Aerobatics in a BO105
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Without questions very good performed from one of the most experienced aerobatic pilots in Germany with strong military background and therefore the aerobatic experience. But now he is retired and using civil (not experimental) a/c. Despite his KFB (H) ...
EUROCOPTER FLIGHT MANUAL BO 105 CB-4/CBS-4
S E C T I O N 2
L I M I T A T I O N S
2.17.5 Prohibited Flight Maneuvers
Aerobatic maneuvers are prohibited.
So, how could this be?
His a/c is one of the oldest civil BO 105, 30 years old.
The military BO 105 (sometimes to see on airshows) are not the same as the civil version. They have strengthened airframes, gearboxes and some other modifications. Due to the rigid rotorsystem all the forces and vibrations are direct transfered to the airframe. And they do not have civil RFMs.
Eurocopter abandoned the aerobatic shows with civ a/c a lot of years ago.
One of the heaviest civil accidents in the last years (2003) was an ex mil pilot, trying to underfly a bridge only 1m higher than the BO 105 was. "Have often done such manoeuvers during my mil time" was his excuse.
I don't understand why the german CAA (LBA) accept such questionable and normally not approved aerobatic flights or close his eyes, only to give a TV-Star an ego shoot with sensationel audience ratings (money, money, money
) and on the other side the CAA's are absolutely stringent and restrictive to the normal operators trying to hold their business alive. 
It must be interesting to see the CAA reaction after an aerobatic performance by an ex fighterpilot with an civil corporate jet.
And believe me, it is possible to do some impressive aerobatics with a Learjet.
EUROCOPTER FLIGHT MANUAL BO 105 CB-4/CBS-4
S E C T I O N 2
L I M I T A T I O N S
2.17.5 Prohibited Flight Maneuvers
Aerobatic maneuvers are prohibited.
So, how could this be?
His a/c is one of the oldest civil BO 105, 30 years old.
The military BO 105 (sometimes to see on airshows) are not the same as the civil version. They have strengthened airframes, gearboxes and some other modifications. Due to the rigid rotorsystem all the forces and vibrations are direct transfered to the airframe. And they do not have civil RFMs.
Eurocopter abandoned the aerobatic shows with civ a/c a lot of years ago.
One of the heaviest civil accidents in the last years (2003) was an ex mil pilot, trying to underfly a bridge only 1m higher than the BO 105 was. "Have often done such manoeuvers during my mil time" was his excuse.
I don't understand why the german CAA (LBA) accept such questionable and normally not approved aerobatic flights or close his eyes, only to give a TV-Star an ego shoot with sensationel audience ratings (money, money, money
) and on the other side the CAA's are absolutely stringent and restrictive to the normal operators trying to hold their business alive. It must be interesting to see the CAA reaction after an aerobatic performance by an ex fighterpilot with an civil corporate jet.
And believe me, it is possible to do some impressive aerobatics with a Learjet.
1. Only the military antitank version of the BO 105 is stronger. The liason heli is the same and aerobatic is only possible with the liason heli!
2. This pilot has and had the permission to do these aerobatics! It was given to him by Eurocopter itself. For example, on the 16th of September 2006 he performed an airshow at Donauwörth, the home of ECD and under the eyes of ECD. You can download a video at this: http://heli-szene.com/index.php?modu...position=101:2
3. Also the LBA is informed and gave their ok
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Oh yes, in the german national law you could find the term Kunstflugberechtigung (Hubschrauber), means an aerobatic license.
But guys...
1. §81 LuftPersV is a general paragraph, relevant to gliders, planes and helicopters. There are no differencies in this paragraph between gliders or helicopters.
2. There are no implementing provisions specifiying "helibatics" or aerobatic licensies (helicopters) in the german law, in contrast to gliders or planes.
3. Because there are no civil helicopters in Germany, approved and certified to do aerobatics, you couldn't fly the minimum of 5 training hours (according to §81 LuftPersV, necessary to all glider, plane and helicopter aerobatic licensies), despite the fact that you don't know what to train and to teach (lack of implementing provisions) and therefore you couldn't get the aerobatic ticket.
4. Therefore nobody knows how the 3 pilots got their KFB's. It's a kind of accolade performed by nobody wants to know (and now nobody wants to remember) in the german CAA.
5. As i wrote before, that kind of personally licence couldn't be used on non aerobatic a/c, means on civil certified helicopters.
