Skies Aviation 737 Line Training???
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Avoid Skies, I have a close friend whom did business with them.
They are legitimate and do have acess to line training, however management are completely unqualified, owner is AM an old rejected Airbus pilot, he runs the company with a Filipino and an Iranian HR woman who has no clue about the industry.
Since Skies started in 2012 they have had around 30 Students all of which are very unhappy, massive delays, broken promises etc partner airlines have gone bust a good example is Eastern Sky Jets, where 10 pilots all paid 70,000 EU and none of them finished there contracts or received the hours promised, the luckier ones being the first ones in whom got around 900 hours when this figure should have seen them finish with around 1,500 mark. Others were not so lucky and only got about 50 hours Skies did not bother to refund or arrange alternatives for these poor folk.
Skies now plan to Lease a few aircraft, based on there current management they will not succeed unless major change comes in terms of management.
They are legitimate and do have acess to line training, however management are completely unqualified, owner is AM an old rejected Airbus pilot, he runs the company with a Filipino and an Iranian HR woman who has no clue about the industry.
Since Skies started in 2012 they have had around 30 Students all of which are very unhappy, massive delays, broken promises etc partner airlines have gone bust a good example is Eastern Sky Jets, where 10 pilots all paid 70,000 EU and none of them finished there contracts or received the hours promised, the luckier ones being the first ones in whom got around 900 hours when this figure should have seen them finish with around 1,500 mark. Others were not so lucky and only got about 50 hours Skies did not bother to refund or arrange alternatives for these poor folk.
Skies now plan to Lease a few aircraft, based on there current management they will not succeed unless major change comes in terms of management.
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Skies Aviation = Cheaters
My story with Skies 
I graduated with 180hrs total flying time from(...)Aviation Academy. I went to Skies Aviation to do the B737NG program TypeRating+500hrs Line Training+guarantee 1 year job contract with ESJ. (cost 70000EU)
They asked me first to have at least 250hrs of Actual FT.
(i did Hour building course costed me 10000EU so i would have 250 total)
After the completion of Type rating SKIES Cheaters told me we are sorry ESJ company has grounded, and your contract with us is cancelled.
M Said : GO .... Ur Self No Refund,,,,,
Skies Aviation Trust me You Cheated With The Wrong Person
I graduated with 180hrs total flying time from(...)Aviation Academy. I went to Skies Aviation to do the B737NG program TypeRating+500hrs Line Training+guarantee 1 year job contract with ESJ. (cost 70000EU)
They asked me first to have at least 250hrs of Actual FT.
(i did Hour building course costed me 10000EU so i would have 250 total)
After the completion of Type rating SKIES Cheaters told me we are sorry ESJ company has grounded, and your contract with us is cancelled.
M Said : GO .... Ur Self No Refund,,,,,
Skies Aviation Trust me You Cheated With The Wrong Person
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No offence but why anyone would spend potentially close to (if not more than) €100,000 on "fATPL" course, then another €10,000 on hour building to meet the requirements to then pay another €70,000 + living/travel has to be completely bonkers.
Everyone on here knows that the career path is a risky one, but to throw THAT much money into it.... if I had €200k available to me which seemingly noone cared about the use of, I would have spent manys a year traveling and having fun, or done a PPL and bought my own airplane and then spent a fair amount of time in that.
Everyone on here knows that the career path is a risky one, but to throw THAT much money into it.... if I had €200k available to me which seemingly noone cared about the use of, I would have spent manys a year traveling and having fun, or done a PPL and bought my own airplane and then spent a fair amount of time in that.
N4790P
Without getting into the rights and wrongs of pay to fly schemes, I am constantly amazed at just how gullible some aspiring pilots do seem to be.
Unless an ATO operates solely for its own benefit, such as a carrier training and checking its own crews under local NAA regulations, any other ATO providing services to 3rd parties should at least have an internationally recognized (EASA, FAA or the like) accreditation of its training equipment and training programs (and to have these, operate under what is now a demanding CMS/QMS).
These are published on line and are easy enough to check. This would provide some level of confidence that there is a level of regulatory oversight and financial respectability.
Without making these simple checks, you are fair game.
Unless an ATO operates solely for its own benefit, such as a carrier training and checking its own crews under local NAA regulations, any other ATO providing services to 3rd parties should at least have an internationally recognized (EASA, FAA or the like) accreditation of its training equipment and training programs (and to have these, operate under what is now a demanding CMS/QMS).
These are published on line and are easy enough to check. This would provide some level of confidence that there is a level of regulatory oversight and financial respectability.
Without making these simple checks, you are fair game.
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Good grief! Apart from the cost of the integrated course, and 70k on a pay to work scheme/scam the fact that someone dropped 10k on 70hrs (€143/hr) of light aircraft rental is mind boggling. A tiny bit of effort and common sense and you could do it for half that, or better. I could go and fly an SEP aeroplane for £42/hr this afternoon.
Without wanting to be too mean or point fingers at any individuals (when they are representative of a great number of similar people), someone who has made such questionable decisions and simple sees 'throwing money at the problem' as the answer to career progress, peobably isn't cut out for this job. If such people bankrupt themselves and then withdraw from the competition, it's probably no bad thing for everyone else. How long would it take you to earn back your 180k when you are prepared to work for nothing, or less than nothing?
