What are the job prospects for new CPLs? (MERGED)
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I've always been a great believer that 'luck', be it good or bad, is proportionally generated from 'attitude' HillerBee, so I accept your comments and find myself nodding my head in agreement as I read them. I've always been viewed as 'lucky' in my current career (much to the chagrin of some), but I've always held the view its because I keep smiling even when its 'sh!t tasks are us', do any job to 100% of my abilities (even when it would be easy to hide that I've done a slapdash effort) and generally just get on with it without bitching like a spoilt kid.
Hopefully professional aviation will take to that sort of person the same as the engineering profession does. If so, I'll get there
Hopefully professional aviation will take to that sort of person the same as the engineering profession does. If so, I'll get there
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About to start out on the ladder...
I am currently in the navy and am planing to start training for my PPL in january, and hopefully gain it by April time. I then plan to work torwards my CPL IR over the next 3 or 4 years whilst staying in the navy.(none of this is being done through the navy, im planning on using cabair during my leave periods.) Once i have gained my CPL IR and am hitting .. say 250 .. 300 hours... am i likely to find an employer? im not to bothered about money, id just like experience. Also... would my job help? I am about to finish a 6 month tour in afghanistan working with the helicopter support unit... my main job has been Hooking underslung loads and traveling with the chinooks managing the freight and passengers. I also regulary fast rope out of lynx's and have completed the navy's Helicopter underwater escape training (Dunker). I was also involved in the rescue op for a downed lynx in 2004 in the channel, so i obviosly know the dangers of flying to 
.. although im not sure this would be the best thing to mention, both for personal moral reasons(4 people died) and for any potential jobs thinking i might freak out while flying..
Any comments would be appreciated
Chris
.. although im not sure this would be the best thing to mention, both for personal moral reasons(4 people died) and for any potential jobs thinking i might freak out while flying.. Any comments would be appreciated
Chris
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If you are willing to travel and do your FI course, yep you should find work no problem. In particular there is a shortage of FIs in Ireland.
Without an 'in', getting work as a bare bones CPL is pretty difficult. But can be done.
Without an 'in', getting work as a bare bones CPL is pretty difficult. But can be done.
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job hunt
hi guys, i'm back with a CPL(H) finally.
Any tips or rumors of companies around the world recruiting experiencless (over 150 hours) but full of enthusiasm pilots?
i know is not easy, whilling to start cleaning choppers, hangars, whatever needed.
thanks guys.
Any tips or rumors of companies around the world recruiting experiencless (over 150 hours) but full of enthusiasm pilots?
i know is not easy, whilling to start cleaning choppers, hangars, whatever needed.
thanks guys.
Employment in the UK
I understand at the moment it is a long, painful and very expensive exercise to convert say an oz licence to a UK (or JAR).
What are employment prospects (and conditions/ pay etc) like at the moment in the UK??? I have a Multi Command IR and a few thou hours etc however, before I hand over my hard earned Australian pesos for a licence conversion I would like to have some kind of idea as to employment likelyhood and what the state of play is at the moment...are people in the industry happy and optimistic about what the future holds for rotary drivers?
Any recommendations on where to do a conversion woud be appreciated also.
Anyone?
Thanks
Turkey
What are employment prospects (and conditions/ pay etc) like at the moment in the UK??? I have a Multi Command IR and a few thou hours etc however, before I hand over my hard earned Australian pesos for a licence conversion I would like to have some kind of idea as to employment likelyhood and what the state of play is at the moment...are people in the industry happy and optimistic about what the future holds for rotary drivers?
Any recommendations on where to do a conversion woud be appreciated also.
Anyone?
Thanks
Turkey
Turkey,
With your sort of background, Turkey, you shouldn't struggle to find work over here. Both the offshore operators and the onshore charter operators would be interested in talking to you once you've got your JAA licence. I can think of 3 largish operators in the London area who have all recently been looking for someone with your experience.
You might just need a bit of time to acclimatise to the UK environment but that should be covered in your CPL/IR conversions.
