Aircraft Parts from US
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Aircraft Parts from US
Hi Everyone,
I was hoping to get some guidance from other light aircraft owners on purchasing from the US. I have a Cessna 172 which is in need of some loving care inside and out.
I have been looking into doing the interior myself and found couple of sites where parts look reasonably well priced and decent quality. I was hoping someone could give me some guidance on whether they have purchased from any of these guys from the UK and whether / how you get CAA certification?
Seats, Carpets and possible panels from hangar Bay.
Interior Kit (Panels, fairings etc) from Selkirk Aviation.
Instrument Panel from AircraftPanel.com
Im new to ownership so any input is greatly appreciated.
Also welcome any other recommendations - these are just places I have found on the web.
Thanks
I was hoping to get some guidance from other light aircraft owners on purchasing from the US. I have a Cessna 172 which is in need of some loving care inside and out.
I have been looking into doing the interior myself and found couple of sites where parts look reasonably well priced and decent quality. I was hoping someone could give me some guidance on whether they have purchased from any of these guys from the UK and whether / how you get CAA certification?
Seats, Carpets and possible panels from hangar Bay.
Interior Kit (Panels, fairings etc) from Selkirk Aviation.
Instrument Panel from AircraftPanel.com
Im new to ownership so any input is greatly appreciated.
Also welcome any other recommendations - these are just places I have found on the web.
Thanks
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Terry, you do not mention under which regime your aircraft sits, N reg, or G reg. It can make quite a difference.
It also appears that a lot of the potential purchases are cosmetic. Therefore you need to ensure that all parts are covered by fire certificates, STC, or 8130 papers. You also need to look out for shipping and UK import tax, duty and where applicable VAT.
Again, if considering airframe parts from the States, attempt to get parts from a break up, where log book entries can be tracked back to the original serial number, or airframe. Even getting the registration can give traceability.
I have not used these particular outfits, however, have purchased quite a bit from US suppliers, call them and discuss, do not just buy on line. Also track down breakers, the States has a number, and they can be type specific. These are a good source of parts, and the guys involved are in general very knowledgeable and can help you a lot.
Also be prepared that when you receive certain parts, they may not fit. I bought a carpet once, for the serial number of my plane, and it did not fit. 600 dollars later.....Good luck
It also appears that a lot of the potential purchases are cosmetic. Therefore you need to ensure that all parts are covered by fire certificates, STC, or 8130 papers. You also need to look out for shipping and UK import tax, duty and where applicable VAT.
Again, if considering airframe parts from the States, attempt to get parts from a break up, where log book entries can be tracked back to the original serial number, or airframe. Even getting the registration can give traceability.
I have not used these particular outfits, however, have purchased quite a bit from US suppliers, call them and discuss, do not just buy on line. Also track down breakers, the States has a number, and they can be type specific. These are a good source of parts, and the guys involved are in general very knowledgeable and can help you a lot.
Also be prepared that when you receive certain parts, they may not fit. I bought a carpet once, for the serial number of my plane, and it did not fit. 600 dollars later.....Good luck
Last edited by maxred; 6th Nov 2012 at 19:43.
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Aircraft Parts from US
Further to what maxred said:
You need to check that it has 8130 paperwork or EASA form 1 dependant on aircraft registration.
Also don't forget fire certs are a must have. If they do not have them are places that you can send samples of the material for testing and providing they pass then certs will be provided but I think this can be costly and effective. It may be worth getting a quote from a aircraft re trimming firm that can provide and certify all this for you.
Where abouts are you located Terry out of interest?
You need to check that it has 8130 paperwork or EASA form 1 dependant on aircraft registration.
Also don't forget fire certs are a must have. If they do not have them are places that you can send samples of the material for testing and providing they pass then certs will be provided but I think this can be costly and effective. It may be worth getting a quote from a aircraft re trimming firm that can provide and certify all this for you.
Where abouts are you located Terry out of interest?
Last edited by Beech_Boy; 6th Nov 2012 at 19:43.
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Yep, where you will be caught out if it does not all match up is your first annual, or ARC. All mods, upgrades, must be accompanied by the relevant paperwork, and log book entries are a must. If you ever come to sell, or change regime, the omissions from logbook will be a show stopper.
I also think that engaging a fit out company, or an AP, or IA, would greatly assist. Always remember it is the paperwork that is the real gotcha.
I also think that engaging a fit out company, or an AP, or IA, would greatly assist. Always remember it is the paperwork that is the real gotcha.
Last edited by maxred; 6th Nov 2012 at 19:48.
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Thanks for the replies. It is a G reg Reims Cessna F172N based in Yorkshire.
Im not wedded to the US if there are places in the UK that can offer DIY kits or reasonable price interior refurbishments, main reason for looking at the US places is on a web search no where comes up in the UK and I was thinking of DIY to keep the costs down.
