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Old 18th Aug 2014, 15:01
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Longer Ron

Enjoyed the Derek Piggott story - felt that I was in the cockpit with them !!

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Old 19th Aug 2014, 03:58
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I never flew with DP but he seemed to be a genuinely nice guy - saw him in action with students at Splasham a couple of times and was very impressed (I was never based there but visited many times over the years ).
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Old 19th Aug 2014, 06:25
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Terrific story, Ron. Thanks for posting the link to the book. I must try to get hold of a copy
A few second hand copies available via a well known South American themed internet shop! Got one coming in the post...

I will try and get in the loft and see if I can find that Condor article, I'm sure I still have it.
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Old 19th Aug 2014, 07:59
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LR

He signed me a copy of his book 'Delta Papa' - which is a terrific read.

I do think he's a nice bloke - but very driven, an unusual combination.

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Old 22nd Aug 2014, 21:11
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Tibenham

This is moreof a tug pilot story.

I did aseason flying the Condors at Tibenham. ( treadigraph. A FEW decades ago, thanksfor reminding me, I don’t feel that old).

On the sideof the short runway there was a pile of pig s**t, many yards long and several feet thick that had been there for a fewyears and looked like a mound of earth with the occasional bit of grass andweeds growing out of it. (I think it can be seen on the left in the 2ndphoto posted by Longer ron).

At the start of the next season a new full timetug pilot was appointed. This tug pilot taxied the condor up to park next to thedung heap and missed judged his turn. He shut down and got out to push thecondor back. To do this he walked up onto the hard crust of the heap to givethe condor a push. As he pushed the crust gave way and he was up to his waistin s**t in more ways than one.

A week or solater he dinged a condor and was made surplus to requirements. As my contractin the world of earning money had finished I went back for the rest of theseason for a bit more fun.
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Old 25th Aug 2014, 21:24
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Standing on the ground some 25 years ago I watched the last British owned Caproni A21 stoof its way into an asparagus field. What was more interesting was that I took off in it from Bideford-on-Avon with my syndicate partner about an hour before. It was a superb day for thermals. Big fat ones that gave eight to ten knots without effort. The deal was that we were going to give some people a ride later on, so we were returning to the field at about 110 kts or so. We had just overtaken a C150 and approaching 1,500' or so we hit a powerful thermal. As we did so, the flap lever popped out of its detent and we entered a violent pitch oscillation. At the end of the first cycle, entering the second one the right hand wing fell (OK, broke) off, rapidly followed by the tailplane and elevator. Game over!

Prior to this event there were seven other identical incidents resulting in 14 fatalities. As a result the manufacturer issued an AD to change the all-moving elevator into a standard fixed stabliser/elevator configuration. Unfortunately, we never got the notice that was issued three years beforehand.

We rehearsed what we would do if the glider became unflyable before every flight. We'd tell the other guy, release the canopy and then undo our harnesses. We fully anticipated that the canopy would not separate - it didn't! And if you think about it, a canopy separation is most unlikely because the only attitude these things are ever tested in is a normal one. But believe me, when things go wrong, the only attitudes you will ever see vary from abnormal to underpant-packing scary. For me though, releasing my harness (a superb Autoflug system, now EASA'ed out of existence) resulted in me being thrown onto the forward part of the cockpit underneath the fixed windshield.

After beating my way through the windshield with my elbows I was flung out towards the ground. My friend reckoned he would not be seeing me again. Our briefing though was to curl up in look for the D-ring - and it worked (well I am here). I now have five to seven seconds of parachute time. David though still had a battle to come. My departure caused the flight path of the airborne wreckage to change from an inverted negative g rolling one into a rolling phugoid path. When he jumped when it was easy; only to be pick up by the bloody fuselage a second later. Even when his chute opened he still wasn't out of danger. The detached wing flew around him like a demented combine harvester. Finally, his descent path took him into some domestic three-phase overhead power wires. Mine was a gentle descent (courtesty Messrs. Irving) into a grass field inhabited by a lazy horse.

David missed the power wires by climbing up the risers which resulted in him landing heavily on his coccyx on a couple's freshly watered front lawn. Walking like he'd just had a good night out in a Heaven, he attempted to obtain a medicinal G'n'T - but the occupants were too busy resuming their matrimonial argument to hear his request.

