Plane hire checkflight
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: EGCC
Age: 28
Posts: 44
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Plane hire checkflight
Hi everyone.
So after sorting out my checklist following my recent thread on here, now I'm in need of some information and advice regarding the "checkflight" with the FI before hiring the plane. How do these work in general? I know it's for the FI to see if they're willing to let me fly their plane based on how I perform. But what to expect from that 45-60 min flight?
So after sorting out my checklist following my recent thread on here, now I'm in need of some information and advice regarding the "checkflight" with the FI before hiring the plane. How do these work in general? I know it's for the FI to see if they're willing to let me fly their plane based on how I perform. But what to expect from that 45-60 min flight?
A type check will have to elements. The first is a checkout on the area you will be flying out of if you have never been there before and the second will be on the aircraft
The magnitude of the checkout is totally at the discretion of the school. That been said most checkouts will consist of Steep turns/Slow flight/Stalls/PFL in the practice area and 3 circuits.
Personally in the C 150 checkouts I always include a full flap (40 deg) approach with a low altitude go around and then simulate the flaps failing to retract. The aircraft will barely climb with full flaps and needs careful handling. There have been several accidents where a flap failure to retract has resulted in an accident.
The magnitude of the checkout is totally at the discretion of the school. That been said most checkouts will consist of Steep turns/Slow flight/Stalls/PFL in the practice area and 3 circuits.
Personally in the C 150 checkouts I always include a full flap (40 deg) approach with a low altitude go around and then simulate the flaps failing to retract. The aircraft will barely climb with full flaps and needs careful handling. There have been several accidents where a flap failure to retract has resulted in an accident.
Moderator
I went to rent a Cessna 207 once, 'never flown one before. He told me we'd be an hour for the checkride. He asked for a circuit first, so I flew the circuit. He asked for a second circuit, which I flew. As I coasted to a stop on the runway, he said "you're hired, take me in" and that was that.
On the other extreme, I was being checked out in a Piper Arrow 4, 'never flown one before. After 45 minutes, and a couple of circuits I was becoming quite sure that the guy checking me out had less experience than I (I had 45 minutes by then!). We talked a bit about our differing opinions as to how the plane was to be flown - I was doing what the POH said to do (I don't think he'd read it). So I did what the POH said, and told him if he did not like it, he did not have to sign me off. With that, I returned to our origin airport. I guess that during that 15 minute flight he decided I was okay, 'cause I was signed off.
The length and detail of your checkride may be quite affected by the skill and experience of the person checking you out.
On the other extreme, I was being checked out in a Piper Arrow 4, 'never flown one before. After 45 minutes, and a couple of circuits I was becoming quite sure that the guy checking me out had less experience than I (I had 45 minutes by then!). We talked a bit about our differing opinions as to how the plane was to be flown - I was doing what the POH said to do (I don't think he'd read it). So I did what the POH said, and told him if he did not like it, he did not have to sign me off. With that, I returned to our origin airport. I guess that during that 15 minute flight he decided I was okay, 'cause I was signed off.
The length and detail of your checkride may be quite affected by the skill and experience of the person checking you out.
I am guessing the OP is a new PPL so it is reasonable to assume it would be longer than one for an experienced current pilot.
That been said it should not exceed a hour in the air. After that you are either being milked or there are fundamental skill deficits which are outside the scope of a "checkout" and need to be fixed with a properly briefed instructional flight
Checkouts for experienced pilots seem to come in at two extremes. Either the shortest possible flight to check the box for somebody who is clearly qualified or an absolute horror show as the person demonstrates the toxic effects of years of accumulated bad habits, complacency, and hubris.
That been said it should not exceed a hour in the air. After that you are either being milked or there are fundamental skill deficits which are outside the scope of a "checkout" and need to be fixed with a properly briefed instructional flight
Checkouts for experienced pilots seem to come in at two extremes. Either the shortest possible flight to check the box for somebody who is clearly qualified or an absolute horror show as the person demonstrates the toxic effects of years of accumulated bad habits, complacency, and hubris.
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Cambridge, England, EU
Posts: 3,443
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like
on
1 Post
I went to rent a Cessna 207 once, 'never flown one before.
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Unna, Germany
Posts: 412
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I've done a number of check flights and I think the Instructor / Club you are renting from what to be sure you are safe and competent with their property. One check flight was 3 circuits and a general brief of the area, another consisted of a PFL after taking off followed by a climb and a clean stall concluded with a briefing of the VRPs to allow the pilot to easily and quickly identify his location so no standardisation of check flights; I guess the instructor just wants to be sure you aren't a menace to yourself and their aircraft.........
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Melbourne
Age: 72
Posts: 774
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
So after sorting out my checklist following my recent thread ......
Well done. That thread is now six pages and 108 posts. This one looks like it could exceed that. Easier to phone the school where you want to hire the aircraft.
Well done. That thread is now six pages and 108 posts. This one looks like it could exceed that. Easier to phone the school where you want to hire the aircraft.
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Oop North, UK
Posts: 3,076
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
That been said it should not exceed a hour in the air.
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Perth, WA
Posts: 326
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I'd support the observations that it depends on the instructor or check pilot, the aircraft, your experience level, the magnitude of the type transition and the complexity of the airspace in which you're flying. The conditions on the day might also be relevant. For example, a nice Canadian once lent me his Decathlon and, given the howling gale, it was entirely reasonable of him to want to see a few really good cross-wind three-point and wheel landings.
Having rented aircraft all over the world, I've occasionally found that I've had to request a bit of extra time, just to get to a comfortable understanding of the local area. But the actual aircraft checkout invariably goes quickly and smoothly if your're current in your flying, respectful and concentrate on displaying good airmanship.
