The UK Childrens Air Ambulance - Info??

[Thud_and_Blunder]

Ah, there you go Bertie, bringing facts, clarity and perception to the discussion. Never learn, do you!?

Seriously, your points re the change of name for your neighbours had occurred to me too. Anyone else remember the people who were involved in stories like this? I can't see any difference at all between the name they used and the new one for those folk in the N and E Midlands.

As I believe PPRuNe has a policy of including the text of t'interweb articles for folk not able to access sites in our neck of the woods, herewith the text from the link I gave in para 2:

Beware 'Air Ambulance Service' Misleads Donors

Bag It Up would like to advise their charity supporters not to confuse their successful recycling scheme with an organisation known as ‘Air Ambulance Service’ after leaflets have been canvassed in numerous areas over the last few days.

The Yorkshire Air Ambluance Charity office, which is based in Elland, has received a copy of a leaflet which was posted in the Northowram area of Halifax yesterday evening, asking residents to donate clothing.

Katie Collinson from the YAA explains “We would like to clarify to all of our supporters that the YAA has no links whatsoever to ‘Air Ambulance Service’ nor have we ever been involved with them. Our official recycling partner is ‘Bag It Up Ltd’ who operates our regional recycling scheme on behalf of the Charity. We would also like to clarify that we do not operate a doorstep collection service. Instead we encourage our supporters to donate their unwanted textiles in their nearest YAA recycling bank found at various locations across the region.”

The Yorkshire Air Ambulance and Bag It Up Ltd have operated the successful recycling scheme across Yorkshire for over five years now, and recently celebrated raising a landmark £1million through the scheme. Any materials distributed about the YAA recycling scheme are fully branded with the YAA logo, Charity registration number, and full contact details.

(3 paragraphs follow explaining the legit system run in Yorkshire and various projects, then finally...)

The 'Air Ambulance Service' has been canvassing areas across the UK, and is not linked to any of our Air Ambulance Charity partners. Please visit our 'Partners' page to see which Air Ambulances are official recycling partners with Bag It Up. If anyone is in doubt about any literature or bags they receive about recycling for the Air Ambulance, we would encourage supporters to contact us or their local Air Ambulance Charity directly.

- If you want a really comprehensive read on why people and organisations around the UK should be interested in anyone calling themselves the Air Ambulance Service, make your way over to this little gem of a site. You may need a fair amount of time to wade through it all. Up to the reader to decide whether they and the Children's Air Ambo of old share any similarities.

[stormypete]

The Childrens Air Ambulance - Could it work?

Hello chaps, just thought I would chuck in my two pennorth worth as a current HEMS, and ex SAR, pilot operating the 135 in the UK.

The new management of the TCAA seem to be rather more legit than their predecessors, although the claims about their service seem as far-fetched and aspirational as ever, but I am really not convinced that what they are trying to achieve is worthwhile, affordable, or practical. Just a few points to start you off:

1. Running costs. I am not a commercial type but the numbers I hear bandied about are in the region of £1.2M per year for a 135 10hrs a day 365 days a year. A 24/7 operation would be more than double that due to crewing etc.

2. Response times. Even with 3 ac spread around the UK, getting the ac to the patient is going to take time.

3. Speed. Aren't long transfers a lot quicker by FW air Ambulances? That is why they use them a lot in Scotland where long transits are often required. I know they use a mix of RW and FW but TCAA does not seem to have clicked yet.

4. Space. One of the problems of the current crop of AA ac is lack of space for medical teams of more than 2 or 3 people. Bigger ac = more money, see point 1!! That is why SAR ac are sometimes used during the day in preference to AA.

5. Regulations. All AA operations are classed as commercial air transport and operate to those regs. So, no exemption from rule 5 (the low flying rule) or the 1000' rule for flight over/ in congested areas or from normal weather limits. There are exemptions available for HEMS work (interestingly not from rule 5 though!) but transfers between hospitals are not necessarily allowed to use these exemptions, it depends on whether the task is defined as HEMS or not (HEMS is where rapid and immediate transport is ESSENTIAL, Air Ambulance is where the ac is being used an extension to the normal, land-based, ambulance service). Currently night HEMS is not possible, although that may not be true for an awful lot longer as I believe there is a lot of work on NVG ops going on for the civvy AA market. (standing by for blast from Crab@Saavn!)

6. Icing. As far as I am aware there are no current civilian light twins with an icing clearance, that precludes IFR work for a fairly large chunk of the year! I could be wrong on this one though as I have not flown the 902/ 109/ S76.

So, apart from that lot as a starter, I can't see any snags at all!! Personally I would not give them a penny, I just cannot see that what they are trying to achieve is necessary.

Interesting that Beach Hut Boy never answered the questions though!!

[206 jock]

Stormypete,

You raise a series of interesting and pertinent points, none of which I can argue with.