From the ground I saw bits glider zoom, flutter and swirl around the place. The detached wing landed on a path full of walkers. The T-Tail arrived in a small back garden missing everything. The right hand aileron landed in a small back garden where some very nubile girls (their clothes were far too small!) were sunbathing. The rudder descended vertically into a small gap between a brand new Mercedes 500SEL and a wall all within one metre of where a lovely lady had been gardening moments earlier.

However, two people were taken to hospital. Over the past few years, the village "God Botherer" had been telling anyone who would listen, and those who wouldn't, that God would smite them from the face of the earth. Especially heinous were those who frequented the pub. So when the entire pub rushed out, pointing at the sky, this was the message he had been waiting for. He lsot he plot in the road outside his house. So some nice people with blue flashing lights on the roof of their vehicle took him away. The other person was one of those who had just left the pub. Until that point, he didn't know he was an epileptic. Unfortunately, he suffered his first attack as he ran though a crop of fern asparagus, the plant that is used for flower arranging.

The other thing to suffer was the horse. He was fine when I landed but apparently took great offence to the police helicopter which landed in his filed after circling around for a while. This resulted in his condition being "stabilised" by the vet. His report stated "Overall, in my opinion this horse will never become sound again". Which was not a surprise because the poor nag had been shot by then.

It was a different sort of day. I'm glad we didn't hit anyone with the wreckage. It was also a "no news day" so we were hounded by the media. It was interesting as well as pretty good fun avoiding them. I had no problem gliding immediately after (with or without a parachute) but I didn't want to drive a car for a week. And it was this event that made it clear that I would have to give up an overpaid job (I still only earn half of what I did then some 25 years later) and do something else. Which I how I come to be here!

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Old 31st Aug 2014, 19:58
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I will try and get in the loft and see if I can find that Condor article, I'm sure I still have it.
Please do - but hope you comply with all the up to date elfnsafety requirements for gettin up there

rgds LR
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Old 31st Aug 2014, 20:04
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To do this he walked up onto the hard crust of the heap to givethe condor a push. As he pushed the crust gave way and he was up to his waistin s**t in more ways than one.
Over vne - lovely little story - sorry late reply - been away out of interweb range ... I really enjoyed my flying at Tibenham,it was great to fly with Eric A - he was a refreshing change from my home club instructors who were a circuit bound lot.

rgds lr
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Old 31st Aug 2014, 20:05
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I'm on leave this week LR, so will brave the dust up there and have a firtle around. It'll be in one of two crates...

Our Safety Manager would have kittens if he saw my method of ascent and descent - oh wait, no, the dodgy five foot step ladder has been replaced by a decent extending jobbie. Not getting any younger...

Incidentally, with the current enforced absence of ATC gliding at Kenley, it seems a crying shame that Surrey Hills GC don't seem to be able to take advantage of some of the lovely weekends we've had.
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Old 31st Aug 2014, 20:44
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Indeed Sir - tis a waste of a lovely airfield - not visited for a while !
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Old 31st Aug 2014, 20:47
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Walked around the peri-track this afternoon. Far too quiet.
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Old 31st Aug 2014, 20:51
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PM - thanks for the Caproni story - I count myself fortunate that I never had to jump out of any a/c.
I bought my glider chute from a project engineer at GQ - he launched into telling me how good it was until he saw my eyes glaze over and said ''you glider pilots - not interested in parachutes !'' - too right I says - 'its an expensive cushion'

Mine was a lovely olive drab colour - none of that garish bright blue or red for me LOL - anyway I never had to use it but it was good insurance !

rgds LR
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Old 31st Aug 2014, 21:01
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Piltdown Mans post reminded me of this wee incident