No wonder the career is
. The tank is full of sharks and willing bait.
Without wanting to be too mean or point fingers at any individuals (when they are representative of a great number of similar people), someone who has made such questionable decisions and simple sees 'throwing money at the problem' as the answer to career progress, peobably isn't cut out for this job. If such people bankrupt themselves and then withdraw from the competition, it's probably no bad thing for everyone else. How long would it take you to earn back your 180k when you are prepared to work for nothing, or less than nothing?
No wonder the career is
. The tank is full of sharks and willing bait.
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ONLY PASSENGERS SHOULD PAY TO FLY.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fgOQYMDDz4k#t=13
Shocking vid about P2F.
Respectable airlines should DISQUALIFY participants of P2F programs. Finally some airlines do so.
Shocking vid about P2F.
Respectable airlines should DISQUALIFY participants of P2F programs. Finally some airlines do so.
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AviatorAircraft
You should have known this was coming! There was a thread dedicated here for skies aviation and all of 'em adviced to avoid it.Nobody here is going to help you and you have chosen the P2f route so deal with the consequences
There was a thread dedicated here for skies aviation and all of 'em adviced to avoid it.Nobody here is going to help you and you have chosen the P2f route so deal with the consequences
Last edited by pilot4eva; 6th Feb 2015 at 05:30.
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Sorry AviatiorAircraft and Ahmed Kilo or whatever is your nickname but.....hahahahaha and then 
and finally . A quite number of feelings to handle all at once, I'm surprised I can do it. Now, you're probably asking yourself why he is being so disrespectful and hurting a such gentle person as me, a person who is only looking for some help. Let me list some fair points to make it clear:
1- Accepting those kind of contracts means you're basically throwing **** over what it used to be a nice and skilled profession whilst not giving a **** about other pilots condition at all. Pilots who work to feed their family mouths and have reached that position after commitment and sacrifice. Pilots who are constantly risking to lose their job and feeling stressed and tired for that, just because there is a queue of idiots willing to sell themselves for free, or worst, willing to pay the employer to work for free. They are even more idiot!! You thought you were smarter than your colleagues and paying was a clever move to skip the queue so you could finally be able to play with your shiny jet toy. How wrong it was! Sorry guys you are simple getting what you deserve. I know, sometimes life is such a bitch, but what it goes around comes around. You should have expected that.
2- Pilots must have the ability to gather as much as possible information and process them in order to make the right final decision. It is what they call situation awareness and as far as I can see, you lack of it. Why? Let me kindly explain. PPrune is full of bad stories regarding other morons who have been defrauded by this particular company. You could have done some research or simple google the company name and you could have easily figured out which trouble you were getting into. This is the normal procedure a clever person goes through before signing a contract that involves high investment risk and high amount of money. As I can see you guys lack of smartness too. Unfortunately this lead to an unique and sad conclusion: you guys don't have the required qualities to fly passenger aircraft. In case you manage to get a job, please, I'm begging you, let me know where you are working, so me and all my beloved ones can highly avoid it. I like adrenaline but I'm not so fool to risk my life.
3- Asking help and advice from people who are experiencing more and more disgusting work and life conditions partly due to idiots like you accepting p2f, it's an indication of either high courage or high stupidity. I bet over the second.
Despite all that, I hope you'll get your money back and if it happens, highly unlikely, you should spend it to train for other professions and fly just for leisure, but stay away from UK and Italy airspaces, is where I usually fly and I still want to feel safe when I do it.
Best Regards!
and finally . A quite number of feelings to handle all at once, I'm surprised I can do it. Now, you're probably asking yourself why he is being so disrespectful and hurting a such gentle person as me, a person who is only looking for some help. Let me list some fair points to make it clear:1- Accepting those kind of contracts means you're basically throwing **** over what it used to be a nice and skilled profession whilst not giving a **** about other pilots condition at all. Pilots who work to feed their family mouths and have reached that position after commitment and sacrifice. Pilots who are constantly risking to lose their job and feeling stressed and tired for that, just because there is a queue of idiots willing to sell themselves for free, or worst, willing to pay the employer to work for free. They are even more idiot!! You thought you were smarter than your colleagues and paying was a clever move to skip the queue so you could finally be able to play with your shiny jet toy. How wrong it was! Sorry guys you are simple getting what you deserve. I know, sometimes life is such a bitch, but what it goes around comes around. You should have expected that.
2- Pilots must have the ability to gather as much as possible information and process them in order to make the right final decision. It is what they call situation awareness and as far as I can see, you lack of it. Why? Let me kindly explain. PPrune is full of bad stories regarding other morons who have been defrauded by this particular company. You could have done some research or simple google the company name and you could have easily figured out which trouble you were getting into. This is the normal procedure a clever person goes through before signing a contract that involves high investment risk and high amount of money. As I can see you guys lack of smartness too
. Unfortunately this lead to an unique and sad conclusion: you guys don't have the required qualities to fly passenger aircraft. In case you manage to get a job, please, I'm begging you, let me know where you are working, so me and all my beloved ones can highly avoid it. I like adrenaline but I'm not so fool to risk my life.3- Asking help and advice from people who are experiencing more and more disgusting work and life conditions partly due to idiots like you accepting p2f, it's an indication of either high courage or high stupidity. I bet over the second.
