Looking to start... SACAA to UK?

[AntonyBuck]

Good Evening,

Alright, I have a feeling I may ramble a little so please bare with me.

I am 30 years old with absolutely NO flight experience at all. I have, for a VERY long time wanted to be an airline pilot. The only hurdle for me (as I am sure it is for 99% of everyone else) is the cost. After a LOT of reading on PPRUNE and various other places I have been looking at training in South Africa. At the moment it is still in the 'dream' phase, but if cost can be mitigated somewhat then it will move into planning phase....

So here are my concerns, I am sure they have been addressed in previous posts but i really have searched and cant see the answers to all questions from reliable sources...

1. If i do PPL(A) in SA (Giving SACAA PPL) can i use it in England, UK as entry onto ATPL course with the intention of becoming airline pilot?

2. I have seen courses advertised that don't require a PPL in order to progress to ATPL(A(f)), is this real or am i misunderstanding something?

3. I am looking at Algoa flight school in Port Elizabeth, does anyone have RECENT experience there?

4. Im sure i will have missed things that i need to know, but the most important is probably number 1. if there are large expenses in making the SACAA PPL useable here then it wouldnt be worth it.

Sorry for rambling, as i said i really am a novice so please no unhelpful comments if you dont mind lol.

Thanks again.

[paco]

The only courses that do not require a PPL first are integrated ones, where it is all included - i.e. you can walk off the street.

Given that you haven't flown yet, I would get a PPL first anyway to if you like it or, more to the point whether it likes you Any ICAO standard PPL is good to start a modular course.

[aceman18]

Morning Antony,

I started my flying training back in 2009, and did a very similar route to what you're looking at. I completed my PPL and hour building in South Africa, whilst doing Bristol Ground School's distance learning ATPL. Then, once you've built your hours, you can return to the UK to complete a small amount of Multi-engine and instrument training to the complete a UK CPL/ME/IR. Once you complete your UK ATPL exams, you then have a frozen ATPL.

Once you have your SA PPL, you can use it to fly privately in the UK. All you'll need is a check flight, and you're good to go.

Flying in SA is amazing, and with the exchange rate at the moment, it'll save you a lot of cash. Only problem is the schools there aren't really affiliated with any airlines etc, so wont be able to help you out getting a job at the end.

I training at 43 air school - just down the road from Algoa. I don't know much about the air school itself, but PE is a good airport to be based at.

Hope that helps.

[AntonyBuck]

Thanks both for the quick relevant replies

Aceman, Where are you at with things now? Do you have a job after going the SA route?

Would you mind me asking what the total cost was for you from zero to fATPL please? I would love t ochat with you if its OK to get an idea of the scheme of things and the costings roughly, I know the exchange rate is favourable at the moment but still..

I can't PM on here yet as im a newb lol.

[aceman18]

I've been very lucky with jobs post-training. Currently a First Officer on the A380. Having said that, of my batch of about 8 people during training (all Europeans), there were only 2 or 3 of us who got a flying job relatively quickly. A couple more have managed to find flying jobs after a few years of looking/trying to keep their licence current. The rest have unfortunately not found anything at all, and have had to go back to previous jobs to support their families and pay back the training loans. Most of the South Africans I trained with are working either as instructors or as bush/charter pilots. Great fun for them, but in terms of salary etc, pretty poor.

I did my course through a UK company, who basically organised all the admin of the training in SA and UK. I think the total cost for training and accommodation was £65-£70k. On top of that, you need living money. At the time, we were getting 12 Rand to the Pound. Its now about 21, so I would expect it to be a bit cheaper. Also, if you organise it yourself, you should be able to make significant savings. I recommend you get familiar with the licence requirements of the South African PPL, and also the UK (f)ATPL. -

https://www.caa.co.uk/Commercial-ind...icence-(ATPL)/

That'll include the minimum requirements for what you need. You need to take into account that flying training will probably take longer than you anticipate. There are a whole raft of things that can slow you down - bad weather, lack of instructors, aircraft in maintenance, lack of aircraft etc etc. Also, it's not uncommon for people to fail the odd exam here and there, or need to repeat training sessions or flying tests.

Please feel free to ask anything else you're wondering about, and i'll try to help!

[AntonyBuck]

Thanks again.

I have been looking more and more today and it seems the total cost for everything start to finish including accommodation is around 500'000 Rand, which at the moment works about £25'000, allowing for contingencies probably £30k. This seems very cheap, and very expensive at the same time.

I think however, with the EASA now being in force it may be better in the long run to do the integrated with a Spanish company, cheaper prices and still part of EU. I have had a price quote of around 57k euros including accommodation and everything pretty much.

As you said though the gamble of not having any employment after it is immense. How did you manage to get a job as FO with the A380!! Well done by the way haha.I think its about who you know as well as what you know, after all more or less all graduate pilots will be at the same level of knowledge and hours.

At the moment I do not have the money to do it, i would struggle to do my PPL at the moment financially, but I am hoping that I can put future money towards ATPL etc with a view to being airline pilot like yourself.

I have looked at a good few airline recruitment pages and most want 1500+ hours with 300+ rated on whatever they are flying, not sure how one is supposed to acheive this though realistically, especially after having paid out already massive money for the licences themselves.

So in short, if i had the money now I would go to the Spanish place i think, but sadly i dont at the mo. I could do the PPL first and see what happened from there, but i think i am destined to be eternally sad and never reach my goal of being an airline pilot. Im not after massive money, just want to do it and do it well

[aceman18]

One word of warning with EASA countries other than the UK - a lot of airlines in the UK require a UK issued EASA licence; meaning you have to have done the exams & skills test in the UK. With regards to the 1500+ hours, this is usually built up by instructing, doing parachute drops, bush flying etc. Type ratings are sometimes purchased by the person looking for a job. A few of my friends had to do that for their first job (usually B737 or A320).

I recommend that you get to your local airfield and take a few flights. Go solo. See if you like it. I know a few guys who started training, but it just wasnt for them.