The glider was operating from a gliding site at Dunstable, Bedfordshire, and was being used for a
one day training course. At the time of the accident the glider was undertaking the last intended
flight of the day for one of two students on that course. In accordance with the policy of the gliding
club, both the instructor and student were wearing parachutes and the instructor had briefed his
student on the use of his parachute and how to abandon the glider should this be necessary.
Thunderstorm activity had been forecast for the area and although a large area of bad weather could
be seen to the north of the airfield from which the glider was operating, it was advancing only very
slowly towards the local flying area. Heavy falls of rain and wet snow could be seen beneath the
advancing cloud line.
The glider had been towed to 2,200 feet agl and for approximately one hour had been soaring at
heights up to 4,000 feet in the area between Leighton Buzzard and Bletchley. For the last part of the flight, the glider returned towards the airfield and was flying along the front edge of this large area
of cloud, approximately 500 feet above its base, where the air was rising at 2 to 3 kt. The pilot
reported that he was in clear smooth air and close to the cloud. Shortly before the accident, other
gliders in the area had been returning to the airfield in view of the approaching bad weather. At a
local time of approximately 1709 hrs, after the glider had climbed back towards 3,000 feet, the
instructor also decided to return to the airfield ahead of the approaching weather and therefore
turned away from the cloud. A short time later when he estimated that his course had diverged from
the cloud line by some 30°, and they were approximately 2,500 feet agl (some 300 feet above the
cloudbase), at an estimated 800 yards from the cloud in clear air and flying at a speed of some 80
kt, the glider was struck by lightning and large sections of its airframe disintegrated.
From that moment, the instructor later stated that his memory was not particularly clear. He
remembered hearing a 'very loud bang' and then 'feeling very draughty'; he also believed that he
may have momentarily lost consciousness. On recovering, he felt dazed and remembered slowly
becoming aware that 'something was seriously amiss' and that this was 'a real emergency requiring
unpleasant and decisive action'. He was able to shout to his student in the front cockpit two or three
times to undo his straps and abandon the glider but, owing to some impairment of his hearing, the
student was unable to hear him clearly. The student had already decided to abandon the glider and,
after he had departed, the instructor followed but was surprised when he realised that he had not
had to jettison his cockpit canopy. It was estimated that both parachutes had successfully inflated
by 1,800 feet agl.
The lightning strike was only witnessed by a few people in the area, but many more saw its
immediate aftermath with large items of slowly falling debris, two inflated parachutes, the fuselage
descending vertically at high speed and a ball of smoke and fine debris next to the cloud where the
glider had been struck. All witnesses reported that the flash of lightning occurred simultaneously
with an extremely 'loud crack' and many of these, including one police officer in the centre of the
nearby town (Dunstable), expressed the view that it was probably the loudest sound they could
remember hearing. It was also recollected by many witnesses that this had been the first lightning
flash of a series of discharges which had then occurred in that area over a period of some 15
minutes.
Apart from the damage to the hearing of both occupants, 'sooting' to the upper part of the
instructor's jacket, parachute pack and the hair on the back of his head, neither suffered any major
injuries as a result of the lightning strike. The student pilot landed on the roof of a disused petrol
station adjacent to a busy road in the village of Northall, but escaped major injury. The instructor
descended into a nearby field and suffered a broken ankle upon landing. The rescue services were
quickly on the scene and both occupants were taken to hospital; the student pilot was allowed to
return home later that evening and the instructor was released four days later after surgery to his
ankle.
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Old 31st Aug 2014, 22:29
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I heard about that one as well. And to show you what a small world this is, the instructor mentioned was one of my pupils. In the latter years I remember that he regularly asked me questions about my bailing out incident.

PM
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Old 2nd Sep 2014, 20:37
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Longer ron, sorry, no luck so far finding Condor article in my loft, I'm away for a few days now but will try again next week. Mags are tattier than I recall; I'm fairly sure the copy in question featured the Condor tugging from a snowy airfield on the cover.
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Old 2nd Sep 2014, 21:53
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These days if I want to execute the takeoff and landing I am required to fly with an instructor. Easier to get in and out of the back seat of the K13, so the poor instructor is persuaded to sit in the front.

And lo and behold, a new experience awaited. Absolutely stunning day, this past Sunday, lots of pilots following cloud streets hither and yon. At last a K13 became available, so Mick and I jumped into it, and took a tow behind the Supermonk (or is it Supermunk?)