By the way, some experienced instructors say they have the assessment 60% complete by the time you've taxyed to the holding point. Good airmanship, and fluent and thoughtful checks help a lot. Plenty of good discussion on that in your other thread! Do yourself a favour and stand out from the crowd: learn and understand the checks for the aircraft you're renting, even if you verify with a written list provided.
Having rented aircraft all over the world, I've occasionally found that I've had to request a bit of extra time, just to get to a comfortable understanding of the local area. But the actual aircraft checkout invariably goes quickly and smoothly if your're current in your flying, respectful and concentrate on displaying good airmanship.
By the way, some experienced instructors say they have the assessment 60% complete by the time you've taxyed to the holding point. Good airmanship, and fluent and thoughtful checks help a lot. Plenty of good discussion on that in your other thread! Do yourself a favour and stand out from the crowd: learn and understand the checks for the aircraft you're renting, even if you verify with a written list provided.
The OP specifically stated that he was looking to get checked out in a C 150 so I stand by my contention that one hour of flight time should be sufficient to clear him to go on his own.
If more than an hour is spent on this then something is wrong. Either the instructor is milking the process or there is some fundamental skills lacking on the part of the person being checked out. I have personally seen a case where 10 hours of extra dual was required before we would rent the flying school C 172 to an individual. This person had owned and flown their own Pa 28 for almost 20 years.
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: Oop North, UK
Posts: 3,076
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The OP specifically stated that he was looking to get checked out in a C 150
I would agree that MOST pilots should be able to check out in an hour on something simple like a C150, as you say though,most instructors will have had to check out pilots who's basic competence is such that they would not sign them out even on an aircraft they are current on, in which case they might still need more than an hour!
I do checkouts for a few syndicates, normally of new or refreshing syndicate members - also once in a blue moon for a school.
When I do I always take care to ask the "owner" (school CFI or syndicate chairman usually) what standard of flying they want out of the pilot.
The detail varies, but generally speaking, the answer boils down to:-
(1) Understands and shouldn't break the aeroplane
(2) Can handle likely emergencies
(3) Won't p**** off the local ATC or other pilots sharing the airfield.
Nobody ever really cares about perfection of RT, altitude holding in steep turns, navigational skill, or whether you could pass a PPL skill test again tomorrow. The main issues of a checkride are really all about safety.
So, generally expect a briefing on the aeroplane and any syndicate and local rules (read the manual first, find your way around a suitable checklist, and familiarise yourself with the airfield and local airspace to save everybody time and grief), circuits (if you can't land it well, all else is irrelevant), and probably a few stalls and PFLs.
If you're new to the area, also expect a "sector recce" (old RAF term) where you get shown the local nav landmarks and avoids.
Anything else is "nice to have" usually, but it is of course perfectly legitimate for any aircraft owner to demand a high standard of flying - but far more so a high standard of airmanship.
Depending upon the pilot, I've seen this take anything from half an hour to a dozen hours.
When I do I always take care to ask the "owner" (school CFI or syndicate chairman usually) what standard of flying they want out of the pilot.
The detail varies, but generally speaking, the answer boils down to:-
(1) Understands and shouldn't break the aeroplane
(2) Can handle likely emergencies
(3) Won't p**** off the local ATC or other pilots sharing the airfield.
Nobody ever really cares about perfection of RT, altitude holding in steep turns, navigational skill, or whether you could pass a PPL skill test again tomorrow. The main issues of a checkride are really all about safety.
So, generally expect a briefing on the aeroplane and any syndicate and local rules (read the manual first, find your way around a suitable checklist, and familiarise yourself with the airfield and local airspace to save everybody time and grief), circuits (if you can't land it well, all else is irrelevant), and probably a few stalls and PFLs.
If you're new to the area, also expect a "sector recce" (old RAF term) where you get shown the local nav landmarks and avoids.
Anything else is "nice to have" usually, but it is of course perfectly legitimate for any aircraft owner to demand a high standard of flying - but far more so a high standard of airmanship.
Depending upon the pilot, I've seen this take anything from half an hour to a dozen hours.
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Munich, Germany
Posts: 270
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Rental Checkout flight is a situation that should be relatively under control if the pilot understands the risk factors and is confident of his/her skills and experience.
In practical terms though, you should be prepared upfront for such an engagement that encompasses both a ground and airborne component. Do your homework accordingly because everything can be covered.
If you're experienced flying C150 and want to rent Skyhawk 172SP with G1000, I would say that you would have to go through a transition training. A checkout would not suffice in this case.
Bottom line is, be clear of your intentions and understand the aircraft performance features, airspace requirements and regulatory compliance issues.
Be absolutely clear that you are proficient in operating the rental aircraft and you should be through with the checkout within an hour time frame.
In practical terms though, you should be prepared upfront for such an engagement that encompasses both a ground and airborne component. Do your homework accordingly because everything can be covered.
If you're experienced flying C150 and want to rent Skyhawk 172SP with G1000, I would say that you would have to go through a transition training. A checkout would not suffice in this case.
Bottom line is, be clear of your intentions and understand the aircraft performance features, airspace requirements and regulatory compliance issues.
Be absolutely clear that you are proficient in operating the rental aircraft and you should be through with the checkout within an hour time frame.
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: The World
Posts: 1,271
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Assume on such checkride to show the general ability to operate the plane. Most places do the checkout for safety reasons, to protect their investment and sometime as required from the insurance companies (last time I rented in Cambridge a checkride was done along the document provided from the insurance company - looked almost like a biannual FI checklist).
