....
Get well
with best regards
Udo "Flying Bull"
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Dennis
Uk and blood pressure seem to be the "in thing" at the mo. At the ripe old age of 46 I have high blood pressure and receive medication to enable me to continue to fly. I have seen many Aviation Medics and all say its the in vogue thing at the mo in UK. So if it helps, being in your 80's I think you are doing bloody well. If you want to continue to fly (like I do ) then I'd be prepared to give up a kidney if I had too!
fly Safe
Uk and blood pressure seem to be the "in thing" at the mo. At the ripe old age of 46 I have high blood pressure and receive medication to enable me to continue to fly. I have seen many Aviation Medics and all say its the in vogue thing at the mo in UK. So if it helps, being in your 80's I think you are doing bloody well. If you want to continue to fly (like I do ) then I'd be prepared to give up a kidney if I had too!
fly Safe
Last edited by Faithless; 14th Mar 2015 at 18:02. Reason: I'm krap at spelin!
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Having been in the situation described by Flying Bull, I can only re-iterate his advice.
Peter-RB, be wary of the side effects of Amlodopine. I had to come off it due to swollen lower legs leading to deep seated skin infections, a known side effect.
Dennis, Best wishes with whatever course of treatment you choose.
Peter-RB, be wary of the side effects of Amlodopine. I had to come off it due to swollen lower legs leading to deep seated skin infections, a known side effect.
Dennis, Best wishes with whatever course of treatment you choose.
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BP (the bloody kind!)
So how do I answer ... except to thank you all for the input. A veritable plethora of advice. I quite fancy the natural treatment and will be motoring down to Morrison's tomorrow for a few sticks of Celery and Beetroot, etc. Of course it would be those as I don't like the flavours ... but needs must. And can the experts tell me IF dairy foods, ice cream, cheese etc, are the good or bad guys.
Thanks to all especially the specialists advice.
Any further comments on the published advice of the 100 figure PLUS the age thingy. Oh, and I've purchased a wrist monitor from BOOTS which is giving me an average figure some 20 below the CAA Medical. Is there any way I can calibrate my monitor?
Bye for now. Dennis Kenyon.
Thanks to all especially the specialists advice.
Any further comments on the published advice of the 100 figure PLUS the age thingy. Oh, and I've purchased a wrist monitor from BOOTS which is giving me an average figure some 20 below the CAA Medical. Is there any way I can calibrate my monitor?
Bye for now. Dennis Kenyon.
Any further comments on the published advice of the 100 figure PLUS the age thingy. Oh, and I've purchased a wrist monitor from BOOTS which is giving me an average figure some 20 below the CAA Medical. Is there any way I can calibrate my monitor?
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Dennis,
I'm 4 years younger than you. In my 40s my BP was around 90/50, so low that I nearly failed my medical. Sadly the doctor died 6 weeks later. I'm told age does increase your BP & lack of exercise as well as poor diet. When I became a type 2 diabetic some 6 years ago, that became the end of my flying career.
I was put onto low GI diets & exercise to control my diabetes & it also controlled my BP. Generally my BP is 110-120 over 70-80. Last month I had a shocking head cold or flu & my BP was taken, 150/90! That shocked me because my BP was always low, often too low. When my cold/flu went this week, my BP was 120/80 & I expect will be lower next week.
So BP can change easily & if it goes up suddenly, there should be a reason which hopefully you can fix. Sadly my diabetes I can't fix & this week I started on 1 insulin shot at night, which means definitely no return to flying but then who wants a 78 year old commercial pilot! I wouldn't fly with me!
John, too many coffee & cakes!!
I'm 4 years younger than you. In my 40s my BP was around 90/50, so low that I nearly failed my medical. Sadly the doctor died 6 weeks later. I'm told age does increase your BP & lack of exercise as well as poor diet. When I became a type 2 diabetic some 6 years ago, that became the end of my flying career.
I was put onto low GI diets & exercise to control my diabetes & it also controlled my BP. Generally my BP is 110-120 over 70-80. Last month I had a shocking head cold or flu & my BP was taken, 150/90! That shocked me because my BP was always low, often too low. When my cold/flu went this week, my BP was 120/80 & I expect will be lower next week.