It was pretty bumpy climbing out over the ridge, I was hoping for the tug to find us a nice fat evening thermal over Tysoe, the vario was behaving strangely, so I asked Mick to switch on the audio vario. It began to warble a new song entirely. What peculiar air currents were causing these erratic tones? I thought I saw the tug rise up over Tysoe village, so pulled off at 1,500. And the varios carried on warbling and wambling, both of them. Obviously unreliable. Mick said it was probably due to water in the tubes. Had to rely on the altimeter to know if we were rising or sinking, the ASI seemed to be OK. We swanned around the village for 15 minutes or so, and then decided to do a gentle left hand circuit back to my favorite corner of the eight acre. I was assisted out of the back seat, and drove the buggy to pull the glider back to the launchpoint.

And it wasn't until walking back toward the glider to coil up the tow rope noticed the Brunswick tube was no longer in place. Whether or not it was in place before we departed we were unable to say....

We couldn't find it along our takeoff path; evidently the enthusiastic and not always necessary use of a rudder lock had caused it to wear and eventually detach altogether.

We got a rocket from the CFI who told us off for not walking round the aircraft before flying it. So I learned something new. Even if somebody else has just been flying the machine and it worked OK for them, it is still a good idea to have a walk round, the last guy might not have noticed bits dropping off...
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Old 8th Sep 2014, 22:30
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I am often surprised by how misunderstood gliding is to power pilots. During a recent competition it fell to me to deal with enquiries (the number had been thoughtfully provided in the NOTAM).
"At what Flight Level will your guys be flying at?", and "When exactly will they be coming over Boggington-in-the Marsh?" were typical.
(Shouldn't complain really. At least they read the NOTAM).

Each of us has their own concept of what is important. Recently, stude in front seat on short finals with the intention to demonstrate his landing skills. Nicely set up. Hedge about to be crossed. Stude's mobile phone rings. Stude takes call.
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Old 8th Sep 2014, 23:33
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Kamikaze XC Pilot

Well, he's highly experienced and sometimes overoptimistic

If you don't land out, you're not trying

He did the test flight on a glider down for repair for over a year and went charging off while I wasn't finding anything that encouraged me to need finding another thermal to get home. The radio announced his landout a few miles down the road. Having enough altitude by then I did a flyover to find out where to bring the trailer.

We were talking on the radio and I let him know I'd get the trailer. On downwind the phone rang and I let him know I was busy

Then the phone ringed on short final It was ignored until I came to a stop and I returned the call to another glider pilot.

Some weeks later, we were both in the air and able to get away, but not very far. He landed out 40 km away. This time I had suggested he have the trailer hitched before swanning off -- the right trailer was hooked up the second try after I suggested he check the reggie on the trailer

Last edited by RatherBeFlying; 9th Sep 2014 at 02:27.
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Old 9th Sep 2014, 08:23
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Mobile phones are obviously a mixture of good and bad for land outs

One of the most dangerous things in aviation is distraction !

I had the 'privelige' of twice landing out within sight of a gliding airfield

The first was in a valley - my plan was to land uphill near the top - then trickle up to the top and end up on the fairly flat top field very close to a house and phone !!
Anyway on short final I realised that I did not have enough speed for the uphill flare so had to lower the nose a smidge - resulting of course in a slight undershoot - which meant I ended up parked facing uphill with the problem of getting out of the glider (libelle) whilst keeping the wheelbrake on , I cannot remember how i achieved that but it was a good fun lateral thinking exercise LOL.
Anyway I turned the a/c across the slope and went to visit the two elderly ladies in the house for tea and cake !
'Where did you crash ? ' - they asked because we could not see the glider - all good fun and the very next day I had the satisfaction of retrieving the guy who came to pick me up - although to be fair he did make it to the airfield rather than a remote hoose !
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Old 9th Sep 2014, 09:05
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My first cross country and silver c attempt ended up with me landing out less than 4km away from Dunstable near Ivinghoe beacon which I thought I could slope soar as model gliders were doing so. But all I got was reduced sink. My paddock at the foot of the beacon was then chosen at the last moment and was small with a cross slope and was in view of all instructors and the CFI getting aerotowed up. It was a long and ignomous wait for the trailer. it could have been worse as I've heard stories of landings inside whipsnade zoo!
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