Isn't After landing C/L in A320 challenge-n-response?
Beau_Peep
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Isn't After landing C/L in A320 challenge-n-response?
Lot of pilots in my airline does not treat after landing C/L as challenge-n-response. FCTM says all 9 checklists are challenge-n-response.
Mostly I found, PM reads this checklist silent and confirms ' After landing checklist completed' loudly.
what is the norm in your airline?
Mostly I found, PM reads this checklist silent and confirms ' After landing checklist completed' loudly.
what is the norm in your airline?
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It is read and do at the airline I work for. I think that is the Airbus SOP. That way the PF can concentrate on taxiing.
Maybe those that read and do in your airline were previously working somewhere else?
Maybe those that read and do in your airline were previously working somewhere else?
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Challenge and Respond can be conducted by the PM only. It doesn't infer that two crew are required to participate. ( Even though the FCTM does appear to give that direction. Company's do establish their own variations )However in my opinion challenge and response should be verbalised so the PF can follow the progress.
Last edited by RUMBEAR; 30th Nov 2016 at 02:46.
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I suggest that the OP answers himself these two questions:
1) What can happen if PM accidentally skips a point in "After LDG" checklist, because he reads it himself with no monitoring from PF?
2) What can happen if PM accidentally taxies into the grass (or perhaps onto an active runway), while he is distracted by cross-checking the after-landing items of the PM
1) What can happen if PM accidentally skips a point in "After LDG" checklist, because he reads it himself with no monitoring from PF?
2) What can happen if PM accidentally taxies into the grass (or perhaps onto an active runway), while he is distracted by cross-checking the after-landing items of the PM
We never used to have an After Landing checklist until recently.
Firstly it's a check list and not a do list.
The PF and PM do their respective flows and then the PM calls and answers the checklist.
Firstly it's a check list and not a do list.
The PF and PM do their respective flows and then the PM calls and answers the checklist.
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We used to have no checklist between after start and parking checklist, so th fter landing items were just a flow without verbal element.
Now that we have all those superfluous checklists they are all done challenge response. So the after landing checklist is read by the PM and answered by the PF. But we forget it quite often without any harm done, probably because we never needed it for the 10 or so years before.
Now that we have all those superfluous checklists they are all done challenge response. So the after landing checklist is read by the PM and answered by the PF. But we forget it quite often without any harm done, probably because we never needed it for the 10 or so years before.
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it can be even worse if you forget to start the APU before turning off your engines and you have a tailpipe fire..We are very lucky to have SOPs and we should stick to them. It is clearly stated that ALL Airbus Checklists are challenge-reponse.
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Note the difference between items and checklist. However, yes, captains that are new to the role of PM on the ground tend to forget items in the beginning as well, but FOs usually do remind them.
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Don't forget the FCTM is not Airbus SOP's. It is merely a guide for pilots on techniques airbus recommends and is to be used in conjunction with the FCOM, company SOP's and training guides.
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We had an a/c swap a few months ago where the a320 taxied onto stand with flaps full.
Nothing was thought of but it did turn out that they had a medical onboard on final approach. Pilots were too busy trying to get to stand for further medical assistance than to simply retract the flaps.
At the end of the day, if an AFTER LDG c/l is not done, then it really isn't any big deal.
WXR radar?
TCAS?
XPDR 1200?
FCU reset 1000'?
Nothing was thought of but it did turn out that they had a medical onboard on final approach. Pilots were too busy trying to get to stand for further medical assistance than to simply retract the flaps.
At the end of the day, if an AFTER LDG c/l is not done, then it really isn't any big deal.
WXR radar?
TCAS?
XPDR 1200?
FCU reset 1000'?
Didn't have a check list in my previous company, PM just did the flow and kept quiet. Current company has a checklist which the PM reads after they have done the flow. Bit of a waste of time but then so is the after take-off and approach checklists that they also insist on, neither of which we had in a previous life either. More mouth music does not equal a safer operation in my opinion.
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European orange airline: the after-landing checklist is read and do silently by PM. PF monitors but does not actively participate.
Very rarely something is forgotten (LS push-button, FDs back on after raw data approach etc) and I've seen only one occasion in 5 years where the flaps were forgotten.
Very rarely something is forgotten (LS push-button, FDs back on after raw data approach etc) and I've seen only one occasion in 5 years where the flaps were forgotten.
