Sakura-Ichiban

Hi I am thinking of bringing a new 172 Skyhawk to the UK under N reg, would anybody be interested in sharing / renting it. I don't need to use it all the time and it makes sense to let other FAA certificate holders have access to an N reg. Anybody interested please leave a post

BroomstickPilot

Hi Sakura-Ichiban,

It all depends on where you propose to locate your 172.

If you are able to say where it will be kept, I am sure you will find people in that locality that will be interested.

Broomstick Pilot

Sakura-Ichiban

Hello and thanks for the reply. I am not sure of location yet, depends on job location, but it looks like in the middle of the UK Northampton area maybe. When I get more information I happy to let you know

BackPacker

Sakura-Ichiban, just a heads-up:

With the new EASA regulations coming in force, I have heard that the CAA has plans to modify the law so that keeping an aircraft on the N-register indefinitely while it is imported in the UK, would be impossible.

As I am not personally a stakeholder in this debate, I don't follow it closely, but you might want to search PPRuNe and the CAA website for the latest details before you commit to this plan.

IO540

Currently there is NO proposal to boot out N-reg planes from UK or Europe; France and the UK having pushed out and then abandoned such proposals in recent years.

However, EASA has published an extremely depressing consultation which (see pages 159-161) completely kills all foreign license privileges for European residents.

EASA is planning to honour foreign licenses in Europe only on the basis of a reciprocal treaty on mutual license acceptance, signed with each relevant country. The USA is IMHO most unlikely to amend FAR 61.3 or whatever to suit that little self-important place called Europe, so this proposal is basically a V-sign to America. One should never propose something from which the only way back is a humiliation so I don't really understand what EASA is trying to do here. They either "know" they will win, or they are happy to start a war with the corporate/bizjet population.

EASA is scheduled to publish another consultation mid September which will address foreign planes. I don't know of anybody who knows what this will contain. It could be OK or it could be another total disaster for European instrument pilots.

Sakura-Ichiban

Thank you for your post.
The aircraft will be temporarily in the UK, US law states that 60% flying time must be in the US, otherwise you loose the "N" During my time in the UK I will utilize the plane as much as I can, but that will only be perhaps 10 days a month. she is fully IFR so I am not limited to daytime flying.

Thanks

Ando Taro

IO540

Do you have a reference for this?

Fournier Boy

I'm with Back-packer - I'm sure I've read somewhere too a proposal for discontinuing support of N registered aircraft in any European state - before I do any more, let me do some diggin around to find where I read it. As soon as I do I will post the content with a referance.

FB

Cathar

I believe that Sakura-Ichiban is thinking about section 9 of Part 47 which applies to aircraft owned non-US corporations doing business in the US.

SoCal App

I believe this is what he is referring to:

US Federal law requires aircraft operated outside of United States airspace for more than 40 percent of their flying hours during any six calendar month period, to be "legally owned” and "registered" by a "Citizen of the United States."
FAR 47.9 refers.

However as a non citizen, that FAR won't be of much use to you.
Folks in the UK get around this by utilising a US Trust who effectively own the aircraft whilst you retain 'beneficial ownership'. The legal title to the aircraft is held by the trustee who has to be a US citizen.

The objective of the law is to ensure that ownership of U.S. registered aircraft is limited to U.S. Citizens. This is necessary for the United States to exercise legal jurisdiction over certain operations of its registered aircraft when they are operated outside of U.S. airspace.

The non US citizen is not the legal owner.

IO540

That is very interesting because it means that when you import an N-reg, or transfer a plane to N-reg, you don't have to put it in a U.S. trust for 6 months, doesn't it?

Are you sure SoCal the bit you quoted is the only relevant provision?

SoCal App

IO540
I'm no expert on this - I don't have to be!

As a non US citizen FAR 47.9 does NOT apply. A non US citizen /resident alien cannot legally own a N reg aircraft.
I believe that the importation part is the area where folks can get into legal trouble.
The new (non citizen) 'owner' does not have some months grace period.
As soon as the sale concludes, the registration changes ownership from the prior US owner to the new 'owner' who then wants to fly it or crate it over to the UK, that is the time that the UK 'owner' can be in violation of the Federal law - as he cannot legally own the aircraft and the aircraft has to be registered to somebody.

My understanding is that the trust should be set up before the aircraft is purchased and the trust be fully involved in the purchase and the aircraft put into that trust immediately as part of the purchase process. The trust company perform the registration filing with the FAA etc.
At no time can the non citizen own the aircraft.

The various trust companies are the best folks to advise on this.

Sakura-Ichiban

FAR Section 47.3
Requires that an aircraft is eligible for US registration only if it is owned by:
1.) A U.S. Citizen
2.) A permanent resident in the U.S (green card)
3.) A non citizen U.S corporation, if the aircraft is based and used primarily in the U.S. (this means 60% or more of it's flight time is in the U.S
There are other relevant sections dealing with trusts and trustee, FAR 47.11

Regarding the 60% rule, the FAA will track your aircraft every 6 months and monitor the use (Form 8050-117)

For my particular case this is ample enough time.

Regards

SoCal App

Out of interest how are you going to achieve that 60% usage for the aircraft to be primarily based in the US?
How are you going to do that AND achieve 10 hours a month in the UK as you suggested in your earlier post.

FAR 47.3 states:
(ii) owned by a corporation (other than a corporation which is a citizen of the United States) lawfully organized and doing business under the laws of the United States or any State thereof so long as such aircraft is based and primarily used in the United States