It almost seems like the new 'owners' of TCAA (whose rather grandiose byline is now 'saving lives nationwide' ) acquired the dodgy charity to enable them to fundraise on a national level, using the emotive 'children's' moniker to legitimise their activities. But of course no-one would be that devious and scheming, would they? Funny that the 'Air Ambulance Service' have left the AAA. No doubt their 'we're just not understood' message fell on deaf ears amongst the other air ambulance operations. I gather that Midlands Air ambulance have put their position in the public domain. MAAC publicly slams children

What next, a Pet's air ambulance? People will put their hands in their pockets for that, surely? Would help keep a couple of thirsty A109's flying for a bit longer, for sure.

[Bertie Thruster]

TCAA does not seem to have clicked yet.

I think they have! It's very simple in the case of this charity; follow the money!

Hello stormypete. You must see some sights in your job!

Stormy: they (some 109 operators) don't think rule 5 applies to them as jarops states 300ft cloud base for HEMS!

[sightlesseyes]

MAAC publicly slams children

That's a cracking headline in itself.

Wouldn't give a chugger for TCAA the time of day.

[Bravo73]

FWIW, Private Eye have written an article about The Children's Air Ambulance in this fortnight's edition (no 1313). It's on pg 30.

[stormypete]

500 foot rule and JAROPs

Yup, it does, but it also states that this may be for "a short duration". Flying at 300 feet does not necessarily mean you will break the 500 foot rule though as this rule does not stop you flying below 500 feet. It stops you flying within 500 feet of a person vessel vehicle or structure. In the UK it is difficult, in most areas, to fly below 500 feet for any length of time without doing so however! But there are large chunks of uninhabitated Britain where it is perfectly possible to do so.

[Bertie Thruster]

I agree entirely but it's quite difficult to do so at your base airfield when the metar is 300ft!

but that's the cloud base min they use for launch!

[Cpt_Pugwash]

It seems that the TCAA are still at it.

Called into the Chester services on the M56 yesterday evening, and took our lad into the disabled toilet facility. Inside, there were two A4 size ADMEDIA wallplates, carrying an appeal, one for SHELTER, and the other for TCAA. The latter had photographs of two different helos, with " Captain Dan" posed in front of a third.
Readers were invited to text 'LIFESAVER' to a number to donate £3 to the TCAA.

I will try to contact ADMEDIA tomorrow to follow this up.

[Bertie Thruster]

And more lies, from the Plymouth area this time: Primary Times

If the industry doesn't get a grip of this money making con they may regret the outcome.

[PANews]

I dropped a line to the Primary Times HQ alerting them to the need to research their article....... silence has prevailed. So either the e-mail was spammed as a first contact or they are ignoring the message.

It is a bit like a horse to water.... and sadly I guess TCAA will eventually prevail through not enough people speaking out against their regular little successes.

[500e]

try this

[email protected]
Primary Times contact

[aliw135]

Update

Very interesting reading.

I founded the pages for TCAA, TAAS, DLRAA and WNAA on Wikipedia. And if there is anything that can be added (and referenced) then I'm sure it would help the article. (Although I am firmly against TAAS and TCAA.)

I have stuggled with a Wikipedia user called 'taas' who frequently turns the page into a huge advert for the charities, and deletes criticisms. One guess as to what 'taas' stands for.
If you know how Wikipedia works you can view his additions on the history page of each article. They make funny reading.

And also has anyone heard of 'Lucy Air Ambulance', similar to TCAA?! Childrens specialist?!

Let me know.

[PANews]

There is a BBC News Story out there that states TCAA [The Children's Air Ambulance] has been launched using an AW109 of the TAAS.

Some may recall that there was a promise/statement of intent to launch TCAA in December.

Well it looks like it has gone a month early but.... If the story is correct they have launched early with 'only' £500,000 collected but not as an independent service. Half a Mil is not a sustainable amount, so its badge engineering that will/may allow TAAS to claim the TCAA now has a machine. That will/may improve collection figures and allow them to meet the 'December' intention at a new deadline of February next year.

[SilsoeSid]

Simon Le Bon gets The Children's Air Ambulance off the ground | The Childrens Ambulance | TCAA

Simon Le Bon gets The Children's Air Ambulance off the ground

31 October 2012

Duran Duran star, Simon Le Bon, is lending his support to The Children's Air Ambulance today (31 October), to launch the lifesaving service at the Barclay's London Heliport in Battersea.

The Children's Air Ambulance (TCAA) will transfer critically ill children from general hospitals to Paediatric Intensive Care Units across England and Wales, or help move specialist paediatric teams to enable children to receive the lifesaving, specialist treatment and care that they need as soon as possible, cutting transfer times.

Simon Le Bon comments: "The Children's Air Ambulance is a fantastic new service that is desperately needed throughout the UK - each year, thousands of seriously ill children need urgent care at specialist hospitals. However, at the moment, they can face long road journeys, which could be detrimental to getting the lifesaving help they need.

"This service relies completely on charitable donations from the general public. It is my intention to do all I can to raise the profile of TCAA and to help raise the money that is so crucial to keeping the service running."

As well as reducing travel times, the air transfer service will also allow NHS specialist clinical teams to travel with the child - ensuring both a quick and safe journey.

