Training in Central Scotland

[callum62]

Hi All,

Ive recently returned to my homeland after 12 years away on the beautiful island on New Zealand

I was looking into starting my PPL over there, but when we decided to sell and and move here, that was all put on the back burner (I only done 1 trial flight in a Robin 2120 out of North Shore)

Id basically love to be a commercial pilot, but im all too aware of costs involved in making that possible

I have a kid, and soon to be mortgage etc (once we get our feet on the ground)...only been back a month, although ive started working already.

Taking all this into account, I feel just doing it for fun to start with is the way to go....and I am looking at the NPPL in a 3 axis fixed wing microlight

Mostly due to the fact its cheaper, and I understand can be upgraded fairly easy in the future to standard PPL....then only CPL etc if that materialises?

Now, where to train? I am based in Livingston, West Lothian.

I understand the Edinburgh Flying club has just recently closed its doors?

1 of the options im looking at are:

based out of Perth
Fixed Wing flight training Scotland - Small Plane Flights

Or would you recommend just doing the EASA PPL?

Also based out of Perth

Perth

I wont be starting properly for a while yet (until partner finds job etc) but do plan to take a few fun flight over next few months

Just looking for any advice for anyone around the central belt of Scotland really...

Thanks

Cal

[xrayalpha]

Hi Callum,

Welcome to Bonnie Scotland's airspace!

And you have chosen a great time to start learning with the clocks having just changed and it will soon be daylight until 9 or 10pm.

Your choices for 3-axis microlights are Perth, Balado in Fife microflight academy microlight flying lesson Gift glasgow scotland and us Sportflight Scotland - flying lessons, trial flights and gift vouchers in a three-axis microlight aircraft here at Strathaven Airfield

To be frank, we are probably the nearest, but also the most expensive in terms of our "charge per hour".

We are certainly a much less formal airfield that Perth - which may be a disadvantage if you want to go commercial and would rather start right out with more complex stuff.

Of course, it could also be an advantage, in that you will later have a better understanding of how the other half fly!

Learning is a big commitment, you might even want to check each option out with a trial flight - ie put us on trial! - and that way also see how far by road each option is.

[Airbornestu]

There's some really good gliding in Scotland and iirc you can count up to 30 hrs towards a CPL, so it might be worth considering if you're looking for a cheaper way to start flying.

[callum62]

Thanks xray -as I cant really commit to any bulk lot of training for another few months - a few trial flights at a couple of different airfields sounds like a great idea

I think, according to google maps, the driving from my home to Strathaven or Perth is much of a muchness - about 1 hour

Im not sure myself yet what my preference would be regarding formal against informal....my only flying experience was at a small, yet busy uncontrolled airfield in Northern Auckland - beautiful it was however!

I guess the best way to find out is to sample both

I never thought id go and learn in a microlight, but they seem to have came on a long way from what comes to mind when I think 'microlight.'

Any general thoughts of variations of aircraft etc?

Thanks for the response too,

Cheers
Cal

[ecosse]

Definitely get into both Strathaven and Perth this will give you a good idea of the difference between GA and the microlight world!

I done my training at Strathaven gaining my NPPL(M) and have an A/C there. Feel free to contact me if you fancy a look around and a chat!

Gliding is on my list of things to try this year!!

KP

[callum62]

Airnorne - an interesting suggestion.

Gliding hadnt even crossed my mind, and I wouldn't think its something it want to do all the time...altho, I have a feeling it could be something that once you do, it becomes addictive!

Will also check this out and possibly trial flight this too

[abgd]

When I looked into it, hourly costs on a shiny new c42 weren't much less than on an old group-A aircraft like a C152 or PA38. You can do a NPPL on group-A aircraft with a group-A instructor then upgrade your license, but microlight hours can't be made to count towards a PPL or CPL in the same way. In your position I'd do an NPPL on group A aircraft and retain the flexibility to add ratings/upgrade my license at a later date.

e.g. an hour on a PA38 at inverness is 158, but an hour on a c42 is 150. Admittedly it's 110 for the microlight at Glasgow...

[xrayalpha]

abgb: Hourly costs for a microlight - in a similar location - will save a considerable sum. Even though petrol is 1.04 a litre, it still costs quite a bit of time and effort to get to Inverness. Too much for a quick lesson after work!

In summary, central Scotland light aircraft are £176+ per hour, central Scotland three-axis microlights are £125+. And the closer you are to Glasgow and Edinburgh, the dearer both of them are!

To take ACS: 2-seat £182.50 and 4-seat £200.50 (member rates, from ACS website). PPL
A 12 month membership is £99

But then Leading Edge at Cumbernauld seems to offer bulk discounts for blocks of 10 giving £176.60 in a 2-seat and £192.70 in a 4-seat.
Training (blocks)

And you have landing fees to pay.

So that seems to cover Glasgow, Cumbernauld and Perth.

For Tayside, at Glenrothes and Dundee, but website only seems to give Dundee for trial flights and training:it is £176 for the warrior in a pack of five. Plus landing fees and membership? Site is not clear.
https://taysideaviation.com/product/...piper-warrior/

Edinburgh, as we know is sadly gone.

