I am wondering as a general enquiry what the operating cost of a B412 would be approximately just as a pax mover machine per hour. I have heard several wearied and wonderful figures that vary by 400%. They look damn expensive little feller's to run. Roughly what kind of pay load would you have to play with on a 150NM run with a 1hr IFR reserve? Thanks, and nothing to technical please !!
Bell Helicopter quotes the "direct operating cost" of the B412EP at $750.18USD per flight hour, based on fuel @ $1.50/gal and maintenance labor at $50/hr. For operational purposes you would also have to add indirect operating costs such as insurance, crewing, financing costs, depreciation, facilities etc etc. What did I hear you say, "Ripley's believe it or not??"
If you're after detailed data, suggest you try Conklin & Decker (www.conklindd.com). Addition of indirect costs takes the hourly rate for the 412 to ~ $900/hr.
I'm amazed that data like that exists. Thanks fot the help, but i would need the actual length of chord line.
I managed sort of get the angle out of some photos. Thanks for the tip on airfoil sprocket. I got 10° difference between root and tip chord line. Can anyone confirm this?
If i got this far, chord line length shouldn't be a problem.
Last edited by Phoinix : 13th October 2004 at 11:30.
On rotation you loose an engine and through your superior handling skills, knife edge reactions, you prevent ditching and after nursing your helicopter, climbing at the guaranteed 150 feet/minute ROC at 65 kts, you eventually reach a safe flight condition and altitude.
Now having to fly back to a onshore alternate for a single engine landing, what would the realistic figures be one can expect for indicated airspeed in kts and fuel consumption in lbs/hr?
Data I have been given to work on is 90 kts and 700lbs/hr single engine at loiter power? Loiter power, then you will never reach your destination and I think 90 kts is pushing it?
Some expert advice will be appreciated please!
(I hope I didn't bring back to many scary nightmares )
Glad to be of assistance. Unfortunately it's based on experience, over around 50 miles of unlandable/unditchable swamp. I have never found anything in the FM that covers SE fuel consumption adequately, although you can contact BHT directly on their website. Maybe they have some accurate SE cruise fuel figures ?
Let me, guess, Warri, PH, Eket area... say no more! Been there done that, mostly on singles... glad not to have had any trouble and lived to move on to the next level of fear and trepidation.
through your superior handling skills, knife edge reactions, you prevent ditching and after nursing your helicopter
All hypothetically speaking off course, to get to the figures for OEI flight fuel consumption and IAS in the cruise as NEO rightly helped with.
You said
Quote:
My experience would have you upside down after hitting your tail on the edge, or sitting happily on the floats looking smugly at each other.
I assume that you had the latter as your experience, as very few people survive the drop from a hundred foot inverted coming of the rig after hitting their tails on the deck. I have seen the evidence of that happening, and it wasn’t pretty.
Now if you have had the “My experience” part, please share it and make a wiser man out of me and at the same time offer your OEI figures for the cruise flight home as described in the post.
Your handle, OMR, is probably not because you are a bold pilot, but rather a old pilot as I know very few old and bold pilots. Sharing your story and your experience will be highly appreciated and I could very well learn something from it.
The engines that we house are PT6T-3BF engines.
Pretty reliable in the twinpack configuration, I would say.
OMR, NEO, Pretty low on power as you would say.
I agree fully. The nice thing though of the reliability of the remaining engine is that it\'s lack of power will most probably take you to the scene of the accident/ditching...
Get some of the Aramco pilots to explain their magic....they fly the 412EP's at 11,900 and do not cut weight except for night flying....and it gets rather warm in Saudi....
Their operation (off-shoot of PHI according to most folks in the know) does not consider CAT A performance at all....nor do they use any sort of identifiable CAT A profiles.
As I recall...with some clarity due to the lack of adult malt beverages in that part of the world....they basically used miminal climb and accelerated as quickly as possible to 60 kts....on takeoff from the rig and then considered that CDP of sorts. Lofting off some of the elevated decks there that were all of 25 feet above the briny....that could be an interesting proposition in my view.
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Sorry, I cant highlight an actual event, otherwise I may not be here to report the magic!!
My experience has been around Test Flying the various profiles at various Weights, Temperatures, AMSL and Crew Experience [discipline] levels.
The scenario described by yourself would be nearly impossible to execute successfully, regardless of the competence of the crew. There are many variables to consider in “your” departure, but if all goes wrong at the worse time, then you will not get safely away.
Sassy, as you know those machines are on the N Register.
The mention of the: WAT Chart, OEI Climb, MTOW and 100% Torque is a revelation. Shudder!!!
Remember this is a SP with 3B's, not an EP with DF engines.
Thanks for the input, will definately keep it in mind next time they want to load everything and the kitchen zinc in the back! Sometimes I wonder if it is worth it, especially in the Middle East under Sharia law...
Bell 412
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RTFM!
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