Andy Williamson, Chief Executive of The Air Ambulance Service, comments: "It's a hugely exciting day for us. After months of planning, we're now entering a two month phase of training and fundraising - our crew will be visiting five children's transfer groups across the UK for familiarisation purposes - before beginning to undertake missions in early 2013."

The service needs a further £545,000 to begin delivering a life-saving service to critically ill babies and children in England and Wales, with a further £134,000 required per month to maintain the service. This money will be spent training staff and kitting out the helicopter to launch the country's first dedicated Air Ambulance service for critically ill children and babies.

He continues: "We have the helicopter, the pilots and the team and we're ready to go - our focus now is to secure the funds we need to get off the ground.

"The organisation is funded solely through the generous donations received from the public and vital support from corporate sponsors - without any Government or National Lottery funding - so we're urging the country to get behind the service to help us reach our £545,000 target."

Operating under the umbrella service of The Air Ambulance Service (TAAS), The Children's Air Ambulance will benefit from the extensive medical, aviation and core fundraising expertise gained through the running of TAAS' existing helicopter emergency medical services (HEMS); the Warwickshire & Northamptonshire Air Ambulance and the Derbyshire, Leicestershire and Rutland Air Ambulance.

[206 jock]

And the Association of Air Ambulance's thoughts on the matter:

30th October 2012

IS THERE A NEED FOR A CHILDREN'S AIR AMBULANCE?

Air ambulance charities across the country are warning that the launch of a new air ambulance operation could lead to a reduction in air ambulance provision and public confusion.

The concerns are raised in advance of the launch of a national children’s air ambulance based in the Midlands.

The Association of Air Ambulances, which represents the majority of air ambulance charities and ambulance services throughout the UK, says the proposed service is a retrieval service based on the current Paediatric Retrieval Service provided by the NHS. It is not an emergency service unlike all other air ambulance operations.

AAA Director, Clive Dickin, said: “There is currently no clinical evidence to support the provision of an enhanced service above the one already provided through public funding. Whilst the current service does very occasionally request a patient to be airlifted, it always uses the established network of air ambulances, military aircraft or private air ambulances.

“The proposed Children’s Air Ambulance (CAA) is to be based at Coventry Airport. While this is a central location, to use this aircraft to transfer a seriously ill child from say Somerset to London, the Coventry based aircraft would have pass over five existing air ambulance aircraft, which simply does not make sense from either a time or cost perspective.

“For over 20 years, air ambulances have provided a highly regarded and professional service across the UK doing emergency and retrieval work. Working closely with their local NHS ambulance service, air ambulances are tasked on a daily basis to respond to a variety of incidents, including paediatric referral cases.

“The clinical need for a dedicated air transport system is being reviewed by the Association’s Clinical Sub Committee, but to date, no clinical need for this new service has been identified.

“What is also worrying is that the pre-advertising of this service as a ‘national’ one has led to confusion amongst members of the public which will ultimately almost certainly lead to a drop in fundraising for all charities.

I can't disagree with the thrust of this, but the AAA's message is lost in the wind. Andy Williamson's ego trip continues to gather momentum - and using the emotive 'children's' tag to further his ambition is cynical and nasty. If ever I meet him, I'll tell him so too.

[[email protected]]

And they probably still won't do the ECMOs.

[SilsoeSid]

I saw this in our local midweek freebie yesterday;



Should the reporter be directed to this thread?

[206 jock]

Sadly Silo, I suspect the evangelical zeal of 'The Ego' has spread to the rest of the TAAS/TCAA team. All credit to them for seizing the agenda and consistently sticking to the thrust of their argument. The fact that everyone else around the country involved in air ambulance fundraising disagrees with them (as they all believe - apparently quite wrongly, according to TAAS - that local identity is vital to the success of local air ambulance operations) seems to be nothing more than an irritation.

But if you are minded, this thread was also relevant.

http://www.pprune.org/rotorheads/497...e-service.html

BTW anyone who believes that the answer lies in public funding of an air ambulance service...get real. That's an even more ridiculous notion than TAAS's proposals.

[chopper2004]

http://www.rotor.com/membership/roto...er04_05/12.pdf

Wondering if the instigators of the TCAA were thinking of the above when considering the 76? Using it as a model. Going along the lines of the US healthcare system or down under.

In summary

1) Simon Le Bon : is he putting his name and pocket at risk here if it goes Pete Tong?

2) Is there any whiff of fraud and if so why isn't the Fraud Squad / MIT investigating? On a humorous note are the TCAA a sinister secret organisation out to destabilise the current air ambulance charities in true 007 bad guy style ?

3) is there a genuine need for a dedicated infant / neonatal air transport in the UK? Funnily enough worked with incubator mount for a BO105 and EC135. AFAIK or guess ground transport / transfers are working fine. I could be wrong but then the magic question pops up about how many hospitals have dedicated helipads in UK?

4) if it does take off and doesn't affect the other charities then do we all bite our tongues. Realistically when are we looking at the TcAA aircraft performing its mission?

Cheers