So BP can change easily & if it goes up suddenly, there should be a reason which hopefully you can fix. Sadly my diabetes I can't fix & this week I started on 1 insulin shot at night, which means definitely no return to flying but then who wants a 78 year old commercial pilot! I wouldn't fly with me!
John, too many coffee & cakes!!
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BP,Beetroot & Celery
It surely is an odd world ... up really early this morning to visit my 24 hour local Asda. I'm checking out a dozen varieties of beetroot when I open a conversation with a lady also inspecting the shelves. She is a nurse at my local health centre although not my Government appointed person. I explain about Pprune, my BP and the many posts. As they all seem to say in the medical world ... she concurred.
Two packs of packaged beetroot and a dozen sticks of Celery to the check-out. My internet checks advise around 7 days for any affect on BP. I'll duly report shortly. This morning's 'Boots' figure was 138/79, averaged out over the last seven days at 145/85. HB was 78 sitting.
Many thanks for the contributors. Dennis K.
PS. Is the general consensus we should avoid Coffee and Salt?
Two packs of packaged beetroot and a dozen sticks of Celery to the check-out. My internet checks advise around 7 days for any affect on BP. I'll duly report shortly. This morning's 'Boots' figure was 138/79, averaged out over the last seven days at 145/85. HB was 78 sitting.
Many thanks for the contributors. Dennis K.
PS. Is the general consensus we should avoid Coffee and Salt?
Dennis, you're 82 and have just started to have high blood pressure ? !
To have reached that age keeping it under control and keeping a first class medical is impressive by any standard.
I was put on blood pressure medication at 37, fifteen years ago, nothing 'natural' worked but the medication was very effective.
Like you I avoided taking 'pills' of any kind having grown up exposed to some Victorian attitudes towards them. As a result of my reluctance to take them my untreated high blood pressure gave me a permanent heart condition.
Its not that serious (as long as it doesn't get worse) and I kept my medical but in retrospect taking a pill every day is well worth it to stay healthy.
Definitely avoid caffeine and salt !
To have reached that age keeping it under control and keeping a first class medical is impressive by any standard.
I was put on blood pressure medication at 37, fifteen years ago, nothing 'natural' worked but the medication was very effective.
Like you I avoided taking 'pills' of any kind having grown up exposed to some Victorian attitudes towards them. As a result of my reluctance to take them my untreated high blood pressure gave me a permanent heart condition.
Its not that serious (as long as it doesn't get worse) and I kept my medical but in retrospect taking a pill every day is well worth it to stay healthy.
Definitely avoid caffeine and salt !
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Regarding accuracy of "boots devices", CAA says home blood pressure monitoring is acceptable. Their procedure is: "for each blood pressure recording, take 2 measurements 1 minute apart, take 2 recordings a day for at least 4 days, discard 1st day measurements and use average value of remaining measurements" (details: http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/2499/Hypertension%20FC.pdf )
Re Salt (Sodium), it makes your body hold on to water. The excess liquid in the system requires your heart to work harder, raising pressure. Watch out for processed/"industrial" food, a lot of salt is hidden there. For cooking at home, there are low-sodium alternatives, which taste the same, such as: Blood Pressure : Low-sodium salt alternatives
Re caffein, check your pressure within 30 minutes of drinking coffee or another caffeinated beverage you regularly drink. If your blood pressure increases by five to 10 points, you may be sensitive to the blood pressure raising effects of caffeine.
Re age, blood vessels can become thicker and less flexible. The stiffer vessels no longer expand and contract as much with each heartbeat, thereby increasing opposition to the flow of blood, placing an increased workload on the heart, increasing systolic pressure. As with any pump, accelerated fatigue is an issue if the heart is constantly working harder than what it was designed for, and the less flexible vessels, under higher pressure than they were designed for, are at greater risk to rupture. Tracking the issue and getting it under control at an early stage, preventively, before any damage is done, what you are doing now, is a good idea. The threshold for what is defined as high blood pressure, for what puts you at risk, does not change with age, it's still high blood pressure. Some experts recommend a slightly relaxed threshold before putting older individuals on medications, yet that's completely irrelevant for a CAA medical. All that matters for a medical is the CAA guidelines. Some claim specific stretching exercises may help to keep arteries flexible (and again, diet can play a role too).
