Atlantic Crossing & Ferry Flight Insurance
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Atlantic Crossing & Ferry Flight Insurance
Bitte,
Rules and regulations for crossing the Atlantic. SEP(A). Routing Vagar, Reykjavik, Narsarsuaq (or Nuuk) to Goose and onward into the US to where the aircraft will reside.
Aeroplane is on the N register.
I am FAA CPL/IR.
Horst.
You know it.
Rules and regulations for crossing the Atlantic. SEP(A). Routing Vagar, Reykjavik, Narsarsuaq (or Nuuk) to Goose and onward into the US to where the aircraft will reside.
Aeroplane is on the N register.
I am FAA CPL/IR.
Horst.
You know it.
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Have you checked the AIPs for the different countries...?
Canada, Denmark (Greenland), Iceland, UK
Most, if not all, will be available from the Eurocontrol site. EUROCONTROL - The European AIS Database: Introduction to EAD Basic - Home Look for an application called PAMS light.
Canada, Denmark (Greenland), Iceland, UK
Most, if not all, will be available from the Eurocontrol site. EUROCONTROL - The European AIS Database: Introduction to EAD Basic - Home Look for an application called PAMS light.
Check the rules bit of the Jepp ATL1/2 chart which you will need anyway. Some very useful data. Its not all about flight planning amd customs, make sure you have the survival stuff well covered. Greenland is a very lonely, cold place with limited comms and serious terrain.
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Probably the single most important thing is establishing an insurance strategy. Generally the US insurers don't insure out of North America and the European ones don't insure in the US.
Your insurer will probably require you have previous accompanied experience with the crossing (or a suitable briefing - and they will define what suitable is). Your companion or the briefing provider will provide insight into what needs to be done. But from a basic planning perspective there is nothing particularly complex.
Transport Canada apparently used to have a lot of rules on survival equipment - but this is broadly now left to your judgement for a private flight.
Note - the US has just recently introduced a requirement to electronically submit pilot and passenger details prior to departure for a flight into US airspace.
Your insurer will probably require you have previous accompanied experience with the crossing (or a suitable briefing - and they will define what suitable is). Your companion or the briefing provider will provide insight into what needs to be done. But from a basic planning perspective there is nothing particularly complex.
Transport Canada apparently used to have a lot of rules on survival equipment - but this is broadly now left to your judgement for a private flight.
Note - the US has just recently introduced a requirement to electronically submit pilot and passenger details prior to departure for a flight into US airspace.
the bureaucracy is the easy bit!
Hi,
Did this flight about 6 months ago, I understand others had an epic with insurance, but I got cover with (at the time):
FAA piggyback ppl
Less than 150 hours fixed wing
80 hours tailwheel, 20 on type (Maule MX7)
no night, IR or, indeed, anything else
I paid a surcharge of Eur500 for the crossing! That was full risk. Try Finserve (www.finserve.be) but you might need to tell them that you live in Belgium!
For the rest, in short:
Weather
Weather
I had no documentation check at any stage from Texas to Denmark!
Weather
It's a great experience, and it is way easier than you are expecting, Sam
The only caveat, if it goes wrong, it goes REALLY wrong
Did this flight about 6 months ago, I understand others had an epic with insurance, but I got cover with (at the time):
FAA piggyback ppl
Less than 150 hours fixed wing
80 hours tailwheel, 20 on type (Maule MX7)
no night, IR or, indeed, anything else
I paid a surcharge of Eur500 for the crossing! That was full risk. Try Finserve (www.finserve.be) but you might need to tell them that you live in Belgium!
For the rest, in short:
Weather
Weather
I had no documentation check at any stage from Texas to Denmark!
Weather
It's a great experience, and it is way easier than you are expecting, Sam
The only caveat, if it goes wrong, it goes REALLY wrong
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At that stage of my flying I thought I had done rather well crossing the channel.
I have read your blog and I stand in respect.
This should be a real encouragement to all those wondering what to do post ppl. Few of us I suspect will do this crossing but I think some of that old aviation spirit of adventure exists in those who do.
EB.
I have read your blog and I stand in respect.
This should be a real encouragement to all those wondering what to do post ppl. Few of us I suspect will do this crossing but I think some of that old aviation spirit of adventure exists in those who do.
EB.
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An important source of information is North Atlantic Program Coordination Office.
quick 'correction'
I only mention my fixed wing hours because that's all the insurance were interested in, but I had 1500 hours rotary at the time (although no licence).
So, a lot more experience than 250 hours!
That being said, the most 'difficult' bit is once you hit Europe. Until then:
Navigation is straight line
No comms
No airspace
No other traffic
etc. etc.
If you have the weather right, and your engine keeps running (!) then it is really quite simple (although it DEFINITELY doesn't feel like that at the time, and getting the 'the weather right' is not clear-cut!).
So, a lot more experience than 250 hours!
That being said, the most 'difficult' bit is once you hit Europe. Until then:
Navigation is straight line
No comms
No airspace
No other traffic
etc. etc.
If you have the weather right, and your engine keeps running (!) then it is really quite simple (although it DEFINITELY doesn't feel like that at the time, and getting the 'the weather right' is not clear-cut!).