6. Mr. Wilke is a very good pilot but now he is a retiree and i'm not sure, if the thing he is turning is good to the helicopter business.
BTW The problem on "helibatics" is not the airframe or the main rotor on BO 105, it's the tailrotor and especially the engineering mechanics of the tailrotor.
Thats one of the headaches i have. There are the first offers to "adventure" PAX flights with this BO 105 available. Of course 4 Passengers in this 105. The price is at the moment 250€. "Fly like a stunt pilot" is the official headline and ..." we don't recommend this flight to newbies".
If it would be possible to get a new "helibatics" ticket from the CAA i'm sure this would be a big business, because BO 105 are so cheap in the moment on the market and the interest in helibatics seems to be growing
Interested? In may the german army will sold 10 BO 105 M (military version) to junk prices. (but it's impossible to register the ships civil in the JAA world)
But guys...
1. §81 LuftPersV is a general paragraph, relevant to gliders, planes and helicopters. There are no differencies in this paragraph between gliders or helicopters.
2. There are no implementing provisions specifiying "helibatics" or aerobatic licensies (helicopters) in the german law, in contrast to gliders or planes.
3. Because there are no civil helicopters in Germany, approved and certified to do aerobatics, you couldn't fly the minimum of 5 training hours (according to §81 LuftPersV, necessary to all glider, plane and helicopter aerobatic licensies), despite the fact that you don't know what to train and to teach (lack of implementing provisions) and therefore you couldn't get the aerobatic ticket.
4. Therefore nobody knows how the 3 pilots got their KFB's. It's a kind of accolade performed by nobody wants to know (and now nobody wants to remember) in the german CAA.
5. As i wrote before, that kind of personally licence couldn't be used on non aerobatic a/c, means on civil certified helicopters.
6. Mr. Wilke is a very good pilot but now he is a retiree and i'm not sure, if the thing he is turning is good to the helicopter business.
BTW The problem on "helibatics" is not the airframe or the main rotor on BO 105, it's the tailrotor and especially the engineering mechanics of the tailrotor.
Thats one of the headaches i have. There are the first offers to "adventure" PAX flights with this BO 105 available. Of course 4 Passengers in this 105. The price is at the moment 250€. "Fly like a stunt pilot" is the official headline and ..." we don't recommend this flight to newbies".
If it would be possible to get a new "helibatics" ticket from the CAA i'm sure this would be a big business, because BO 105 are so cheap in the moment on the market and the interest in helibatics seems to be growing
Interested? In may the german army will sold 10 BO 105 M (military version) to junk prices. (but it's impossible to register the ships civil in the JAA world)
1. To get a helicopter aerobatic license you have to do the same like a
fixed wing pilot: 5 hrs training and a checkride. The training and check includes
the aerobatic manoeuvres like roll, loop, Immlemanturn, turn Split s etc.
Therefore you need a helicopter which is licensed for aerobatic (tell me which one is??)
and an instructor with a helicopter aerobatic license.
The 3 pilots have done this aerobatic training and the checkride because Eurocopter allowed it.
2. Stefan Raab (the tv guy) is a licensed fixed wing pilot and helicopter pilot.
Therefore it is no problem to have dual controls.
For my knowledge there has never been the idea to make aerobatic flights
with passengers.
3. If you would know the BO 105, you would also know that at this helicopter you have no problem with tailrotor or mechanics. This heli was in originally designed for aerobatics. This was the idea in 1968. Of course the ECD company has no interest to allow everybody aerobatics. Therefor it is genereally not allowed - just for 3 guys, and they work by the way for ECD.....
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B105 Aerobatics
Found these if your interested . I believe these are the movies you were referring to at the start of the thread.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5sqtFOQ8acs
Looks like the same guy : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oXoRzzqWruU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5sqtFOQ8acs
Looks like the same guy : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oXoRzzqWruU
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Bo-105 aerobatics
Hi all,
Apologies if this has been posted before - quite amazing though!
http://www.flixxy.com/bo105-helicopter-aerobatics.htm
Cheers,
Di
Apologies if this has been posted before - quite amazing though!
http://www.flixxy.com/bo105-helicopter-aerobatics.htm
Cheers,
Di
There is much more exciting stuff around featureing the 'ol "Blo-kow" !!!
