Where does the UK/JAR "twin only" mentality come from?
Avoid imitations
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AnFI, so we can be assured that you have no twin time whatsoever. Thought so.
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AnFI, so we can be assured that you have no twin time whatsoever. Thought so.
Purveyor of Egg Liqueur to Lucifer
Chopjock;
Not quite sure what this has to do with anything. I don't have any twin time either but even I know that carrying an extra engine around is almost pointless when the biggest cause of crashes is not engine failure. FACT
Choppy, does your car have a spare wheel?
Top reasons for breakdown callouts;
1. Empty fuel tank
2. Using the incorrect fuel
3. Losing keys
4. Reporting on non-existent problems
5. Mechanical fault
6. Flat batteries
7. Blowouts/flat tyres
AnFI, so we can be assured that you have no twin time whatsoever. Thought so.
Top reasons for breakdown callouts;
1. Empty fuel tank
2. Using the incorrect fuel
3. Losing keys
4. Reporting on non-existent problems
5. Mechanical fault
6. Flat batteries
7. Blowouts/flat tyres
Avoid imitations
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Chopjock, perhaps both you and AnFI fail to realise that pilots flying twins almost exclusively trained on and operated single engined helicopters first.
To claim you know better is out of ignorance.
To claim you know better is out of ignorance.
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Unfortunately Chopjock one could argue that the reason "Engine Failure is not the biggest cause of crashes" is precisely because there are a lot of twin engined aircraft about where an engine failure is not catastrophic
.
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Choppy, does your car have a spare wheel?
But top causes of helicopter accidents :
Mishandled Controls
(22.02%) 85
Drivetrain Failure
(4.66%) 18
Wire Strike
(4.40%) 17
Under Investigation
(3.89%) 15
Loss Of Control IMC
(3.63%) 14
Maintenance Error
(3.11%) 12
Collision with Ground Based Object
(2.85%) 11
taken from: Helicopter Safety | Common Helicopter Accident Causes
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Slightly of topic but...
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Shyte Talk: "AnFI, so we can be assured that you have no twin time whatsoever. Thought so."
Clearly you conclude your views are right without any basis in fact.
The FACT is that 2 engines do not deliver the safety that they are supposed to. 1x10-9 is just not true - is it?
Hopefully we (you) can think outside the box which we (you) fly?
Clearly you conclude your views are right without any basis in fact.
The FACT is that 2 engines do not deliver the safety that they are supposed to. 1x10-9 is just not true - is it?
Hopefully we (you) can think outside the box which we (you) fly?
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Thought we were talking about engines
But top causes of helicopter accidents :
Mishandled Controls
(22.02%) 85
Drivetrain Failure
(4.66%) 18
Wire Strike
(4.40%) 17
Under Investigation
(3.89%) 15
Loss Of Control IMC
(3.63%) 14
Maintenance Error
(3.11%) 12
Collision with Ground Based Object
(2.85%) 11
But top causes of helicopter accidents :
Mishandled Controls
(22.02%) 85
Drivetrain Failure
(4.66%) 18
Wire Strike
(4.40%) 17
Under Investigation
(3.89%) 15
Loss Of Control IMC
(3.63%) 14
Maintenance Error
(3.11%) 12
Collision with Ground Based Object
(2.85%) 11
Engine Power Loss or Variation
(2.59%) 10
Engine Failure
(2.33%) 9
Which is almost 5% of events.
Also, that list is referring to "accidents" rather than "crashes". There is a difference i.e a wheels up landing following undercarriage selection problems is listed as an accident as is a cement bag blowing into the MR head after landing but they are not "crashes". Perhaps if a list of crashes were to be compiled, engine failure would be higher up.
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AnFI, you have been asked for the facts about your experience a number of times on the forum because it would give at least a little credence to your forthwright views. But you always refuse to give them and seem highly defensive. This indicates that you have no experience of twin engined helicopters, which you decry at almost any opportunity.
My box, as you put it, includes operating military single engine helicopters, as well as instructing on them, and dates back to when we were allowed to do much more with them, including search and rescue over water and ops in IMC and by night. At least my views are formed from experience of operating and instructing on both classes of helicopter.
