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Old 21st Oct 2011, 15:56   #1 (permalink)
 
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Agusta 109S Crash in Mexico City

An Agusta 109S Grand just crashed in the Middle of Mexico City, this belonged to the State of Mexico Goverment, recent model, excellent maintenance, that division operates about 6 Agustas, all recently purchased, so far 2 dead.

The aircraft was in cruise flight and had a problem, came down in a heavily populated area.

Confusión por víctimas en caída de helicóptero - El Universal - DF

Last edited by BlenderPilot; 21st Oct 2011 at 16:29.
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Old 21st Oct 2011, 18:21   #2 (permalink)
 
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Two pilots, or pilot & passenger ?
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Old 21st Oct 2011, 20:07   #3 (permalink)
 
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Four POB, two pax, two pilots, one of each is dead.
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Old 21st Oct 2011, 20:16   #4 (permalink)
 
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Any mayday while going down?

R.I.P.
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Old 22nd Oct 2011, 00:28   #5 (permalink)
 
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Name of the pilot? Does anybody know?
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Old 22nd Oct 2011, 04:49   #6 (permalink)
 
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The deceased was named: Juan Esteban Rodriguez Ruiz, they were in cruise flight and the aircraft had a very sudden problem that caused it to crash, they were up for a 15 minute flight.
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Old 23rd Oct 2011, 10:20   #7 (permalink)
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aser View Post


Any mayday while going down?

R.I.P.
Looking at the pristine condition of the visible tailrotor blade (also compared to the M/R bldes) I might be tempted to believe in the mechanical problem statement....to some degree
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Old 27th Oct 2011, 09:06   #8 (permalink)
 
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Given that (a) this aircraft looks to be in a condition for the cause to probably be fairly quickly identified, (b) surviving crew, (c) no obvious high risk factors, and (d) no doubt plenty of concerned 109S operators, I'm surprised we've had no further updates here, 6 days on. Blender - any news?
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Old 27th Oct 2011, 19:26   #9 (permalink)
 
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Damage to the main rotors show damn near Zero rpm,Vertical crushing not good, Bad Maintenance? Bad piloting? No fuel left to burn? Can't stand to see a "New" looking machine the falls out of the sky. It brings up the need to review the people that worked or didn't work with this opperation.
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Old 27th Oct 2011, 20:37   #10 (permalink)
 
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Main rotor tip blades intact and leading edges not damaged. With main rotor aft blade damage means collective up and no or near zero rotor RPM.

Tail rotor picture of TR blade with impact damage but no rotational damage to leading edges TR blades not turning or near zero rpm.

Aircraft had to be desending with collective up and rotors not being driven by the engines.

Aircraft in all one spot so inpact was at near zero airspeed

Dual engine failure, fuel exhaustion?

Tail rotor drive failure, bad Autorotation?

Control system failure?


My prayers for the passengers and familys
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Old 28th Oct 2011, 04:35   #11 (permalink)
 
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This crash was very disconcerting, this operator operates 3 109S's and several Koalas, all crew had been to Italy at least once a year for simulator training, also all mechanics were factory trained and current, most aircraft are new and in TOP NOTCH condition, Fuel Exahustion is OUT OF THE QUESTION, highly experienced crew, out for a short flight, how can you run out of fuel 3 minutes into the flight when you had about 20 more minutes to go? That aircraft gives you plenty of warning . . . .

People are talking about TR failure, some say something about the ECU, some control system, who knows?

That aircraft had some sort of catastrophic failure that made it come down like that, I hope they find out soon and they let everyone know what happened, unfortunately the manufacturers such as Agusta and Bell take advantage of the fact that in countries such as ours accident investigations are kept very confidential, (stupidly) and this helps cover up many accidents due to mechanical fault.
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Old 28th Oct 2011, 08:15   #12 (permalink)
 
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Blender - do you know if they were landing or taking off from one of the rooftop helipads in the city?
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Old 28th Oct 2011, 09:21   #13 (permalink)
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlenderPilot
That aircraft had some sort of catastrophic failure that made it come down like that

I always get surprised to see conclusions like this without any knowledge and/or element; only reading few posts and looking at a couple of photos...
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Old 28th Oct 2011, 10:04   #14 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by iuk1963 View Post
I always get surprised to see conclusions like this without any knowledge and/or element; only reading few posts and looking at a couple of photos...
Since BlenderPilot is Mexico based and has an intimate knowledge of the operations there, I suspect that he has more idea than you or I as to what may have happened.

He is certainly not making his conclusions on reading posts here, nor seeing a couple of photos
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Old 28th Oct 2011, 13:04   #15 (permalink)
 
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Quote:
Blender - do you know if they were landing or taking off from one of the rooftop helipads in the city?
On this particular flight, NO and YES, they had just taken off a ground level helipad and going to a rooftop helipad about 30 miles away in Toluca which had an elevation of 8,700 FTAMSL and were about 7 miles away from there departure point, in straight and level flight from it when they crashed, they were about 6 miles away from Mexico City International Airport, they took off uneventfully and reported their takeoff normally, crashed about 3 minutes later without warning.

I hate it when an aircraft just goes down like that, as I said before, this is a VERY professional outfit, every effort was made to keep all their aircraft well maintained, pilots and mechanics well trained, the aircraft was fairly new. I fly a 109E in Mexico City everyday and I just hope we find out what happened, it would be very unfair not to, for all Agusta operators.
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Old 28th Oct 2011, 22:45   #16 (permalink)
 
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Chill out guys with the speculation's, how can you state something like "Bad Maintenance? Bad piloting? No fuel left to burn?" from just two photos cmon. It could just been sabotage given its a government aircraft in a country that had been fighting organized crime for years, just another out of the blue speculation.
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Old 1st Dec 2011, 02:47   #17 (permalink)
 
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Blender

Has there been any feedback from any sources on the possible cause of this tragic indicent.

Rgds

Sav
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Old 1st Dec 2011, 04:39   #18 (permalink)
 
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Apparently they had an engine overspeed due to a line in the engine control clogging up, the pilot at the controls had 30 hours on type and on a similar helicopter.
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Old 1st Dec 2011, 04:55   #19 (permalink)
 
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Blender, thank you for this.

Your initial concern over this incident also raised my own concerns - hence my enquiry.

What (please) is the standard procedure in a twin .. shut down the overspeeding engine and land with the assistance of the remaining one?

Is there a 109 mechanic who could elaborate on the engine control components most likely to 'clog up' and what pre-flight precautions (if any) can be taken to alert of systems/component failures capable of inducing an overspeed.
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Old 1st Dec 2011, 09:05   #20 (permalink)
 
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The A109S Grand has two engines doesn't it?
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