At Balado, the price for a 60min trial flight is £125 - can't see the lesson price - so a lot cheaper than GA.

And Alba Airpsorts at Perth charge £125 an hour for lessons in the Eurostar. Don't know about club membership fees or landing fees for either.

callum62:

"Thoughts on variations of aircraft"

Not sure what you mean. In Strathaven, we teach on the C42, a high wing. In Perth they teach on the Eurostar, a low wing. At Blalado Keith teaches on a Thruster, an older style high wing.

I prefer the C42 and Eurostar because they are light aircraft that have been squeezed into the microlight category. Like their looks! We prefer the C42 over the Eurostar because we operate from a grass field and it is easier to get into a high wing aircraft, especially for people with mobility problems. I also think bubble canopies can get like a greenhouse at times. But the Eurostar has great visibility, ideal for busy circuits like Perth.

As regards microlights versus light aircraft. If you want to fly a 737, then they are both completely different! You said you wanted a NPPL (M) first, because CPL is only a dream.

If CPL by 2018 - or whatever - was the target, then I would say go straight to a EASA PPL, get a Class One medical from Gatwick and go on the Guild of Air Pilots aptitude tests day:

https://www.airpilots.org/career-mat...ptitude-tests/

[glencoeian]

Hi Callum
I managed to get my LAPL (which might be worth considering rather than NPPL) last year. You could fly out of Cumbernauld or Perth, I flew out of Oban on west coast. It took three years, be prepared for weather to cancel many of your flights and budget for £9,000 so a frustrating expensive excercise lies ahead. It is amazing though, perhaps the microlight is the best way to go to start with.

[Maoraigh1]

Consider doing LAPL in a more intensive way than over 3 years. I did my PPL in minimum hours in 19 days, at what was then the cheapest school in the UK. I had previous gliding experience.

[The Ancient Geek]

Indeed, it is best to do a continuous course if possible because the skills you are learning degrade rapidly betwen lessons. This will also be cheaper because you will not be wasting hours refreshing the previous lesson. Waaaay back in the 70s when I did my PPL I had difficulty with landings but a solid day in the circuit had this sorted. Another half day a week later had me greasing it on the numbers every time.

[callum62]

Thanks guys - when I start properly training, my aim (at least initially) will probably be 2 lessons a month

This is ofcourse dependant on the type of work my partner gets too - but 2 a month is a reasonable aim to start with

possibly, 1 a week for 1st 8 weeks, then 1 a fortnight thereafter

Im assuming the biggest learning curve in terms of general control come near the beginning of training?

Will definitely check out Perth and Strathaven - will also book a trial flight at the Scottish gliding club

Ta

Cal

[Maoraigh1]

2 a month is few. You'd be cheaper saving, then going for the licence. You'll lose a lot of muscle skill in 2 weeks with about 50 minutes actually in the air.

[Forfoxake]

Good advice here imho, particularly the last post.

If you book two lessons per month, you will be lucky to average one per month and have forgotten most of what you learned the last time.
When I learned in central Scotland, I booked two lessons almost every weekend and still took 55 hours and 18 months to get my PPL(A). Admittedly, I did switch from high wing at one airfield to low wing at another and back again but the main problem was consistently getting an instructor and plane available when the weather was suitable for the stage I was at.


I also found that I got rusty very quickly when learning and well beyond that as an inexperienced PPL (now with almost 2500 hours in single-engined aircraft and fixed-wing microlights, I barely notice this).

Having said that, I am not in favour of intensive courses for initial training particularly if done abroad. It is invaluable to learn so much for free about flying locally during the inevitable time hanging about the airfield!


But if you can only afford a few lessons a month, do it anyway. Enjoy the process and the licence will come eventually as long as you stick at it.

[Loggerheads]

Im assuming the biggest learning curve in terms of general control come near the beginning of training?

It's also when the weather is less critical, therefore your chance to fly is greater. As your lessons progress the weather becomes a great consideration.

[callum_62]

Thanks guys - i'll be getting my 1st trial flight for either Perth or Strathaven bought this week

[ecosse]

great news callum!

keep us posted on how you get on flying with Jim in the eurostar or Graham in the C42...

either way you will have some fun!!

[piperboy84]

A bit advice regarding Perth. If you fly with Jim in the Eurostar on one of the days Eileen is serving hot pies in the clubhouse, it's a good idea to try and get in the food line before Jim to avoid disappointment.

Evidence attached

https://onedrive.live.com/redir?resi...nt=photo%2cjpg

[callum_62]

haha, will do Piperboy!

Ive just bought an hour trial flight for Alba Airsports today

Still plan to do one in Strathaven and probably a glider flight too @ Portmoak

Looking forward to it all

[NorthernChappie]

A bit advice regarding Perth. If you fly with Jim in the Eurostar on one of the days Eileen is serving hot pies in the clubhouse, it's a good idea to try and get in the food line before Jim to avoid disappointment.

Was that the origination of W & B checks?