My box, as you put it, includes operating military single engine helicopters, as well as instructing on them, and dates back to when we were allowed to do much more with them, including search and rescue over water and ops in IMC and by night. At least my views are formed from experience of operating and instructing on both classes of helicopter.
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AnFI
I'm absolutely with Shy here. There is something counter intuitive about your position. It would absolutely help us if we were able to ascertain your experience.
Is there a problem with that?
For what it's worth, I believe you may (historically) have said you have some twin time?
I'm absolutely with Shy here. There is something counter intuitive about your position. It would absolutely help us if we were able to ascertain your experience.
Is there a problem with that?
For what it's worth, I believe you may (historically) have said you have some twin time?
Just a numbered other
AnFi
Common sense only if that One thing had ever been devised.
It hasn't.
Two of something that might fail (and cause a problem) is worse than One thing that does not fail - common sense!
It hasn't.
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Being "intuitively wrong" seems commonplace here.
An example is the difference in Crash Stats for the North Sea Sectors as it would appear the most bellicose of the participants have the worst safety record.
So why are the Brits so quick to assume they hold the high moral ground in every discussion?
An example is the difference in Crash Stats for the North Sea Sectors as it would appear the most bellicose of the participants have the worst safety record.
So why are the Brits so quick to assume they hold the high moral ground in every discussion?
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AnFI, you have been asked for the facts about your experience a number of times on the forum because it would give at least a little credence to your forthwright views. But you always refuse to give them and seem highly defensive. This indicates that you have no experience of twin engined helicopters, which you decry at almost any opportunity.
Your logic is faulty. Perhaps that is related to your illogical belief in duplicating engines (of all things
)My box, as you put it, includes operating military single engine helicopters, as well as instructing on them, and dates back to when we were allowed to do much more with them, including search and rescue over water and ops in IMC and by night. At least my views are formed from experience of operating and instructing on both classes of helicopter.
Nick Lappos used to run a very good line in engine logic, oversized power plants to avoid the risk of engine failure in an 8 second window costs many downsides. (reduced fuel margins just for one for instance - this is the Glasgow (twin) thread is it not? It does not seem to have worked there.
These 'bullet proof' twins crashing all over the place are giving helicopters a bad name!
(anyway I like what twins do for me , but I am not deluded as to the downsides they also bring, whereas the twin supporters just point at the narrow result of engine failure.
The stats do not support the theoretical benefit of 2 engines. 1x10^-9 is not happening is it?
(play the ball
)
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This week I flew a 120 mile sea crossing (and back). I am not stupid, I wore an immersion suit, lifejacket, had floats fitted and carried a dinghy.
I would not have even considered it in a single engined helicopter, even if it was fitted with this magic engine that never fails. Yes, many other things could have brought me down, but I don't get paid enough to take that risk. I have over 1000 hours single turbine, 7000 total. My one single failure was over the English Channel with 60kt winds at 1000'. The second engine took me to Belgium. Only God knows how many of us would have survived a ditching.
I would not have even considered it in a single engined helicopter, even if it was fitted with this magic engine that never fails. Yes, many other things could have brought me down, but I don't get paid enough to take that risk. I have over 1000 hours single turbine, 7000 total. My one single failure was over the English Channel with 60kt winds at 1000'. The second engine took me to Belgium. Only God knows how many of us would have survived a ditching.
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AnFI
Do us all a favour (well many of us at least) and please take your incessant single lobbying to the regulators of the World. They make the rules. We don't. We just have to follow them. And when it comes to preference, I'm with them on this point - for over water, IMC and night, I want a twin. And even if some if that's psychological, that's as good a reason as factual if it keeps me relaxed.
Do us all a favour (well many of us at least) and please take your incessant single lobbying to the regulators of the World. They make the rules. We don't. We just have to follow them. And when it comes to preference, I'm with them on this point - for over water, IMC and night, I want a twin. And even if some if that's psychological, that's as good a reason as factual if it keeps me relaxed.
were more lynx or more gazelle lost due engine problems?
