Warrior Engine Refurb rules

[jayemm]

Our engine will soon be close to the 12 years limit but well under the 2,000 hours. Can someone clarify the regs or rules on this?

I believe it used to be a case of whichever limit arrives the soonest but I heard a rumour that the years limit was relaxed.

Thanks

[fastjet45]

If its for private use then keep it running under the GR24, which basically means subject to the health of the engine being found satisfactory by an engineer it will be granted a 12 month or 100 hour extension which ever comes first, this can also be used after TBO.

[sharpend]

Originally Posted by jayemm

Our engine will soon be close to the 12 years limit but well under the 2,000 hours. Can someone clarify the regs or rules on this?

I believe it used to be a case of whichever limit arrives the soonest but I heard a rumour that the years limit was relaxed.

Thanks

It all comes down to how much loot you want to spend. Nicholson Maclaren advised me that my Bulldog Lycoming (then running on condition as it was 12.5 years from last overhaul) was not suitable for overhaul. I went for a factory rebuild; not much more expensive but future proof, more modern, more economical and smoother. But you can run 'on condition' for years. Just remember, no lay-bys in the sky with an RAC van waiting to tow you home.

[Big Pistons Forever]

My 1974 Grumman AA1B still has the original engine (lycoming O 235 C1C) with 2230 hrs. In 2006 we decided to address the generally low compressions with 4 new cylinders. With the cylinders off we had a good look at the cam shaft lobes and lifters and found them in excellent condition. I see no reason we will not get at least another 10 years and 500-600 hrs out of this engine

Regular use and good maintenance is what will determine how long your engine will last, not an arbitrary calendar interval imposed by the manufacturer to get you to buy one of his overhauled/reman/new engines.

[smarthawke]

In the UK, engine life rules can be found in CAA CAP747 GR No 24 (it isn't an Airworthiness Directive and isn't issued by EASA):

http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/33/CAP747_Issue3_Nov2014.pdf

Lycoming recommend that the O-320-D3G used in the Warrior is overhauled at 2000 hours or 12 years whichever occurs first (Time Before Overhaul, TBO).

In the UK, pre-EASA, the calendar life wasn't enforced but the advent of EASA brought the UK into line with the rest of Europe.

If the aircraft is used for flying training or private hire etc, it can continue to be run 'on extension' which is to 20% past TBO - so that is an additional 400 hours or 2.4 years (2400hrs and/or 14.4 years).

At that point the engine must be overhauled unless it is used for private use only, the engine is then termed 'on condition'.

GR 24 rules include an annual or 100 hour check of cylinder compressions, monitoring or oil consumption.

[Big Pistons Forever]

Originally Posted by smarthawke

If the aircraft is used for flying training or private hire etc, it can continue to be run 'on extension' which is to 20% past TBO - so that is an additional 400 hours or 2.4 years (2400hrs and/or 14.4 years).

.

At the Canadian flying school where I occasionally help out, Transport Canada has approved a TBO extension to 3500 hrs for the C 172. To date every engine has made it. Engines don't fail just because they are old and there is no reason not to keep running the engine until it tells you it is unhappy.

Of the 3 engines I know of that suffered catastrophic failures, 2 were less than 20 hours from overhaul. Both failures occurred because of assembly errors. The other one was operated by someone who thought all engine maintenance was optional

[Pilot DAR]

FWIW, I bought my O-200 with 1700 hours. I went on the newly created "On condition" program, and ultimately ran it to 3550 hours (with 4 overhauled cylinders along the way). I took it apart because of ferrous metal in the filter. It turned out to be only shavings from the alternator drive coupling cover - the engine was fine inside, it would have gone a lot longer. A well cared for engine, with regular oil changes, will go for a very long time, and as BPF says, they very rarely just stop, they nearly always give you lots of warning - if you're doing the maintenance, and paying attention to what you're seeing...

[ChickenHouse]

This is second time I read about this (regular - on extension - on condition) path and am still wondering why they put that 'on extension' oddity in the middle? From others I hear only regular - on condition.

[smarthawke]

The 'extension' bit is a UK thing and it works for us - a bit of leniency over what some other countries suffer.

As I said earlier, it enables non-AOC operators (ie training and private hire organisations) a 20% extension on TBO before they have to have an engine overhauled.