on almost 30 flights with ryanair the landing was hard compared to other airlines.
what are the reasons in your opinion?
1) 737-800 is very long and needs this kind of manouver 2) 737-800 needs a strong flare, otherwise is difficult to control at landing 3) a gentle landing requires a long runway, and ryr uses little airports with short runways 4) insufficient training 5) boeing philospophy 6) ryanair policy 7) other....
My opinion: It's not a very forgiving aircraft to land; it's one of the most difficult aircraft I've ever flown in trying to get consistently good landings, speed control is often difficult as it's such a slippy aircraft, the fitting of winglets did not help. They also do a LOT of training as a result of the revolving door policy of employee relations which leads to lots of training flights and inexperienced F/Os. They also fly to a lot of black hole out of the way airfields with minimal lighting. It all adds up.
Also Boeing Policy is a firm touch down, on speed and on the markers. Holding off in the flare to grease it on uses a lot of runway. Passengers perception of a good landing versus the reality are sometimes far apart.
1) 737-800 is very long and needs this kind of manouver
I don't think it is the length necessarily but the -800 is a bit of a cut and paste aircraft with lot's of different generations of the 737 cobbled together and is very much a compromise in some areas!
2) 737-800 needs a strong flare, otherwise is difficult to control at landing
It's not the strength of the flare rather the quality and timing.
3) a gentle landing requires a long runway, and ryr uses little airports with short runways
The runway length should be immaterial. The technique should remain the same regardless of runway length, i.e On Speed, main gear on the aiming points, positive touchdown, retarding measures applied on schedule.
4) insufficient training
For all their faults Ryanair gives lots of sectors to trainees, far and above what other airlines give.
5) boeing philospophy
See point 3.
6) ryanair policy
Ryanair advocates the method described in the Boeing flight crew training manual (FCTM), again point three.
Again, it is a slippery bugger and I rarely see anyone touchdown at Vref, it's usually too fast or if you go below Vref trying to correct aggressively in the flare it drops like a brick! Coupled with some black hole airports and very fatiguing rosters. Those are my excuses anyway.
Edit: (P.S I see you are from Paris, so I assume you fly out of BVA? That has one of the highest incidence of hard landings in the company. It's a black hole, like landing on an aircraft carrier, No Papis, a big hump in the runway, rough winds in the winter, that catches even the 'Top Guns" out once in a while...)
I also have around 30 flights with Ryanair, and have only experienced one, what I consider to be, hard landing - at Dublin, because it was windy and we landed sideways. You could repeat this thread for every single airline, because each one will have good landings and bad landings. Perhaps you've just been unlucky?
It is a problem that passengers perceptions of safety are massively influenced by how firm the touchdown was. You could bust every limit in the book during the approach and if the touchdown was smooth most passengers would think you did a good job.
Boeing is absolutely clear about not encouraging smooth touchdowns. We all like to do them because of what passengers think, but in many cases a firmer touchdown is safer, particularly on a wet runway. There are obviously limits. But it is very unusual for any damage to occur to the aircraft even when the limits are exceeded. Ironically you can do much more damage striking the tail when holding off too long trying for a smooth touchdown.
The 737NG has (IMO) a noticeably 'harder' suspension than older models up to the -500, making landings feel heavier. The longer fuselage also causes slightly more concern about tailscrapes and perhaps subconsciously limits the flare before touchdown some pilots apply. I've flown older-model 737 for 12 years with 3 years on NGs (700s, shorter than 800s).
Perhaps the 737-800 just like many other mass built types is a bit of a flip of a coin lander and you cannot prescribe what will happen?! At the end of the day you can be as skilled as you like but if your luck isn't there.............
I would like to know why then easyjet with their A319 almost always perform touchdowns that are so silky smooth- on several occasions I hadn't even realised we had landed. Ive been on 100+ easyjet flights and nearly everyone is like that. Whereas as all the previous posts say ryanair touchdowns could knock your fillings out. I'm sure its not down solely to the pilots.
The A319 is very easy to land and has a short body so you have no real worries of tailstrike in the flare unless you are doing something very wrong.
For what it is worth as a very regular passenger of Ryanair I would say their landings are average the same as every other airline. Last flight I had was 2 days ago, the pilot greased it into Luton. I struggle to grease it in there in the bus, the runway is short and has a slope at either end. I fly the A321 most of the time, it pretty much lands itself.
I'm told that the 738 is difficult to 'grease'. Personally I don't care (within reason) how firm the touchdown is and neither does Mr Boeing. He, like me, would rather be in the touchdown zone, on the centreline, at the right speed, running straight, using the approved landing technique. Anything else is a bonus - and that's whether I'm flying it or the other pilot.