Despite all that, I hope you'll get your money back and if it happens, highly unlikely, you should spend it to train for other professions and fly just for leisure, but stay away from UK and Italy airspaces, is where I usually fly and I still want to feel safe when I do it.
Best Regards!
Last edited by pakythepilot; 6th Feb 2015 at 22:11.
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Guys who accept offers which at the end are a total scam, should after accept the consequences also. In the past I also had a good friend who lost more than you have lost just by accepting something with closed eyes.
It is terrible to hear these kind of experiences and sorry you are not self-aware of anything whatsoever, you haven't studied the matter first and you don't respect other people.
Find the best lawyer you could ever find because it is not an easy case to solve.
Finally this is not the right place you came for help and I urge you will remain helpless on this forum.
Sorry !!!
It is terrible to hear these kind of experiences and sorry you are not self-aware of anything whatsoever, you haven't studied the matter first and you don't respect other people.
Find the best lawyer you could ever find because it is not an easy case to solve.
Finally this is not the right place you came for help and I urge you will remain helpless on this forum.
Sorry !!!
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Come on guys, this should be a professional forum with professional pilots...so
we understood clearly that p2F is a CANCER in our Profession as Pilot but these guys needs some help.
But, this does not detract YOUR NEGLIGENCE (AVIATORAIRCRAFT AND KIMO) accepting this rubbish
AviatorAircraft:
I think you shouldn't send them any email, but PICK UP THE PHONE, and give them a call and SPEAK CLEARLY and DECISE!!! tell THEM you want back your MONEY!!
Then, I hope and think, that CAE STOCKOLM don't want to be involved in such rubbish and put their name as Organisation down!
So give a call to CAE too, and understand clearly the situation and whats going on.
I don't think in EU is there any serious TRTO that will refuse to refund the money if some problem arise.
CAE is something, SKIES is something else!
Best of Luck
we understood clearly that p2F is a CANCER in our Profession as Pilot but these guys needs some help.
But, this does not detract YOUR NEGLIGENCE (AVIATORAIRCRAFT AND KIMO
) accepting this rubbishAviatorAircraft:
I think you shouldn't send them any
email, but PICK UP THE PHONE, and give them a call and SPEAK CLEARLY and DECISE!!! tell THEM you want back your MONEY!!Then, I hope and think, that CAE STOCKOLM don't want to be involved in such rubbish and put their name as Organisation down!
So give a call to CAE too, and understand clearly the situation and whats going on.
I don't think in EU is there any serious TRTO that will refuse to refund the money if some problem arise.
CAE is something, SKIES is something else!
Best of Luck
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I guess a call to the cae office will be completely useless.
agree with you, but still Skies put CAE as the provider of the TR.So I think should be the best option to clarify with them first, and let them know what SKIES is doing giving bad reputation to the TRTO...so maybe even them for the future will take distance from SKIES!
To all the p2f simpatize guys...maybe I'm sarcastic, but you could find a good loooking used 737 with something like 1M....so if You guys put all the money together, 100K each one or even less, as you are a lot out there (instead of paying the LT) you could buy one, find a TRE, TRI, Cheif PiloT and so on and build your own Company after obtaining an AOC!!
...Doing your own Buissness and be pilot in the same time!Difficult
maybe...but not Impossible!
Last edited by J74; 6th Feb 2015 at 22:42.
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By the way AviatorAircraft, would it be possible to get a hold on your "contracts", or whatever piece of documents they provided you (anonymised of course)?
I'm collecting as much as possible for the anti-p2f campaign:
https://secure.avaaz.org/en/petition/p2f_must_stop/
Don't hesitate to contact me via mp...
I'm collecting as much as possible for the anti-p2f campaign:
https://secure.avaaz.org/en/petition/p2f_must_stop/
Don't hesitate to contact me via mp...
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Hello everyone,
just to let you know that i did my type with skies with absolutely no problem
everything went smooth... also i am completing my line training with them in Europe and am almost 400 hrs, what i see as your experience with them is surprising me... anyways losers always blame others
just to let you know that i did my type with skies with absolutely no problem
everything went smooth... also i am completing my line training with them in Europe and am almost 400 hrs, what i see as your experience with them is surprising me... anyways losers always blame others
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TR
When you do some analysis of the figures (I won't bore you with them, unless you want me to) for airlines such as EasyJet, RyanAir and Flybe, you're paying for your TR and indirectly for line training as well.
They just don't call it P2F of course.
I guess whatever you call it, the level of training is the most important thing.
Again, having spent some time looking into it, there are some awful P2F schemes and some that are probably better than Ryan's line training programme.
Horses for courses.
They just don't call it P2F of course.
I guess whatever you call it, the level of training is the most important thing.
Again, having spent some time looking into it, there are some awful P2F schemes and some that are probably better than Ryan's line training programme.
Horses for courses.