....like these ones:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RGu45s1_QPU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oBsaSjJ3qho
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lUYwHXfxLpc
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Ignoring g force and with the right power to wieght ratio ...................................
http://www.edmheli.ca/videogallery/A...he%20lake.html
http://www.edmheli.ca/videogallery/A...he%20lake.html
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Is it just me or does that rotor disc seem too close to the ground for comfort on some of those low level steep banks. I wouldn't say that I was impressed but rather shocked. I guess I am getting soft in my old age.
Cheers,
FA
Cheers,
FA
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Mmmmm.....
Well not knowing which country the "Red Bull" Boelkow is registered in .... and assuming its on a civil register .... I would suggest the pilot doing the "Aeros" is in fact breaking a few rules .... particularly the bit in the flight manual which states "INTENTIONAL AEROBATICS PROHIBITED" ??????
Still I think he's having much more fun than he did with the Jetranger he used to play with ?
Cheers
Well not knowing which country the "Red Bull" Boelkow is registered in .... and assuming its on a civil register .... I would suggest the pilot doing the "Aeros" is in fact breaking a few rules .... particularly the bit in the flight manual which states "INTENTIONAL AEROBATICS PROHIBITED" ??????
Still I think he's having much more fun than he did with the Jetranger he used to play with ?
Cheers
Well not knowing which country the "Red Bull" Boelkow is registered in .... and assuming its on a civil register .... I would suggest the pilot doing the "Aeros" is in fact breaking a few rules .... particularly the bit in the flight manual which states "INTENTIONAL AEROBATICS PROHIBITED" ??????
They are working close together with Eurocopter, so the aerobatics should be legal.
More on the Red Bull Homepage:
http://www.redbullusa.com/#page=Arti...204-62961151.0
skadi
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BO-105 playing in the trees
Not sure if this been posted before? Saw it on another forum and was wondering what people thought of it here...
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=00e3fa8123
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=00e3fa8123
Exciting clip, but there's 3 things I don't like about it - blades get too close to the ground in some of those turns, the bunts just don't look right (old teetering head instincts coming out there) and he lets go of the cyclic straight after he lands for some reason.
What's the purpose of the clip? Skilful flying but a bit gung ho.
What's the purpose of the clip? Skilful flying but a bit gung ho.
To sell BO-105s. It was the official MBB/Eurocopter sales video.
Some great flying and some even better music!
If you do a search (particularly in the 'Rotorheads around the World: Videos' thread), you might find some previous discussion and comments about the vid.
Some great flying and some even better music!
If you do a search (particularly in the 'Rotorheads around the World: Videos' thread), you might find some previous discussion and comments about the vid.
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Yes .... we have seen this all before ... its also posted on "youtube" somewhere?
I think this clip probably goes back quite a frew years and may have been produced to demonstrate how manouverable the old "Blokow" is for "nap of the earth" type flying .... they were after all developed to be the German Armys most able defence against the low flying Mil 24 "Hind" during the "Cold War" .... WAY more agile than the old Huey.
In fact you don't really understand helicopter agility and control response till you've flown the Bo105 ...... "Even the Birds are Jealous!"
I think this clip probably goes back quite a frew years and may have been produced to demonstrate how manouverable the old "Blokow" is for "nap of the earth" type flying .... they were after all developed to be the German Armys most able defence against the low flying Mil 24 "Hind" during the "Cold War" .... WAY more agile than the old Huey.
In fact you don't really understand helicopter agility and control response till you've flown the Bo105 ...... "Even the Birds are Jealous!"
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In regards to him getting very close to the trees etc, a 1/3 of the way through and he actually hits a small young tree/bush with the rotor blades as he is turning... you can see the blades whack it just before he levels off.
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First time i saw this - heart was in mouth just watching it. Notice that little twitch to starboard to avoid the small tree, as seen from cockpit. Razor61, i think that small sapling was just being hammered by downwash - but it is very close.
Spinwing, do you find yourself having to correct for crosscoupling much on this machine? I gather hingless rotors feel less stable, which i take to mean cyclic is more controlling pitch/roll accel than rate (since fuselage mass reduces rotor gyro nutation force over similar teetering design).
Mart
Spinwing, do you find yourself having to correct for crosscoupling much on this machine? I gather hingless rotors feel less stable, which i take to mean cyclic is more controlling pitch/roll accel than rate (since fuselage mass reduces rotor gyro nutation force over similar teetering design).
Mart
Last edited by Graviman; 2nd Apr 2007 at 18:52. Reason: Watched for blade clip.