Personally speaking, I'm pretty happy with my current 'lot'. The industry generally has recently experienced a very high level of recruitment, both on and offshore. But beware of a couple of things: a) as you are no doubt aware, aviation is very cyclical. If we are currently on the crest of a wave, which way is it likely to go? By the time that you've converted your licence, the situation might be very different. b) If everybody is correct, we've got a recession coming up around the corner. I can't help but feel that the helicopter industry (esp onshore charter and training) is going to get hit by this.
Your biggest hurdle will be the theory exams. I suggest that you get a start on these by going distance learning with either Bristol Ground School or Caledonian Advanced Pilot Training.
There are a few flying schools which would be suitable for the flying conversions. The best for you would probably be determined where you end up being based. Try this thread for plenty of suggestions and recommendations.
Finally, you don't mention if you've got a 'right to work' in the UK. Without an EU passport or visa, this all might be bit of a non starter.
Anyway, I hope this helps and the best of luck with everything. Send me a PM once you've got your JAA licence.
You might just need a bit of time to acclimatise to the UK environment but that should be covered in your CPL/IR conversions.
There are a few flying schools which would be suitable for the flying conversions. The best for you would probably be determined where you end up being based. Try this thread for plenty of suggestions and recommendations.
Finally, you don't mention if you've got a 'right to work' in the UK. Without an EU passport or visa, this all might be bit of a non starter.
Anyway, I hope this helps and the best of luck with everything. Send me a PM once you've got your JAA licence.
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Question
Hey guys, just after some info if anyone can help....
I know, everyone thinking deja vu!!!
I was wondering if anybody knew of any operators around Cumbria area?
I am a low hour CPL (R22, B206), trying to get work / hours / funding for FI - the usual scratching for someone in my position.
Cheers
Power Up
I know, everyone thinking deja vu!!!
I was wondering if anybody knew of any operators around Cumbria area?
I am a low hour CPL (R22, B206), trying to get work / hours / funding for FI - the usual scratching for someone in my position.
Cheers
Power Up
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Industry Issue
Here we go again, another high hour pilot putting **** on a low hour CPL, well done PPrune Fan #1.
There is clearly a fundamental problem in the industry when a person spends a bucket load of cash getting to CPL level, yes that is a qualified commercial pilot, and then cannot get any paid work because he/she doesn't actually have enough hours. If there is a helicopter pilot's assocation in the UK that could try and do something about it we would not have the likes of Fan#1 complaining about the newbies desparate to get some hours so they can get a job that actually pays them to fly.
Its not that newby is intentionally trying to lower the pay scales by flying for free he/she needs the hours and how else are they going to get them?.
What we currently have then is a void from 200 hours to 250 hours and more expense to get an FI rating or up to 500 or 1,000 hours. So just what does newby do?
Meanwhile, he or she is out there on their own trying to put into practice all the lessons learnt but probably taking a few short cuts and getting some bad habits.
So why is there no form of emplyment structure for the newby, where they are paid a lower rate but are under supervision of an AOC holder, surely they could do some repositioning work or something similar. Oh no silly me the AOC holder most likely charges someone they are training for the repositioning, hmmm so what chance do they have? Just who is making all the money out there? and who cares about the future of the industry? We are supposed to be professionals, yet right now there is no complete training program available to the masses to get them from an initial trial flight to a paid helicopter pilot job.
Fan #1 instead of bagging out the newbies lobby for change, surely we could all benefit.
There is clearly a fundamental problem in the industry when a person spends a bucket load of cash getting to CPL level, yes that is a qualified commercial pilot, and then cannot get any paid work because he/she doesn't actually have enough hours. If there is a helicopter pilot's assocation in the UK that could try and do something about it we would not have the likes of Fan#1 complaining about the newbies desparate to get some hours so they can get a job that actually pays them to fly.
Its not that newby is intentionally trying to lower the pay scales by flying for free he/she needs the hours and how else are they going to get them?.
What we currently have then is a void from 200 hours to 250 hours and more expense to get an FI rating or up to 500 or 1,000 hours. So just what does newby do?
Meanwhile, he or she is out there on their own trying to put into practice all the lessons learnt but probably taking a few short cuts and getting some bad habits.
