R44 owners or light category, question about SAS and autopilot in helicopter...
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Philippines
Posts: 5
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
R44 owners or light category, question about SAS and autopilot in helicopter...
I heard that they already have STC approved in the r44... do anyone have an update?..
I think in the light category they have 2 now... the chelton/cobham helisas and the cool city avionics type... based on anyone's knowledge what is the difference between the 2?.. and what's the difference between this one and the expensive one that most of the medium to heavy kind of helicopters have?..
Is it really affordable compared to those circulating in the market today?
Thanks...
I think in the light category they have 2 now... the chelton/cobham helisas and the cool city avionics type... based on anyone's knowledge what is the difference between the 2?.. and what's the difference between this one and the expensive one that most of the medium to heavy kind of helicopters have?..
Is it really affordable compared to those circulating in the market today?
Thanks...
A basic stability augmentation system (SAS) will give you rate damping and therefore smooth out your control inputs and make the aircraft less twitchy - the downside is that you lose some of your responsiveness to control inputs.
An autopilot will give you the facility to hold an attitude, heading, speed or height depending on which inputs it receives from which sensors - this will clearly be more expensive.
For general private flying I would suggest a SAS is enough, it is when you get to IFR and similar regimes that an autopilot is useful to reduce pilot workload.
The above information is generic, I have no knowledge of the specific products for an R44.
An autopilot will give you the facility to hold an attitude, heading, speed or height depending on which inputs it receives from which sensors - this will clearly be more expensive.
For general private flying I would suggest a SAS is enough, it is when you get to IFR and similar regimes that an autopilot is useful to reduce pilot workload.
The above information is generic, I have no knowledge of the specific products for an R44.
Kumusta kuya?
I'm pretty sure Shawn Coyle has flown at least one of those products and reported on it in a magazine - I guess he'll come along soon and reply! How useful it would be will depend on the type of flying and how much of it you do.
Ingat
I'm pretty sure Shawn Coyle has flown at least one of those products and reported on it in a magazine - I guess he'll come along soon and reply! How useful it would be will depend on the type of flying and how much of it you do.
Ingat
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: UK
Posts: 191
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Philadelphia PA
Age: 73
Posts: 1,835
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes
on
2 Posts
Here I am!
It was several years ago that I flew the prototype HeliSAS on an R-44. It was a substantial improvement in stability in the cruise and even in the hover.
It didn't have any autopilot features, but such a system has been easily adapted to that on the Bell 206. Not expensive from what I understand, and certainly a life-saver in an inadvertant IMC encounter.
It was several years ago that I flew the prototype HeliSAS on an R-44. It was a substantial improvement in stability in the cruise and even in the hover.
It didn't have any autopilot features, but such a system has been easily adapted to that on the Bell 206. Not expensive from what I understand, and certainly a life-saver in an inadvertant IMC encounter.
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Center of the Universe
Posts: 645
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Unofficial update on Cobham/Chelton HeliSAS:
Have been waiting for the FAA to approve the 206/407 STC since about July, 2010. Latest word from Edwards is that FAA approval likely in the April, 2011 time frame.
I flew a 407 with this system installed (registered "experimental") in April, 2010 and was quite impressed. It is my understanding that the flight testing is long since complete and now the Feds are the hold up with paperwork. As far as cost, be thinking around $90,000 for the B407 (and that includes AP functions like heading hold, coupled approaches, etc.).
It is also my current understanding that Cobham has decided not to offer the HeliSAS for the R44 due to certain insurance issues.
Have been waiting for the FAA to approve the 206/407 STC since about July, 2010. Latest word from Edwards is that FAA approval likely in the April, 2011 time frame.
I flew a 407 with this system installed (registered "experimental") in April, 2010 and was quite impressed. It is my understanding that the flight testing is long since complete and now the Feds are the hold up with paperwork. As far as cost, be thinking around $90,000 for the B407 (and that includes AP functions like heading hold, coupled approaches, etc.).
It is also my current understanding that Cobham has decided not to offer the HeliSAS for the R44 due to certain insurance issues.
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Amazon Jungle
Age: 38
Posts: 304
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Plain Pointless
Why would ever want an auto-pilot in a ship that is not IFR Certified? That is just pointless in my point of view.
As a low level type of flight most of the times, i think the pilot should be at the controls at all times!
cheers.