Excess Salt, Alcohol, Sugar, Caffeine etc...there's a lot of good advice here (mostly in line with advice from http://www.bloodpressureuk.org/Home ), and I think with the help of your home blood pressure monitor, and a log, you will figure out what works for you, (we're all different and have different habits, different diets, and may react differently to substances and/or treatments).
"This morning's 'Boots' figure was 138/79". Congratulations, that's not dramatic at all. So before you measure your blood pressure next time, take a few deep breaths, exhale slowly, close your eyes, think of something relaxing...that may also lower blood pressure. Then, enjoy flying.
Re Salt (Sodium), it makes your body hold on to water. The excess liquid in the system requires your heart to work harder, raising pressure. Watch out for processed/"industrial" food, a lot of salt is hidden there. For cooking at home, there are low-sodium alternatives, which taste the same, such as: Blood Pressure : Low-sodium salt alternatives
Re caffein, check your pressure within 30 minutes of drinking coffee or another caffeinated beverage you regularly drink. If your blood pressure increases by five to 10 points, you may be sensitive to the blood pressure raising effects of caffeine.
Re age, blood vessels can become thicker and less flexible. The stiffer vessels no longer expand and contract as much with each heartbeat, thereby increasing opposition to the flow of blood, placing an increased workload on the heart, increasing systolic pressure. As with any pump, accelerated fatigue is an issue if the heart is constantly working harder than what it was designed for, and the less flexible vessels, under higher pressure than they were designed for, are at greater risk to rupture. Tracking the issue and getting it under control at an early stage, preventively, before any damage is done, what you are doing now, is a good idea. The threshold for what is defined as high blood pressure, for what puts you at risk, does not change with age, it's still high blood pressure. Some experts recommend a slightly relaxed threshold before putting older individuals on medications, yet that's completely irrelevant for a CAA medical. All that matters for a medical is the CAA guidelines. Some claim specific stretching exercises may help to keep arteries flexible (and again, diet can play a role too).
Excess Salt, Alcohol, Sugar, Caffeine etc...there's a lot of good advice here (mostly in line with advice from http://www.bloodpressureuk.org/Home ), and I think with the help of your home blood pressure monitor, and a log, you will figure out what works for you, (we're all different and have different habits, different diets, and may react differently to substances and/or treatments).
"This morning's 'Boots' figure was 138/79". Congratulations, that's not dramatic at all. So before you measure your blood pressure next time, take a few deep breaths, exhale slowly, close your eyes, think of something relaxing...that may also lower blood pressure. Then, enjoy flying.
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I've always found it's visiting the doctors that raises my blood pressure. Most are ok, but there are some that you really don't know.
The first thing to do is to stop eating processed food which uses unnatural amounts of salt and sugar to return a profit to the manufacturer/shareholder.
Then the rest will look after itself. Good luck Dennis, hope you're still at it at 90.
The first thing to do is to stop eating processed food which uses unnatural amounts of salt and sugar to return a profit to the manufacturer/shareholder.
Then the rest will look after itself. Good luck Dennis, hope you're still at it at 90.
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cattletruck, spot on, learning to relax is important for surviving both the dreaded BP tests and snake bight. Get rid off all carb, but especially the refined ones.
i have never had any probs passing BP but just because i am older than 65, i start off with a heap of demerit points and i have to go do a stress ECG, makes me mad as it also cost a few dollars, extra trip to town etc, it all adds up.
A good site to visit and one that is easy to read which gives good advice re BP and all cardiovascular info is spacedoc
cheers tet.
i have never had any probs passing BP but just because i am older than 65, i start off with a heap of demerit points and i have to go do a stress ECG, makes me mad as it also cost a few dollars, extra trip to town etc, it all adds up.
A good site to visit and one that is easy to read which gives good advice re BP and all cardiovascular info is spacedoc
cheers tet.