So why is there no form of emplyment structure for the newby, where they are paid a lower rate but are under supervision of an AOC holder, surely they could do some repositioning work or something similar. Oh no silly me the AOC holder most likely charges someone they are training for the repositioning, hmmm so what chance do they have? Just who is making all the money out there? and who cares about the future of the industry? We are supposed to be professionals, yet right now there is no complete training program available to the masses to get them from an initial trial flight to a paid helicopter pilot job.
Fan #1 instead of bagging out the newbies lobby for change, surely we could all benefit.
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Chances of finding work?
What Chance or Job would a person who is 26 years old and has a fresh JAA CPL(H) and MEIR(H) with 140 hours in R22 and 20 hours in A109.
This person also holds around 3000 hours fixed wing as a Training Captain on ATR 72 and is FI(A)IRI(A) and FE(A) who wants a change in career!!!
Would it be possible to get work on say a A109 for a charter company or what? How can one get Multi crew heli time? Is the North sea and SAR work the only way to get Multi crew time in the UK heli indistry?
Thanks for advice
This person also holds around 3000 hours fixed wing as a Training Captain on ATR 72 and is FI(A)IRI(A) and FE(A) who wants a change in career!!!
Would it be possible to get work on say a A109 for a charter company or what? How can one get Multi crew heli time? Is the North sea and SAR work the only way to get Multi crew time in the UK heli indistry?
Thanks for advice
Multi-crew work is obviously your only option with an IR and such low rotary time. SPIFR work will start at around the 1500hr (RW) mark.
But the North Sea operators are no longer your only option. Some of the larger onshore charter or corporate operators (eg PremiAir, Harrods, JCB, Starspeed etc) are now employing co-joes for multi-crew ops. The threshold is normally CPL/IR and around 1000TT. However, in this environment, your low RW time will obviously be offset by your considerable FW time.
As long as 'your face fits', I can't see you struggling to find work.
HTH
But the North Sea operators are no longer your only option. Some of the larger onshore charter or corporate operators (eg PremiAir, Harrods, JCB, Starspeed etc) are now employing co-joes for multi-crew ops. The threshold is normally CPL/IR and around 1000TT. However, in this environment, your low RW time will obviously be offset by your considerable FW time.
As long as 'your face fits', I can't see you struggling to find work.
HTH
Last edited by Bravo73; 20th May 2008 at 17:45.
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I know there are "discounts" in hours for a rotary licence if a fixed wing licence is already held but rotary TT of 160 hours for CPL/IR(H)? Wow, that's going some!!! Is this a hypothetical question?
Cheers
Whirls
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Whirls
(110 + 50).
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Wow, that's going some!!!
It's easy to be on the outside looking in and doling out opinions, but nonetheless it seems to me a very promising (and potentially lucrative?) airline career would be being thrown away.
If RW doesn't work out (and it's still potentially just as lucrative as either regional airlines or biz jets), I guess that the OP could always go back to the airlines.
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Thanks for the advice people!
Will look into the onshore operators that was mentioned above.
WhirlyGig, a JAA ATPL(A) holder who wants to get a fATPL(H) only needs 105 Hours(H) TT before they can start the 30hr JAA CPL(H) course, then the MEIR(H) is just complete the TR on A109 and 10 Hours IR training and can take the IR skill test then.
Why the change in career! Wants to do helicopter flying for a few years before settling down with family and then settle working for BA/Virgin doing long haul. Only young once!!!!
Again, thanks for advice
Will look into the onshore operators that was mentioned above.
WhirlyGig, a JAA ATPL(A) holder who wants to get a fATPL(H) only needs 105 Hours(H) TT before they can start the 30hr JAA CPL(H) course, then the MEIR(H) is just complete the TR on A109 and 10 Hours IR training and can take the IR skill test then.
Why the change in career! Wants to do helicopter flying for a few years before settling down with family and then settle working for BA/Virgin doing long haul. Only young once!!!!
Again, thanks for advice
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http://www.pprune.org/forums/showpos...&postcount=149
4,000 hours since April 2007 is going some, it has to be said - he must have flown about 11 hours every day of the week....
4,000 hours since April 2007 is going some, it has to be said - he must have flown about 11 hours every day of the week....