Coming from US are they likely to have EASA certifications, can you get these yourself if not? I am happy to sort necessary paperwork - providing it doesnt end up making any cost saving none existent.
Any recommendations on UK firms?
Thanks
Im not wedded to the US if there are places in the UK that can offer DIY kits or reasonable price interior refurbishments, main reason for looking at the US places is on a web search no where comes up in the UK and I was thinking of DIY to keep the costs down.
Coming from US are they likely to have EASA certifications, can you get these yourself if not? I am happy to sort necessary paperwork - providing it doesnt end up making any cost saving none existent.
Any recommendations on UK firms?
Thanks
Last edited by terryp; 6th Nov 2012 at 19:51.
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Well if purchasing from a dealer, and they are certified Cessna parts, they will come with the certified EASA STC.
Now, this is where a can of worms can potentially open up. There are strict standards on fire certification for carpets, and upholstery, and you really have to enquire if parts being purchased, conform.
It can be an expensive mistake, if it goes wrong.
I am sure there are shops in the UK which would be glad to quote, try Eastern at Sturgate, or google aircraft fit out shops UK. You might be surprised at the cost effectiveness of getting someone to do it for you, and you could pick what bits you could do, with their input and or advice.
Now, this is where a can of worms can potentially open up. There are strict standards on fire certification for carpets, and upholstery, and you really have to enquire if parts being purchased, conform.
It can be an expensive mistake, if it goes wrong.
I am sure there are shops in the UK which would be glad to quote, try Eastern at Sturgate, or google aircraft fit out shops UK. You might be surprised at the cost effectiveness of getting someone to do it for you, and you could pick what bits you could do, with their input and or advice.
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I am not sure to what extend you intend to shop, and what parts etc.
But Aircraft Spruce has supplied me with a lot of stuff, shipping it overseas; just like you will.
Good service, and so far 100% satisfied with the (many!) products I purchased!
I won`t post a link.........not sure if that`s allowed!
###Ultra Long Hauler###
But Aircraft Spruce has supplied me with a lot of stuff, shipping it overseas; just like you will.
Good service, and so far 100% satisfied with the (many!) products I purchased!
I won`t post a link.........not sure if that`s allowed!
###Ultra Long Hauler###
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One thing to think about is recovering seats in leather. The flammability requirements for fabrics are so tough that they cost more than leather which is naturally fireproof and doesn't emit noxious fumes.
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Well if purchasing from a dealer, and they are certified Cessna parts, they will come with the certified EASA STC.
If you buy from Cessna, then the parts will come with an 8130 from Cessna. Original parts from the original manufacturer. Simply fit and forget.
Some of these suppliers you quote might be approved under the FAA PMA system. EASA issued guidance on the use of PMA parts years ago but there is still a lot of confusion about using these parts and if you need an STC. For interior plastics, you don't need an STC.
What you might need for a new interior is an EASA approval for a Minor Change. You will need burns certificates (and the FAA certificates are not always accepted by EASA. The FAA don't accept EASA ones). Most of the interior outfits are not approved so cannot work on your aircraft without the supervision of an engineer or Maintenance Organisation.
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Anything that involves regulation is always wonderfully clear as mud 
So I have spoken with one of the companies and they inform me they have an STC and that it already has the Reims model listed on it.
So I did some digging on EASA web site and it states "An application from a non-EU organization for the EASA validation of a non-EU STC. The application must be made in accordance with any Working Arrangement or Bilateral agreement. In the case of STCs issued by the FAA, for example, the STC holder must make the applicaion via the FAA Aircraft Certification Office (ACO) that did the original approval."
To add confusion this is a Reims Cessna not a US Cessna
EASA site says...
"How does EASA deal with STCs on Reims-built Cessna models?
STCs approved on US-built Cessnas and their applicability to Reims-Cessna models
Reims-Cessna was a French company that manufactured US-designed Cessna aircraft under licence. These included the F150, F152, F172, F177, F182, F337, F406 and their variants. These aircraft were identical to the US-built aircraft but the French aircraft were given DGAC Type Certificates. For this reason, FAA STCs approved for US-built Cessna models do not formally apply to Reims-Cessna models; this also applies to validated STCs. However, because the Reims-Cessna aircraft are identical to the US-built aircraft, and because there is no technical investigation necessary to extend the applicability of STCs to the French-built aircraft, EASA can extend the grandfathered approval to Reims-built aircraft but the approval has to be legally recorded. The mechanism that is used is the minor change, even if the modification would normally be classified as STC (ie, a major change). The applicant should apply on an EASA Form 32 referring to the FAA STC and its EASA grandfathered approval in the application."
So does that mean I need to get an STC approved or I just need a Form 32?