As a low level type of flight most of the times, i think the pilot should be at the controls at all times!
cheers.
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Philadelphia PA
Age: 73
Posts: 1,835
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes
on
2 Posts
Soave Pilot:
It's to save your bacon when you run into bad weather / inadvertent IMC.
Lose sight of the horizon? You're probably not long for the world in most light helicopters. This system will help keep you alive.
It's to save your bacon when you run into bad weather / inadvertent IMC.
Lose sight of the horizon? You're probably not long for the world in most light helicopters. This system will help keep you alive.
It's to save your bacon when you run into bad weather / inadvertent IMC.
Lose sight of the horizon? You're probably not long for the world in most light helicopters. This system will help keep you alive.
Lose sight of the horizon? You're probably not long for the world in most light helicopters. This system will help keep you alive.
Mickjoebill
Mick - I spent a few days in an RAE simulator a good while back looking at handling qualities of stabilised and unstabilised helos - all to do with anti-tank ops and low level manouevring. We also looked at reduced visual cues and what was the best mix of HQ and cues - the worst case was an R22 in cloud where 90% of the time a crash was inevitable especially when any other pilot tasks were introduced.
As the level of stabilisation was increased so the survivability of the IMC encounter improved.
The answer to your question is that you fly with it on all the time or there is no point in having it fitted.
As the level of stabilisation was increased so the survivability of the IMC encounter improved.
The answer to your question is that you fly with it on all the time or there is no point in having it fitted.
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: airport
Posts: 343
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
If one inadvertently enters IMC under manual control, what is the procedure for switching this system on and how long does it take to stabilise the craft?
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Philippines
Posts: 5
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
We cannot just try to be unconcern with the fact that the helisas for light piston/turbine helicopter will be a very instrumental tool in keeping the pilot and most importantly the passengers of this aircraft safe...
I first saw that video (above) and I was amazed with the performance and the safety features that the helisas can provide.
Besides the fact that it can certainly ease the workload of the pilot it can sometimes helps him to balance the aircraft in dangerous situations...
Remember also this... robinson r44 and r22 has the most number of aircrafts sold... many people will benefit from this...
If the price can be lower though... Do anyone of you knows the estimated price for this kind of equipment... I just hope that it will be reasonable...
Thanks for the replies...
I first saw that video (above) and I was amazed with the performance and the safety features that the helisas can provide.
Besides the fact that it can certainly ease the workload of the pilot it can sometimes helps him to balance the aircraft in dangerous situations...
Remember also this... robinson r44 and r22 has the most number of aircrafts sold... many people will benefit from this...
If the price can be lower though... Do anyone of you knows the estimated price for this kind of equipment... I just hope that it will be reasonable...
Thanks for the replies...
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Center of the Universe
Posts: 645
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
If one inadvertently enters IMC under manual control, what is the procedure for switching this system on and how long does it take to stabilise the craft?
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: US
Posts: 231
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Mostly good advice so far on this thread.
Couple light helo ops with the fact that a high percentage of them are flown by low time drivers and sas makes even more sense.
Owners would be doing themselves a favor by budgeting such a unit for their bird.
HM
glockrecoil: I own several Glocks. Reliable quality weapons.
Couple light helo ops with the fact that a high percentage of them are flown by low time drivers and sas makes even more sense.
Owners would be doing themselves a favor by budgeting such a unit for their bird.
HM
glockrecoil: I own several Glocks. Reliable quality weapons.
There are no limits
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Shrewsbury, England.
Age: 66
Posts: 505
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I disagree.
We should be discouraging pilots from raising the likelihood of Inadvertant IMC encounter above REMOTE.
In other words, pilots who feel that having extra technology will enable them to fly in marginal weather where IIMC is likely are fools.
Discuss.
We should be discouraging pilots from raising the likelihood of Inadvertant IMC encounter above REMOTE.
In other words, pilots who feel that having extra technology will enable them to fly in marginal weather where IIMC is likely are fools.
Discuss.
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Center of the Universe
Posts: 645
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
pilots who feel that having extra technology will enable them to fly in marginal weather where IIMC is likely are fools.
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: airport
Posts: 343
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Nice technology... but I want to see you on a R22, in which you have less than 2 sec to lowering the collective, watching a map and having an unexpected shut down engine...