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Ferry Flight Insurance
Hi there, anyone had any dealing in obtaining ferry flight insurance for a north atlantic crossing. My own company require you to have made 5 crossings before they will consider it? seems Bazaar! They will insure the aircraft no problem once it lands but wont cover the ferry flight. I have an IR rating and the aircraft is certified FIKI so dont see any real issues but such is life. Any pointers will be welcome.
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Sam gave some info on this thread here: http://www.pprune.org/private-flying...d-stewart.html
You might want to contact him directly.
You might want to contact him directly.
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Ferry Insurance
I have just been in this situation. My ferry pilot had done the requisite number of 5 single engine crossings but they would not count a further 16 twin engined crossings and they would not insure if only Twin Crossings had been made. Bizarre again.
As someone else was taking the risk I was obliged to pay the premium and so I ended up paying 1000 euros for the ferry flight from Canada to the UK. The journey took three days.
If I was doing the trip myself I would not have bothered. If I crashed then I would more than likely have gone down with the ship and being single no one else to support.
As someone else was taking the risk I was obliged to pay the premium and so I ended up paying 1000 euros for the ferry flight from Canada to the UK. The journey took three days.
If I was doing the trip myself I would not have bothered. If I crashed then I would more than likely have gone down with the ship and being single no one else to support.
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The only two things I have heard of being checked in Iceland is that you have an IR (if as most people do you go IFR) and that you have the SAR insurance which (when I did it) was mandatory.
All of the insurers I spoke with had pretty consistent policy that single engine crossings were a different experience than twins, hence only single engine crossings counted towards the experience requirement. I have read blogs from people who have gotten insurance after going through a training programme 'approved' by the insurer.
All of the insurers I spoke with had pretty consistent policy that single engine crossings were a different experience than twins, hence only single engine crossings counted towards the experience requirement. I have read blogs from people who have gotten insurance after going through a training programme 'approved' by the insurer.
Last edited by mm_flynn; 20th May 2009 at 16:23.
Be aware that Transport Canada is currently insisting (as per regs) on carriage of HF radio through Gander airspace unless you :
1) fly at FL250 or above;
2) avoid Gander airspace by routeing Sondrestrom-Iqaluit, for example;
3) fly VFR while oceanic below FL050, which, though legal, is not recommended.
VHF/Satfone is not enough.
Third-party insurance for a transatlantic trip is also mandatory.
1) fly at FL250 or above;
2) avoid Gander airspace by routeing Sondrestrom-Iqaluit, for example;
3) fly VFR while oceanic below FL050, which, though legal, is not recommended.
VHF/Satfone is not enough.
Third-party insurance for a transatlantic trip is also mandatory.
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Anyone doing on in the next times?
Im looking for a adventure like this, just flying to a nice isnt enough.
Will the insurance stop the idea of having one cpl has pic and one ppl safety pilot on board?
Im looking for a adventure like this, just flying to a nice isnt enough.
Will the insurance stop the idea of having one cpl has pic and one ppl safety pilot on board?
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Carrying a dinghy... what do YOU think?
Having done a few SE and ME crossings, I often wondered about the wisdom of carrying a dinghy. A few fellow ferry-drivers that I met in Iceland and Greenland decided against... because (they claimed) the chances of survival after ditching were near zero... even if you managed to inflate and get into the thing. Any ideas? Cheers bm.
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Always.
Remember reading somewhere that it's not just the cold that gets you, its how quickly you become cold (and wet).
And anyway, whats an extra few lbs between friends?
DD
Remember reading somewhere that it's not just the cold that gets you, its how quickly you become cold (and wet).
And anyway, whats an extra few lbs between friends?
DD
My concern about a dinghy is that getting it out of the aircraft is not going to be easy. But, if you have one, and get it out - you are much better placed.
The insurance is not interested in multiple pilots - they are only interested in the qualifications/experience of the PIC.
Good luck with finding a freebie trans-atlantic flight - join the queue!
If, though, you are prepared to pay a share of the costs then you might find someone who will want you along for the ride!
Safe flights, Sam.
The insurance is not interested in multiple pilots - they are only interested in the qualifications/experience of the PIC.
Good luck with finding a freebie trans-atlantic flight - join the queue!
If, though, you are prepared to pay a share of the costs then you might find someone who will want you along for the ride!
Safe flights, Sam.
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There are dingys and there are dingys and ditto survival suits
Be aware that your dinghy should be a North Atlantic dinghy with an insulated floor (to provide some protection from freezing cold sea) NOT YOUR RAFT FOR LE TOUQUET !
Also I have been advised that not all survival suits are the same so make sure you have an arctic survival suit.
Your odds on surviving a ditching will be a tad improved but still not great !
Be aware that your dinghy should be a North Atlantic dinghy with an insulated floor (to provide some protection from freezing cold sea) NOT YOUR RAFT FOR LE TOUQUET !
Also I have been advised that not all survival suits are the same so make sure you have an arctic survival suit.
Your odds on surviving a ditching will be a tad improved but still not great !