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Old 12th Oct 2017, 07:56   #1 (permalink)
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Join Date: Aug 2001
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Mayday or Pan Pan

is it required to give a Mayday or PanPan call in case of the following situations?
1) Single Engine failure on a twin engine aircraft (for eg. A320) on ground during takeoff roll and aircraft stopped on the runway (no runway excursion)

2) Single Engine failure in a twin engine aircraft (A320) in air but no fire?

As per my understanding in the case of (1) neither Mayday or Pan Pan is required as neither there is distress nor urgency.

In case of engine failure in air it is Pan Pan unless engine filre will lead to a forced landing or ditching or ejection in case of aircraft equipped with ejection seats.
I have seen many instructors insisting on Mayday call.
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Old 12th Oct 2017, 08:18   #2 (permalink)
 
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matters not a jot in Europe.

If its in your SOP's just do what they want. Its really not worth arguing the toss about.
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Old 12th Oct 2017, 08:42   #3 (permalink)
 
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I seem to remember from some dim and distant past that if you lose more than 33% of your power it's a mandatory mayday in the air. In practical terms In most parts of the world if considering pan or mayday I'd call mayday and sort out the paperwork later.
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Old 12th Oct 2017, 08:43   #4 (permalink)
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We have to keep this also in mind:
The distress communications have absolute priority over all other communications, and a station aware of them shall not transmit on the frequency concerned……
This implies our Mayday call is going to affect other aircraft too. So the question is, can we use it indiscriminately?
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Old 12th Oct 2017, 08:44   #5 (permalink)
 
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Don't overthink this. If you think you need to you need to. You can always downgrade later.
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Old 12th Oct 2017, 08:55   #6 (permalink)
 
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This has been done to death over and over. Do what your SOP's say.

This trainer said this, this trainer said that.....they will all have different opinions. Use your judgement. That's what you are paid for.
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Old 12th Oct 2017, 09:35   #7 (permalink)
 
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It depends on the authority as well. In Japan loss of one engine on a twin is MAY DAY.
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Old 12th Oct 2017, 09:46   #8 (permalink)
 
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You MAY declare Mayday and then reduce to PanPan later. One point is crucial: If you need to divert from your clearance due to performance, i.e. you have to follow a CP, then you must declare a Mayday.

Everything else is: Follow your SOP's, follow local regulations (see the info regarding Japan above), but follow as well common sense and handle the situation according your best knowledge and experience.

Finally you are sitting in the aircraft in distress and every controller or later on a laywer cannot follow your thinking and doing at this very Moment you lost some power and Performance.
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Old 12th Oct 2017, 10:43   #9 (permalink)

de minimus non curat lex
 
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And where exactly in official publications does it say about DOWNGRADING a Mayday to Pan? (UK regs or elsewhere)

What is being gained by such a decision?
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Old 12th Oct 2017, 11:41   #10 (permalink)
 
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Quote:
I have seen many instructors insisting on Mayday call.
Sometimes it's better to simply take advice instead of discussing it. After all, how many such calls are you likely to make!
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Old 12th Oct 2017, 12:11   #11 (permalink)


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If you feel like you need to call Mayday, then do it! Just listen to yourself
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Old 12th Oct 2017, 12:51   #12 (permalink)
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It is not just about what I do myself. It is also imparting the right knowledge to the youngsters. That's the reason I posted the question thinking that I will get clear cut answers.
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Old 12th Oct 2017, 18:50   #13 (permalink)
 
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In the US, "PanPan" may just get you puzzled looks/inquiries, because it is seldom used. If you need assistance, call "Mayday".

In the rejected takeoff scenario, it depends on whether it is a simple failure or fire/severe damage. If you can clear the runway and taxi back to your gate, simply state your intentions. If you were near V1, which means you will have hot brakes and/or flat tires, you should call Mayday to get the fire response moving. Same if you think you spewed your turbine blades all over the runway; an inspection/cleanup before the next attempted takeoff is warranted.
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Old 12th Oct 2017, 19:04   #14 (permalink)
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boyington View Post
It is not just about what I do myself. It is also imparting the right knowledge to the youngsters. That's the reason I posted the question thinking that I will get clear cut answers.
If you you want a correct answer then you may need to research the subject yourself. This is PPRuNe, expect personal opinions not answers.
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