So I have spoken with one of the companies and they inform me they have an STC and that it already has the Reims model listed on it.
So I did some digging on EASA web site and it states "An application from a non-EU organization for the EASA validation of a non-EU STC. The application must be made in accordance with any Working Arrangement or Bilateral agreement. In the case of STCs issued by the FAA, for example, the STC holder must make the applicaion via the FAA Aircraft Certification Office (ACO) that did the original approval."
To add confusion this is a Reims Cessna not a US Cessna
EASA site says...
"How does EASA deal with STCs on Reims-built Cessna models?
STCs approved on US-built Cessnas and their applicability to Reims-Cessna models
Reims-Cessna was a French company that manufactured US-designed Cessna aircraft under licence. These included the F150, F152, F172, F177, F182, F337, F406 and their variants. These aircraft were identical to the US-built aircraft but the French aircraft were given DGAC Type Certificates. For this reason, FAA STCs approved for US-built Cessna models do not formally apply to Reims-Cessna models; this also applies to validated STCs. However, because the Reims-Cessna aircraft are identical to the US-built aircraft, and because there is no technical investigation necessary to extend the applicability of STCs to the French-built aircraft, EASA can extend the grandfathered approval to Reims-built aircraft but the approval has to be legally recorded. The mechanism that is used is the minor change, even if the modification would normally be classified as STC (ie, a major change). The applicant should apply on an EASA Form 32 referring to the FAA STC and its EASA grandfathered approval in the application."
So does that mean I need to get an STC approved or I just need a Form 32?
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You could spend a lot of money on parts only to find the person who inspects your aircraft for the next ARC refuses to sign it off. It happens.
One problem you face is that EASA will not allow you to validate an FAA STC. In my experience, EASA will only accept an application from the firm that already holds the FAA STC.
If you are new to ownership, you would be better going to a good maintenance outfit and asking them for help.
One problem you face is that EASA will not allow you to validate an FAA STC. In my experience, EASA will only accept an application from the firm that already holds the FAA STC.
If you are new to ownership, you would be better going to a good maintenance outfit and asking them for help.
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In my experience, EASA will only accept an application from the firm that already holds the FAA STC.
This has been an issue for years.
It's a pure restrictive practice, set up to support EASA Part 21 companies and to enable them to generate EASA STCs and retain the intellectual property on those STCs.
terryp
We bought a complete seats/interior leather/fabric set for our Cessna from 'airtexinteriors' in USA. All fitted beautifully. FAR fire approved in USA,, but we had a sample tested in UK no problem.
(A local car interior repair shop fitted them in half the time and half the cost of the local airfield. Signed off of course by an appropriate person)
(A local car interior repair shop fitted them in half the time and half the cost of the local airfield. Signed off of course by an appropriate person)
Last edited by cessnapete; 7th Nov 2012 at 14:45.
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You fly from Sherburn don't you Terry, there's a bloke who's incredibly knowledgeable on everything it seems, and he's always happy to help anyone out! Although the information from the people on here isn't too shabby either!
Cheers, Jim
Cheers, Jim
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“If” I was buying parts for an EASA-type, EU registered aircraft from the USA, then I would think about
• Buying from someone with FAA PMA approval. (Airtexinteriors are PMA approved, the suppliers TerryP has given in his post are not.) PMA parts are accepted by EASA without an STC if they are not “critical” parts.
• Making sure the part numbers are the same as the Cessna ones (this is important because you can only fit something with the part number shown in the Cessna Parts Catalogue).
• Getting 8130’s for everything
• Getting burn certificates.
And before I parted with my cash, I would check the engineer who is going to sign off the work and the company who looks after the ARC that the parts are going to be acceptable to them.
The instrument panel is a problem. In FAA land, this is easily (level of easy depends on FSDO and the Inspectors therein) dealt with under a field approval for which EASA does not have an equivalent. The EASA Minor Change will not get you approval of a new FAA STC and EASA will almost certainly think this is worthy of an STC rather than a Minor Change.
• Buying from someone with FAA PMA approval. (Airtexinteriors are PMA approved, the suppliers TerryP has given in his post are not.) PMA parts are accepted by EASA without an STC if they are not “critical” parts.
• Making sure the part numbers are the same as the Cessna ones (this is important because you can only fit something with the part number shown in the Cessna Parts Catalogue).
• Getting 8130’s for everything
• Getting burn certificates.
And before I parted with my cash, I would check the engineer who is going to sign off the work and the company who looks after the ARC that the parts are going to be acceptable to them.
The instrument panel is a problem. In FAA land, this is easily (level of easy depends on FSDO and the Inspectors therein) dealt with under a field approval for which EASA does not have an equivalent. The EASA Minor Change will not get you approval of a new FAA STC and EASA will almost certainly think this is worthy of an STC rather than a Minor Change.
